HI/O Show: Debating Price’s pummelling of Devils crease crasher Palmieri

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Should Canadiens goaltender Carey Price have taken matters into his own hands when the Devils’ Kyle Palmieri crashed into him during last Thursday’s 5-2 win over New Jersey at the Bell Centre? 

On this week’s Hockey Inside/Out Show, our panel — Gazette columnist Stu Cowan, former Canadien and TSN 690 radio host Chris Nilan, CBC Daybreak columnist Andie Bennett and host Adam Susser — discuss Price as well as these topics:

Did Tuesday night’s game reignite the Habs-Bruins rivalry?

Does Michel Therrien deserve more respect for guiding the team to the top of the NHL standings?

Should the Canadiens be concerned by the drop in Shea Weber’s offensive output?

And our viewer question of the week: Should the Habs re-sign Price after next season? If yes, would $9 million for six years get it done?

Be sure to subscribe to our Montreal Hockey Inside Out YouTube channel (youtube.com/user/HabsInsideOutVideos) for bonus content and send your HI/O Show question of the week to dpeters@postmedia.com.

And check out our spirited Canadiens-centred discussion every Thursday, exclusively at hockeyinsideout.com

This week’s HI/O Show:

218 Comments

  1. Un Canadien errant says:

    New thread.

  2. thesenator18 says:

    With Galchenyuk out there is no reason why McCarron should not be at least on the 2nd PP unit and standing in front of the net.

  3. habsr4ever says:

    Are we protecting Emelin in the expansion draft?
    Weber, Petry, and ?? N8 or Emelin?
    N8 has yet to show he can a 3/4 guy yet over an entire season.

  4. D Mex says:

    Just wanted to express appreciation for inputs received in response to my question yesterday about cars.
    There was an interesting comment about putting it out there to a hockey community but, hey, why wouldn’t you listen to people who are wise enough to follow the Habs ❓

    I’d have been surprised to read a horror story and, sure enough, there was nothing of the kind. Heading out for a pair of test-drives and yes, Mrs Mex will make the call. Again, thanks all ❗

    ALWAYS Habs –
    D Mex

    Support Therrien – vote Desharnais : https://www.nhl.com/all-star-ballot
    See the Therrien – Desharnais duet here : http://i.imgur.com/NoNJ3FV.gif
    Therrien / Lacroix / Pacioretty : All Desharnais ~ All the Time !

  5. AliHaba says:

    The scoring board? Who is this guy Susser?

  6. DDO_Habs_Fan says:

    It is way too early to speculate about Price’s future. Unless the Habs suddenly completely nose-dive out of a playoff spot (never happened before…LOL), the time to start speculating will occur one second after they are eliminated.,

  7. Habfan17 says:

    @ New

    You wrote ” The biggest rub is that defensively PK was playing his best year as a Hab last season, then he tried to do too much too often and hurt the team. I know that sounds harsh but remember, I’m not blaming PK. I’m blaming Therrien and JJ who could not settle PK down. Babcock at the Olympics, no, time is too short to get across to PK what is needed. Therrien though had four seasons. ”

    I only took this paragraph to discuss. You assume in this, that the coaches, and in a way, Bergevin, did not try over 4 years to get PK to learn and understand the benefit of working within the system, picking his spots, and the benefit to the attack, of moving the puck up quickly with a pass, rather than carry it up as often as he did.

    I think that many times we saw PK have t turn back, it was because he pulled a “Robyn Williams”, an ad-lib, and threw the others players off.

    I think the fact that Bergevin decided to bridge PK, and then ended up trading him, showed that he was resigned to the fact, that PK did not, and would not, make the adjustments necessary for the team to be successful. I don’t think it makes sense to lay this on Therrien and the other coaches. Some players think they know better and will not change.

    Habfan17

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      I think it was Mathieu Darche who scoffed when a RDS host was suggesting that maybe some Canadien team members or administration staff should have taken P.K. aside and tried to have a heart-to-heart with him, to make him see the light.

      “Oh, those were going on all the time, with Hal Gill, Marc Bergevin, Serge Savard, Josh Jorges, in planes, the dressing room, team dinners, …”

      • Habfan17 says:

        Thanks for the info! Leave it to the folks at RDS to make a lame comment. Was it on L’Antichambre by chance?

        Habfan17

        • Un Canadien errant says:

          Not sure it was a lame comment. I can’t remember if it was on L’Antichambre or Hockey 360, but the host was asking a genuine question to a former player who’s played with P.K., and often brings insight on the dynamics of the Canadiens of that period. And Mathieu is not a hater, he genuinely likes P.K., and says so openly.

          Most of us are only just learning that P.K., while he seems to be a fine young man, was a difficult bronc to break. We’re stumped why he didn’t ‘get it’.

          In that light, the host was asking what we all were, why didn’t someone sit down with him and explain the consequences, what effect his conduct was having on the team. I guess we’re even more stumped when we find out that this was done, over and over again.

          HIO asked that same question in its own negative and demeaning way, when it immediately screeched that the trade was clueless Michel Therrien’s fault because he ‘hates’ P.K., and he should have coached him properly.

          I’m not giving the head coach full marks on this, since when he took the job, he apparently stated to management and the team leaders that he’d take charge of P.K., he’d bring him around, but he failed at that. He and his boys, Jean-Jacques Daigneault, Gerard Gallant, Dan Lacroix et al, all of them, along with others, they never got through to P.K. that as successful as he currently was, he’d take it to another level if he worked with the team.

          But the idea that he had “thrown P.K. under the bus” with the ‘individualist play’ remark after the Colorado game, that these kind of statements should be done behind closed doors, that was off-base in my mind. It assumed that Michel Therrien never had this conversation, that P.K. had never heard this refrain, over and over again, and that this was just the escalation of that message, to try to get through to him.

      • Strummer says:

        Carey Price also intervened at the request of management but with no success either

        -Some folks really have trouble letting go of stuff, eh?-

        • Un Canadien errant says:

          Mathieu mentioned Carey specifically, on plane rides with P.K., having those heart-to-heart chats.

          Carey was very clear that while he liked P.K. as a person, he didn’t necessarily want to work with him anymore. He evidently felt it was time for a change, based on his comments to Elliotte Friedman about the trade.

          The real eye-opener for me was Andrei Markov, who can taciturn it with the best of them, and could have said something like “I’m just a player, I don’t make these decisions”, instead took the extra step of saying that “Management is only trying to improve the team”. Andrei also took care to explain that he liked P.K., that he enjoyed his time with him as a teammate and a partner, but that he had no qualms about the trade.

    • New says:

      The odd thing about all the folks alleged to have spoken to PK about whatever it was that needed to be said is PK still got the minutes. In Nashville (running about 3 points lower than last season but still wild carding it) PK may have the worst +- on the team but he still gets the minutes. Josi is twice the value offensively and defensively at this point in time, but gets less ice.

      Nashville needs an attraction to begin generating revenue rather than drawing revenue. PK makes sense. But PK is a very talented individual as wel although if you just want PP points Yannick Weber can get you those.

      In both cities though, for all the moaning about it being all on PK, he gets the minutes. So if he gets the money, and he gets the ice time, and his yap is on the cover of the advertising, how seriously exactly is a young man supposed to take a 30 second conversation about whatever from whoever? Gotta slide, GQ shoot, later.

      Teams will just use PK for what they can get. No one is interested in building PK into another Chelios or anything. Players get to build themselves. Which is why so few make it.

      One thing the NHL never runs out of is egos.

      • Habfan17 says:

        Even with his warts, PK needed to be played. It would hard to tell the fans that he wasn’t buying in and therefore was not getting ice time.

        That was one thing the team did well, not make it a public drama. Except for a few Therrien comments.

        I would have to guess that Bergevin et all were hoping that PK would get it. Just think of how much better he would be if he did!

        Habfan17

  8. HabinBurlington says:

    If MT were to read the following headline:
    http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/st-johns-icecaps/2016/12/15/13962344/icecaps-vs-senators-recap-lindgren-steals-a-point-for-st-johns-recap-ahl-habs-prospects

    Does this then make MT even happier that Lefebvre is coaching the team exactly in his image?

  9. vegas says:

    Price renewal is an interesting topic, he will be 30 when his present contract expires. Would you do Draisatl, Talbot and Nurse for Price?

    • DDO_Habs_Fan says:

      Of course. The Oilers won’t.

    • bwoar says:

      Not sure EDM does that at all. For sure I’d consider it.

    • Gerry Pigeon says:

      I’d take two of three for Price.

      It’s weird how I love Price, think he best exemplifies what I like to see in a Habs jersey (professionalism, humility, humanity, great performance), but am convinced that we’ve pretty much gotten as much as we can out of him already.

      Someone on the site recently posted that the job of a GM is to buy low, sell high. Well, Price’s value can’t get any higher than now. He’s giving the Habs another MVP season for the bargain basement cost of $6.5M. Going forward, his play can only go downhill while his salary goes up.

      • habsr4ever says:

        OR he can continue this play for 7 more years. We can trade him when he is 35 and still get a MAJOR return.
        BEST goalie in the NHL and one of the best overall in the NHL and so many people want to trade him. Shocking.
        Every single game we play our team has a chance to win because we have Carey Price. Not rocket science to give him a blank cheque and say you fill it in Carey. Thanks for wanting to stay here where over half the city wanted to trade you instead of Halak.

    • habsr4ever says:

      Nope.
      Not one of those players are franchise players. And the cap hit for all of these guys is more than Price. Habs don’t even think about this offer.
      Didn’t we learn this with the Pat Roy trade?

    • boing007 says:

      You betcha!

      Richard R

    • habsr4ever says:

      A number two centre. A number 3 or 4 dman. And about the 20th best goalie in the league for a FRANCHISE goaltender and arguably the BEST player in the NHL? Sorry – not a chance habs make this trade.

      • vegas says:

        Galchenyuk / Draisatl / McCarron and Danault down the middle
        with
        Sergachev / Nurse and Beaulieu on the Left and Webber / Petry and Juulsen on the right

        Along with Talbot and Lindgren in nets

        would sure look sweet

  10. 25soonenough says:

    watching the Sharks vs Sens game last night, as much as San Jose is a good possession team with large bodies they are also very very slow. They had a five minute power play and didn’t generate a single scoring chance. The Habs should have beat the pants off them out West, and will tmrw night in my opinion. The games in California always come with a sense of doom considering our record in those buildings, tomorrow night the Sharks get a taste of Montreal’s home cooking and it won’t go well for them.

    –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

  11. HabinBurlington says:

    The timing of the DD injury is bizarre. From my twisted perspective there was one position DD can be somewhat effective for the Habs – an injury replacement player for Chucky should he get hurt.

    The strengths of DD’s game are such that he is most effective playing top line center with two very good wingers ie. Max and Radu. That within 1 game of Chucky getting hurt DD also went down to injury is bizarre.

    The problem for DD was that Chucky came around and finally made MT a believer in him being the number one center. This took away the one position DD was able to be somewhat effective. Any other role as a centerman on another line, or winger on any line becomes a miscast position for him.

  12. chilli says:

    To anyone suggesting trading Price as a good idea, the rest of us are all so thankful you don’t run the team.

    You trade the entire team before trading him.

    Pitts has 3 of the best offensive players on the planet in their lineup but it still took a rookie goalie to play like an All-Star for them to win. With no Murray last year and simply Fleury, they don’t win.

    Philly has been trying to solve goalie woes for 20 years. They are stacked.

    Same with Anaheim.

    Edmonton is stacked and would win the Stanley Cup now with Price in nets.

    The post Roy years hoping Hackett, Huet and Thibeault would do it for us were brutal.

    The goalie is the most important position on the team.

    Price retires a Hab the way Kobe retired a Laker.

    And then you pass the torch and rebuild.

    • Old Bald Bird says:

      Isn’t that part of the point: that a rookie goaltender was able to win it?

      • habsr4ever says:

        Yup – we have Crosby and Malkin in our pipeline of prospects AND they are on the UFA market to get too. AND they want to sign in Montreal over any other city in the NHL because we have the highest taxes in Quebec. We’ll get right on that. Fantasy play station stuff. I love it.

        • Old Bald Bird says:

          4ever, I don’t think you get the point. Or I don’t get yours.

          It has to do with the discussion down below about how much you’re willing to pay a goaltender. And in the playoffs on good teams is a great goalie that much better than a very good one? Sometimes great goalies only play good and sometimes good goalies play great.

          • habsr4ever says:

            You have a franchise player. You pay him and keep him. Just cuz ours is a goalie – makes no difference.
            And yes I understand your point. We all have our opinions and beliefs. We just have to agree to disagree. I’ll take my Cup chances all day long with the best goalie on the planet. We all saw what a disaster our team was with Condon (who can get HOT) last year. If we had a pipeline with some high end offensive forwards and we had low taxes in Quebec to actually maybe land some UFA’s of significance – I would listen a bit more to your point but with our team and our prospect pool – our bed is made with Carey Price. Blame team success for the lack of prospects over the years. Here is a blank cheque Carey – you fill in the amount please. We are happy you want to stay here and play here.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Ahem…

      “Price retires a Hab the way Ken Dryden retired a Canadien.”

      • Gerry Pigeon says:

        I think it was RN that said we have too many sacred cows around here 🙂

        I love Carey, and he’s the Franchise. Wonderful leader, decent human being. Am proud to see him in a Habs jersey.

        But I love our Habs more than one player, and I can’t get my head around the idea that keeping him is for the best, long run interests of the team…

        We’ll see if I’m right or wrong in the next few years. I doubt he’ll actually be traded. But I also doubt MB can find the pieces to help Carey win the Cup, given what’s in the pipeline now.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          Retiring the way Dryden retired a Canadien means a crapload of cup victories. 🙂

          • Gerry Pigeon says:

            lol 🙂

            I’d be ecstatic to be wrong if Price was the Conn Smythe winner a crapload of times on the way to multiple Cup wins.

            As I get older, I think I’d appreciate that a lot more than when I was young, and EXPECTED Cup wins every year.

            Crap, I’ll take ONE more Cup at this stage 🙂

    • Gerry Pigeon says:

      🙂

      I agree with many of the points you make, and with many of the points others have made when they reply to my idea.

      But I think we’re talking about subtle differences that make a world of difference.

      I’m not arguing that having Price in the net doesn’t help. Of course it helps, he’s great.

      I’m saying this team has no offence, and we can’t actually win games 0-(-1). With Price’s knee (singular, don’t be sloppy…) and age concerning me, and a potentially huge payday looming, I think we have two choices to choose from:

      1) hang onto Price, take a couple of runs at the Cup in the next two years, and then pay Price big bucks (say $10M for 6 years), assuming he wants to stay and isn’t injured by then.

      2) trade Price for offence, find a suitable goalie in the next few years to help.

      I just happen to think option 2 is the more likely one to keep this team competitive in the future. I look at option 1 and only see risk. Price gets injured, Price takes too much cap space, Price actually bolts!

      Even if Price stays healthy and takes as small a reasonable salary as possible (say $8.5M, same as Lundqvist), how do the Habs find offence with the cap restriction and not having Price as a trading chip? I don’t see that much offence in the pipeline now… How do you obtain it before Price gets too old to help with the Cup run?

      Given many have complained we don’t have enough top 6 forwards with real talent, that we can’t win OT games without Chucky, that we have many 3rd and 4th line players striving to play “the right way”, I’d say we’d actually have a shot at the Cup if those players were BIGGER. Then we could pound the crap out of teams and protect our goalie all the way to the Cup (Kings formula).

      But we’re small, supposedly speedy, and somewhat skilled. Well, if we’re going that route, then why not load up on offence, pay the forwards, not the D and goalie? The combination of just a few marquee offensive talents (Patches, Radu-love, Chucky), with a smaller lineup and one great goalie, doesn’t seem like enough to me.

      I’m all for keeping Price if someone can convince me how MB builds a Cup winning team in the next 1-4 years without moving him.

    • boing007 says:

      Edmonton needs more than just Price.

      Richard R

  13. DDO_Habs_Fan says:

    Anybody know what is the Habs PP% before and after Chucky’s injury? Too lazy to calculate it. Now that teams have finally figured out to cover Weber (duh), I am concerned the PP% will drop significantly since there other one-timer option is gone.

    • 25soonenough says:

      Weber had 19 goals last season, teams always try and take his shot away but somehow he gets it through. I’m sure he’ll heat back soon. Some have suggested he may be injured, if anything, he’s shooting far less so maybe his shoulder is sore. just speculating

      –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

      • DDO_Habs_Fan says:

        Maybe he’s injured (personally don’t like speculating). Actually what makes me laugh is that nobody ever made that excuse for the other guy when he went through a goal drought last season.

        • 25soonenough says:

          i try not to mention the other guy unless it’s completely necessary.

          –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

        • Old Bald Bird says:

          PK’s play in general didn’t suggest an injury. He led in points exerted a lot of energy.

          I think right now, it’s a PP problem in general. They find it very difficult to gain the zone, and then they seem to predictably try to feed Weber. It looks much like last year with PK.

          • 25soonenough says:

            we certainly have a better PP with Chucky as a serious weapon one-timing from the right circle. They need to adapt and use Lehkonen better in my opinion, he can really shoot and should be playing that half wall where Chucky plays.

            –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

    • BC (Because of the Cats) says:

      We were at slightly over 20% before Galchenyuk’s injury. Since then, we’ve scored one powerplay goal in 15 opportunities.

      “We gotta lotta dep.”

  14. DipsyDoodler says:

    Any guesses on where Bettman’s wheel of justice lands for the hit by Hoffman on Couture?

    IMO it is one of the most vicious hits I’ve seen in the NHL. If the league wasn’t run by mobsters it would be a one year ban.

    —–

    • HabinBurlington says:

      In watching this replay, why am I not surprised to hear Galley with his initial brilliant commentary, “I’m not sure he actually makes contact with the head”.

      If the minion Jack Edwards every stops working for NESN and the Bruins, Galley has done some great understudy work for the Sens preparing for that role.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3taRtajEQ4

      • habsr4ever says:

        Yup – Galley should not be allowed to work Ottawa Senator games when they are broadcasted Nationally. He is a true homer. When he works the Habs vs Sens games I almost have to put the tv on mute he is so bad.

      • Mavid says:

        He is truly unbelievable, I got home in time to see the third period..the stupid comments he was making just incredible that its allowed..when the Sharks goal was disallowed because it was off side (by a hair) he was just about giddy with delight..

        º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º

        Weed Wacker -and now Flamethrower Grandma Smurf

    • 25soonenough says:

      That was one of the cheapest hits i’ve seen by a complete weasel. Another reason to hate the Senators.

      –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

  15. fastfreddy says:

    Expansion question; after a team exposes it’s unprotected list of players and a player is selected by Vegas, does that original team get to remove a player from the list or are the players stuck there until Vegas is done?

    CH = Les Glorieux!!!

    • HabinBurlington says:

      1 player is the most any NHL team lose in the expansion draft.

    • B says:

      Vegas gets to pick one player (and one only) from each of the 30 other teams. 30 seems like a high number to me since the official roster size allowed is only 23 players

      https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-expansion-draft-rules/c-281010592

      –Go Habs Go!–

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        The 7 extra players will serve to make Vegas a stronger team, with depth in the AHL, or trade chips to barter with. They’ll have four days to do their draft, so they’ll have plenty of time to come up with a NHL roster, and the makings of a decent farm club, targeting the right players for that role.

        For example, they may look at the Canadiens, and decide that the unprotected players may not be everyday players in the NHL, might not sell tickets, but a Charles Hudon or Jacob de la Rose might be a player who can be a regular after more time in the AHL.

        • B says:

          I’m not sure that Hudon and de la Rose will be waiver exempt next season.

          Vegas could try to trade the extra 7 for picks and / or non waiver exempt prospects. If they have to wave some players to the AHL then there may be some bonus pluckage available for other teams.

          I noted that Vegas also gets slotted into the 2017 draft as if they finished 3rd worst.

          –Go Habs Go!–

          • HabinBurlington says:

            Vegas indeed is going to get some nice draft picks for “not taking” certain players on certain teams.

            Also find it more than a bit odd/curious/evil that the Vegas draft is not being done in a public manner. More room for some last minute shenanigans.

          • Un Canadien errant says:

            Agree Burli, don’t really understand why the expansion draft needs to take four days rather than one afternoon, and why it will be announced after those four days, rather than make a spectacle of it, that we can watch and agonize along with.

            Another thing that bugs me is that the NHL Gary Bettman is trying to have his cake and eat it too. You have to submit a minimum list of draft-eligible players, and Vegas will have a window to talk to UFAs-to-be before the draft and July 1, yet they’ve announced that they don’t want any backroom funny business between teams and players.

            Can you be more vague? If a player is a free agent, and his contract is expiring, he should have total autonomy to decide what he wants to do. If Vegas is allowed to call him before July 1, then let’s have the contracts end on that date. Let’s not have one foot in the boat and one foot on the dock.

            If Andrei Markov says he’s a free agent and he doesn’t want to play in Vegas, that shouldn’t mean that the Canadiens then must protect him. If Alex Radulov holds out until July 1, then re-signs with the Canadiens, that’s not against the rules, that’s actually the CBA.

            Las Vegas already received very favourable terms with respect to the protection list and the Amateur Draft. If we’re going to police every move a team makes that doesn’t fall in Vegas’ favour, why don’t we just give them a gun and allow them to rob each team outright.

          • Un Canadien errant says:

            @ B: Charles Hudon will no longer be waiver-exempt, but Jacob will be.

            http://habsprospects.com/waivers.html

            Generally, the players they’ll be allowed to claim don’t necessarily need to be waiver-exempt, there may be players they’ll think will be an important addition to their organization as a solid AHL’er with upside, yet who probably won’t get claimed on waivers coming out of training camp.

            I do suspect they’ll do as you say though, that they’d target players who fall in that sweet spot with more than two years pro and therefore expansion draft-eligible, yet still with waiver-exempt status. Like Jacob.

        • The Big E says:

          It will be interesting to see if Vegas approaches the draft as a ‘cap floor’ team trying to save money, or a ‘cap ceiling’ team spending as much as they can. We talk about exposing “expensive veterans” like Plekanec on the theory that Vegas wouldn’t take on such an expensive contract, but if the have “money to burn” and the desire to ice a competitive team right away, a good shut-down centre would serve them very well, and potentially be a good trade chip come the deadline next spring.

  16. CH Sam says:

    Sholi, Therrien could get sick and not show up for two weeks and nobody would notice. He plays the same system he has always known, and wont do adjustments vs other coaches. Im pretty sure those two games vs Tampa, as soon as MT left the room with his assistants, somebody got up and said “forget it, this is what we’re going to do” etc. The difference was night and day.

  17. 123456 says:

    Which NHL team has thus far allowed the fewest goals against – hint there are three better than the Habs.

    I think we’d expect the Wild – and they are tied for best with………… Blue Jackets – each at 57 goals against. Capitals are next at 61 and the the Price led Habs at 64.

    • J Haul says:

      The Habs rankings in a lot of these types of stats are skewed by the 10-0 loss, with Montoya in net. If that’s a normal game, les boys are likely leading that stat.

      The flip side is that their goal differential has been “corrected” with a 10-1 win of their own.

  18. DipsyDoodler says:

    The precedent for Price’s next salary will be Henrik Lundqvist. He signed at $8.5M for 7 years, two years ago. At the time he was one year older than Price will be when his contract comes up.

    Price will get the same offer adjusted for the change in the cap.

    So roughly $63M for 7 years, or $9M/year.

    The Habs have no choice but to make this offer.

    —–

  19. habsr4ever says:

    I am glad the panel agrees to re-sign Price.
    As I have said on here many a times – it is a no brainer.
    How much and how long – hhhhmmmm.
    Sure I guess maybe we have to go to $10 M but term hopefully stays at 6. Price is a team guy and leader – he knows he can’t take up too much cap space or he won’t win a cup. Just like Sid the Kid taking security – hopefully Price goes for $9 M times 6 or 7. Regardless – Carey – here is a blank cheque – let us know how much and we will sign it.

  20. HabinBurlington says:

    Based on todays practise lines, it’s looking like Big Mac could be playing tomorrow.

    #Habs practice lines:
    Pacioretty – Plekanec – Radulov
    Lehkonen – Danault – Shaw
    Byron – Mitchell – Gallagher
    Carr-Flynn-McCarron
    Andrighetto

    Edit: Here were the D pairings.

    John Lu ✔ @JohnLuTSNMtl
    #Habs practice D & G:
    Emelin – Weber
    Markov – Petry
    Beaulieu – Redmond
    Barberio

    • 25soonenough says:

      i liked the lines i came up with better, lol, but i ain’t the coach.

      –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      We gnashed our teeth last spring and summer at the surfeit of fifth-line puds and centres, how Phillip Danault was superfluous, but it looks like Marc Bergevin was right that having ‘too many centres’ is never an issue, they can slot in at wing but be available when needed. This was true even before the injuries occurred, when Torrey Mitchell and Phillip Danault on the same line provided a one-two right-left punch for faceoffs, whichever dot it occurred at.

      We lost two centres to injuries, after also swapping out Lars Eller this summer, yet we’re not bereft, Torrey and Brian Flynn just take a step up and take on more responsibility.

  21. Arnou Ruelle says:

    I don’t get the logic behind mgmt.. If the team sent Barberio and Andrighetto back to St. Johns, why are they recalling them again? What are these guys going to do here?

    • GrimJim says:

      Two reasons I can think of
      1) Cap space is registered with the league every day. So every dollar saved now means multiple dollars of extra cap space available at the trade deadline.
      2) Barberio and Andrighetto are right now in a waiver free zone that expires 30 days or 10 (I think) games after they were first called up. When that expires they have to be placed on waivers again if MTL wants to send them down. By sending them down Tuesday and recalling them Thursday MTL extends the timeframe.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Yup, they now have 11 days left on the roster before the 30 day limit kicks in.

        Also the team has to have a forward and dman available in case a player falls ill game day (flu etc.)

        • habsr4ever says:

          Ghetto can go as far as I am concerned. He is an ok 13th forward but we are small enough as it is.
          Barbs – we need depth on the blue line – so hopefully he doesn’t get claimed this time. If he does – ce la vi. Its not like he is a difference maker of any kind and there were reasons he wasn’t picked up the first time.

    • 25soonenough says:

      they sent them down because the Habs have three days off between games this week and St. Johns played last night so both players could play in the game. The game was in Binghamton so it makes sense. Ghetto had two points by the way and now has 22 points in 19 games. We need Barberio as a 7th D in case of injury and Ghetto is a very serviceable 13th forward in my opinion.

      –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

    • DipsyDoodler says:

      What they all said – plus, come time for rentals, the more savings throughout the season the bigger the cap you can take on.

      (ooops – GrimJim said this already)
      —–

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      The three reasons put forward by the esteemed members who’ve replied to you are the main reasons I believe.

      I’ll throw in the final consideration that the IceCaps are understaffed right now in terms of talent and experience. They’re touch and go to make the playoffs, so to inject Mark Barberio and Sven Andrighetto is a tangible improvement, a big boost in terms of how that team can play and its chances to win the game.

      I don’t think the IceCaps’ fortunes will ever be primordial in the Canadiens brass’ mind, but after four years of missing the playoffs, it’s got to be somewhat important. And since they were close geographically, it made sense to send the cavalry.

  22. Gerry Pigeon says:

    Trade Price.

    That’s not intentional baiting, or purposely trying to rile people. I honestly think that what’s best for the Habs going forward is to trade Price for an offensively gifted center.

    Price is 29 with bad knees, and his value now is sky high. Hawks and Pens have shown 5 times in the last 7 or 8 years, you can win the Cup without spending all your money on your goalie. In fact, they have spent their money on offence, not defence.

    Habs already have lots of $ tied up on D, with Weber making the most, and he’s not getting moved, nor is his contract expiring anytime soon. They can’t afford to give Price a big contract also, and have so much of their cap tied up in their own end.

    Despite scoring 15 goals against NJ and Colorado, when they needed goals vs. Boston, they were hard to come by. Let’s say Rads really is mercenary and plays the season out, looking to score big on his final contract in the NHL after the playoffs. Anyone think Molson and MB will be the highest bidders? I doubt it.

    That leaves Chucky and Patches to carry the offence, with Lehkonen and Gally to chip in. Anyone feel confident that offence is enough? Anyone think we need more?

    Trade Price for a young, gifted centerman to complement Chucky, take the scoring load off his shoulders, and distribute the offence around two lines.

    • habsfan0 says:

      And what goalie would you use to carry the Habs through 4 rounds of playoffs?
      Jaroslav Halak is not available,and, with all due respect to Montoya,I don’t think he fits the bill either.

      • Gerry Pigeon says:

        I am not prioritizing winning the Cup in the short window we have while Price is healthy and under a reasonable contract.

        I am prioritizing the long term competitiveness of our Habs.

        Agreed that trading Price for a center is an issue if it’s a multiple player trade and the goalie that comes back isn’t sufficient for a Cup run. But I think it’s a temporary setback, well worth adding a young, gifted center to complement Chucky for years and give the Habs a one-two punch up front like Crosby/Malkin, Toews/Kane. Kopitar/Carter.

        I know many won’t agree, say I’m throwing in the towel. It’s a nod toward risk management in a way. I don’t like the idea of going for all the marbles with this team this year and next, only to find we can’t afford Price at the end, and we have no ability to trade him for value cause his contract is up.

        In my mind, our team’s not that different from the Islanders that won 4 Cups in a row, but left the turnover of the roster until it was too late, and plunged the team to non-competitive depths for years afterwards. Difference is we’re not as good a team (no 4 Cup streak), and we won’t be as bad afterwards (I hope) if we lose Price for nothing. But I’d rather get what we need, what we’ve needed for decades, while we can. I really think it will set this team up for future success, or at least a good shot at it annually for several years to come.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Last season Pens had $6,378,333 of cap hit committed to goaltenders, the Habs had $7,075,000 committed to Condon/Price. This $600K player we will get better be a difference maker.

      • Gerry Pigeon says:

        You know Pens won the Cup with Murray in net, not Fleury.

        Fleury makes around $6M, Murray the remainder…

        Right now, Price makes reasonable money for someone so valueable.

        In two years, he’ll make astronomical money. At 31, with bad knees. And he can’t score.

        • 123456 says:

          ^ Oh I bet he can score – just has not been in the line-up as a forward.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          Well for starters you brought up the Pittsburgh example, it matters not that Murray was playing I am simply providing the actual cap hit which the Penguins carried in their Stanley Cup season. Small sidenote, Fleury was having statistically one of his best years ever when he got hurt late in the reg. season. Pittsburgh was extremely fortunate to have a good backup goalie grooming in the AHL at the start of the year. The Penguins themselves did not know at the start of the season that Murray was ready to deliver the goods he did. So to use them as an example of winning the Cup with a goalie whose caphit was under $1 million just doesn’t seem realistic.

          These bad knees (plural I see) of Price, are they just as awful as Markovs who hasn’t missed a game due to a knee injury when so many proclaimed his knees were also bad? Are they the same bad knees (again plural since clearly both of them are effed beyond belief) which had him playing as the starting goal for the best team in the world this past summer?

          I understand the concept of not wanting a goalie on a $10 Mill caphit. But this incredible fabricating of details at the expense of selling the concept seems a bit much for me.

          Last sidenote, Murray can’t score either so lets at least be fair and bash him equally.

          • Gerry Pigeon says:

            All good points.

            I don’t believe the argument I put forward is “incredible fabricating” to sell my concept, but do concede that contrasting to the Pens isn’t ideal, given they did spend money on Fleury, and he was having a good year up until injury. Also agree they were fortunate to have Murray in the fold, so goaltending does matter. Niemi, Crawford, Quick, Fleury, Murray, and Thomas. All played great when their teams won the Cup the last 8 years.

            When I look at Knob’s argument that in the playoffs, teams clutch and grab, games get low-scoring, and a good goalie helps, I can’t argue with that logic. But in the last eight years, Hawks and Pens won 5 Cups, Kings and Bruins won 3. If our Habs want to emulate Kings and Bruins, and ride goaltending to the Cup, we should become bigger and meaner, like the Cup winning Bruins and Kings were. If we’re more a speed and skill team like Hawks and Pens, then we should pay our forwards more, not our D and goalie. Seems to me Habs think they can ride a great goalie to a Cup with a small team and pop-gun offence. I’m thinking that’s unlikely.

    • knob says:

      One thing that I see every year is that when the playoffs start, the penalty calls diminish. This creates problems for the offensive types of players in that they are constantly slashed, hooked, mugged and tackled with few resulting penalties. I like our chances better with Price in net (assuming that he can raise his game come playoff time), even if he comes with a 10 million dollar price tag.

      We have seen a lot of goalies that most would consider middling goalies, catch lightning in a bottle and go on to win 16 playoff games. We have also seen a lot of teams, including these Habs with Price in net, lose because goaltending was just average.

      in all thy sons command

    • BJ says:

      Is Charlie Lindgren capable by the time Price is due? If yes than its a consideration but for at least (as an example) to Edmonton for Draisaitl, Nurse + +?.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Hey BJ hope you are well, saw your buddy Doug the other day. He just helped arrange for a good friend of mine to have Sittler come do a book signing at his bar this coming weekend. Doug is still aces as I’m sure he was when you guys worked together.

        Let’s hope Lindgren can be our Matt Murray, it sure is looking like Fucale is unlikely to pan out.

      • RUSTIE says:

        And 3 first round draft choices and a 2th and 3rd to boot.

        Joe Laplane

    • HabinBurlington says:

      I’ve got to give you props, you are living up to your Carrier Pigeon name in delivering the message of trading Price the past few weeks. 🙂

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Generally, I understand and agree with the concept that a team can better invest its funds on a premier forward rather than a goalie, if you have a decent journeyman available at a low cost.

      Trouble is, it’s hard to identify which are the cost-effective replacement solutions ahead of time. Ask Calgary with Brian Elliott. Ask Florida about James Reimer. Ask the Leafs about Jonathan Bernier, then and now.

      We see this every summer, a team ‘shores up’ its goaltending, only to go back to the well the next off-season.

      In that light, I think it’s worth it to pay top dollar for the top goaltender in the league. Don’t pay top dollar for a Top 15 goalie like Jimmy Howard or Cam Ward.

    • The_Rocket_Returns says:

      I’d be fine trading Price. But ther eturn would need to be immense — not just an offensively talented young center, but a potential 1/2 defenseman or first-line winger, plus a first rounder.

      Three elite prospects of whom is a can’t-miss center. That’s my price.

      … Koivu to Zednik to Kovalev …

  23. TSN690 via Therrien’s Presser, Price in goal vs Sharks, Montoya vs the Caps. Well I was looking for an excuse to drink pepsi Saturday, now I have it. Caps will eat us alive if Montoya kicks pucks into the slot and no one clears the mess.

    Price should start both. But hey Therrien is DaMan #Therrien4Jack2017

    Shane Oliver
    Sholi2000.com
    Custom Sports Figures
    @sholi2000
    Price vs Dryden
    January 31st, Win 258
    5 Feb, Win 259

  24. 4m3y2j says:

    jDoe sanyone else find it odd that Nilan bashes PK ?He certainly liked him prior to the trade?Sounds like some sour grapes.I did not see the HBO segment,will look at it.PK is really ascending in Nashville now,Weber is descending,interesting.I think the age difference will be a factor ultimately and that this is a long term win for Nashville.

    • Dust says:

      Even last year on his radio show he said Subban was causing a rift/separation in the dressing room. He also said last year that he put himself over the team.

    • BJ says:

      PK ascending with -10 and Weber descending +18? Thats a 28 point difference and would reflect in the points column. Montreal 2nd overall and Nashville 17th. Its a team sport first and Weber trumps PK on that count. PK is flashy but more often than kept his forwards waiting at offensive line and gave the opposites team D enough time to get to the puck first. This year is different, as we spend a lot of time in the offensive zone. Price has a lot to do with that when you consider his amazing puck handling skills. My 2 cents….

      • 25soonenough says:

        agree BJ. Pk was more about the brand PK76 than the crest on the sweater. That has never gone over well in Montreal. Weber is a team first guy and far better leader. This argument has to end soon. It’s tedious at best. PK is gone, people need to move on, run a hot bath, light some candles, whatever it takes to live with it.

        –Larry Robinson was my neighbor once….

        • The_Rocket_Returns says:

          Um, Nilan bashing PK was the guy who set this off.

          Funny how most of the people who can’t let go of PK are bashing him. And afterwards they tell everyone else, “You all need to let go of PK!”

          … Koivu to Zednik to Kovalev …

      • RUSTIE says:

        We would sooner have PK than Weber. PK is a lot more exciting. go PK go.

        Joe Laplane

  25. The_Rocket_Returns says:

    Also, a fantastic analysis of Toronto’s defensive system from Jack Han, who people might know from his coverage of the Habs on EOTP.

    https://theathletic.com/29885/2016/12/14/the-video-room-why-has-a-babcock-led-leafs-team-struggled-defensively/

    Would *love* to see someone do this for Montreal, for all three zones. Adds so much to appreciating the game.

    … Koivu to Zednik to Kovalev …

  26. Old Bald Bird says:

    I am probably the only guy in Canada who doesn’t think you should pay a goalie >$10 mil a year, even if it’s Jaybus Price. Actually, I think 9 mil is more than enough.

    • The_Rocket_Returns says:

      Let’s hope he’ll take 9 … but if anyone’s worth 11, it’s him.

      … Koivu to Zednik to Kovalev …

    • I look at it this way. As the NHL cap goes up, so do the salaries. It’s an odd balance where an economics major could explain it better 😆 Then you and I can hammer him 😉

      Every team’s franchise player is paid huge dollars. Ours won’t be any different.

      Shane Oliver
      Sholi2000.com
      Custom Sports Figures
      @sholi2000
      Price vs Dryden
      January 31st, Win 258
      5 Feb, Win 259

      • Old Bald Bird says:

        As much as we all love Price, I wish that our franchise guy wasn’t a goalie.

        I hope this doesn’t make me sound like a Price basher because I think he’s great. It’s just the position for me. I am not sure that I see a huge difference in the effect of a great goalie and a very good one — in the playoffs on a good team, I mean.

        • I hope Galchenyuk turns into our Franchise player! 100 points every season, for the next ten years. This team and their fans deserve it (been decades). They (we) pay big bucks to watch our team. A franchise 100 pt player would make everyone stop talking about coaches and their systems.

          OH and I can pick out a Price basher a mile away, usually they’re the ones with new accounts 😆 Banned on a Monday, sign up on a Thursday, fooling no one but themselves 😳

          You are Good To Go 😎

          Shane Oliver
          Sholi2000.com
          Custom Sports Figures
          @sholi2000
          Price vs Dryden
          January 31st, Win 258
          5 Feb, Win 259

        • habsr4ever says:

          But isn’t it nice to actually HAVE a franchise player on our team? When you have one – you keep him and you pay him. End of discussion.

    • bwoar says:

      You aren’t the only one. 9M a year for a goaltender is steep. 9M total is extravagant for starter & backup. It’s just too much of the cap… I’d consider it for Price but honestly that’s an imbalance.

    • Dust says:

      I think his cap hit will be 9 but it will be a contract where he will be making over 10 million in some of the years

    • Gerry Pigeon says:

      You’re not the only one. I’ve been posting trade Price comments for a while now.

      Not that I don’t love Price, and not that I don’t want to keep him. But our team need offence, has for a long time now. And I think that offence, not defence, wins Cups. Pens and Hawks have won 5 Cups in last 8 years, and their cap money goes to Crosby, Malkin, Toews, and Kane. They’ve had 4 different goalies win those 5 Cups.

    • 123456 says:

      I agree OBB – Love Price and there is no doubt he is great but approaching $10M is a lot… especially if there is significant term.

  27. The_Rocket_Returns says:

    So last night Marc-Edouard Vlasic speared Erik Karlsson.

    A cheap and dangerous play.

    Against a team that employs not one but *two* designated enforcers — Chris Neil and Mark Borowiecki.

    Remind me again how goons are effective deterrents?

    … Koivu to Zednik to Kovalev …

  28. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    @dust – just think Barberio and Redmond so far have been better. Pateryn is a solid depth guy to have.

  29. Old Bald Bird says:

    I thought this was the best HIO Show this year. It was longer than some and didn’t do extraneous comedy or on-the-street interviews. If you want to do that stuff, make it on top of the 15′.

  30. Sprague and Odie says:

    Price will receive in excess of $11M per year.

    If the Habs win the cup this year or next year, they will re-sign Price. If not they will let him go.

    The cap Price carries, and Weber too, eat up a lot of space for quality players. If Price remains, the farm system really needs to improve.

    Not an easy situation. They really need to win the big one.
    —————————–
    I was told that there was an award ceremony in Boston to honour Don Cherry – I thought about that for a brief moment and I replied: “For what? Too many men on the ice?”

  31. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    Once healthy, lineup I’d like to see:

    Patches – Chucky – Radu
    Lehkonen – Pleks – Gally
    Hudon – McCarron – Shaw
    Byron – Mitchell – Danult
    Flynn/DD

    Emelin – Weber
    Markov – Petry
    Beaulieau – Redmond
    Barberio

  32. PK Subban or Shea Weber. Lars Eller, or Andrew Shaw

    It does not matter with Price and Therrien’s roll four lines with the same system.

    The Habs would be top or parts thereof in the NHL. Why I come to that conclusion? See 2015, see 2014, see 2013, and see 2012. PK Subban was awesome in all those playoffs (lead the team every year), but last season he was a distraction? Nope, not buying it. If PK Subban selling his brand is enough to put an ENTIRE organization out of whack, then oh my, talk about getting off your game.

    It’s Over, but I’ll admit it, I am watching more Preds games (I watch all hockey teams, thank you Center Ice) because he is FUN to watch. I’m sorry, I like to be entertained, it’s why I love Carey Price so much. He’s fun to watch. Galchenyuk? Fun to watch. Weber on the Power Play? Fun to watch. Radulov and Galchenyuk is VERY fun to watch.

    Back on Track. I am hoping the real change with this team is in the playoffs. It’s where Therrien needs to out coach the opposition. If he attempts to play regular season hockey in the playoffs then we’re done……of course a .950 SA% can fix that too, but last I looked not many Stanly Cup Winners needed that?

    Over the years Burly and I have pointed it out many times, look back to when TB took it to us in the playoffs. Therrien tried to play his game to the Lightning, and we got destroyed, then he let the troops loose for two games, and we won, then went back to Therrien’s game and lost. That’s only one example of many.

    I’m just a bum with a white board, but hockey is hockey. I see my opponent, I study the players, and I play each line accordingly to who is on the ice. I’d like to see Montreal play like this. Individually I love our offensive players. I hate how they play on the ice, but hey we can’t have it all. Fans who just watch the game love it. I do not.

    Moving to Friday. I want the Sharks. They had a great week, Jones went back to back and like NHL radio’s Patrick O’Sullivan said yesterday, you want to win, play your goalie. These guys are highly trained athletes, and playing in back to back isn’t going to kill them otherwise none of them could play 16 games in the playoffs.

    I want Price in Friday/Saturday. Price has had three days’ rest, and then another two after the back to back. Montoya will be cannon fodder vs the Blue Jackets. 😳

    OH look it’s warming up, only -34°C (fr. -38)

    OT1: Now that Gallant is gone, I no longer follow the Panthers. You just know Gerard is laughing is butt off at their management. What a waste of a great coach.

    Shane Oliver
    Sholi2000.com
    Custom Sports Figures
    @sholi2000
    Price vs Dryden
    January 31st, Win 258
    5 Feb, Win 259

    • New says:

      Shane the problem with Montreal is behind the bench. I have a sneaking suspicion that PK respected one guy on the Habs big time. He got to watch the team fold whenever Price went down. He got to watch all his peers at the Olympics defer to Price. Price stood by him during his career and was a calming influence. Then Price went down and, IMHO, PK decided it was time he took the team and carried it to glory.

      I can remember dozens of times the team stalled at the opponents blue line waiting on that pass from PK that never came. How many times did you see PK skate a figure eight trying to beat an opponent one on one, and then lose the puck because no one does that more than once and gets away with it?

      The biggest rub is that defensively PK was playing his best year as a Hab last season, then he tried to do too much too often and hurt the team. I know that sounds harsh but remember, I’m not blaming PK. I’m blaming Therrien and JJ who could not settle PK down. Babcock at the Olympics, no, time is too short to get across to PK what is needed. Therrien though had four seasons.

      PK Subban is a great talent. To him money equates to worth and he wants to be in the limelight. He is by all appearances a fine young man, a skilled player, and with the right coaches can be a great and enduring name in hockey. Or he can be a Jeremy Roenick, quotable and forgettable.

      Young men need leadership and usually they look to a role model. Often the coach has to be the model. Stern, fair, but always with your best interests in mind. I am not sure that is the impression people have of Therrien, right or wrong. But it needs to be otherwise they will find a leader to follow to who knows where or what.

      • I so agree with everything you said. I never once thought of the Price factor vs PK. That could be so true. We all knew he was DaMan, but yes for sure. That was real eye opener for me. I lover being shocked by an opinion first thing in the morning. Thanks. 😎

        As for Therrien. If just one hockey player from this team sounded as if they actually gave a crap about the coach instead of the ol cliche quotes supporting everything god and country then I would lighten up on Therrien.

        All one has to do is listen to players who talk about coaches they want to play for. Just yesterday Foligno was on NHL radio and you could hear how impressed he was with John Tortorella. JOHN TORTORELLA, he even had me convinced that I was wrong about Torts.

        When the guys talk about our coach it’s always one thing and one thing only….”the system, and his way.”

        and lastly, “it’s on all of us.” 🙂 I guess I’m just too hard on leadership. It’s an Infantry thing, I know it 😆

        Shane Oliver
        Sholi2000.com
        Custom Sports Figures
        @sholi2000
        Price vs Dryden
        January 31st, Win 258
        5 Feb, Win 259

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Very good points as usual New, have thought the same about Price/PK for a while now.

  33. 123456 says:

    I didn’t see a discussion on Price’s price tag after next season – I really dislike the idea of anything approaching $10M per season for ANY player but I’m thinking that’s where it will go. I’d offer $9M per for 6 years, or $8M per for 8 years….. I know that won’t get it done but it’s a starting place.

    If you were GM what reasonable offer would you start with?

  34. bwoar says:

    “It’s a league wife epidemic and it’s sucking the entertainment value out of the game.”

    – Habsfan10912, down below

    ‘league wife epidemic’ made me laugh harder than it should have.

  35. bwoar says:

    FOOD post,
    Winnipeg has Canada’s first Jollibee! A Filipino fast-food joint. And they have spaghetti! For those in the city it’s on Milt Stegall Drive @ Ellice.
    https://www.facebook.com/FilipinoJournalFans/photos/a.105351921548.103336.7617866548/10154782925856549/?type=3&theater

    Can’t wait for the first bite of Chickenjoy.

  36. PK says:

    A view from in front of a TV screen:

    From out here, it didn’t look like Subban was the problem last year.
    The problem was a team called
    the Montreal Canadiens, the whole organization – top to bottom.

  37. HabinBurlington says:

    Barberio and Ghetto on their way back to Montreal.

    Аrpon Basu @ArponBasu
    Habs recall Andrighetto and Barberio, they will be at practice today
    9:41 AM – 15 Dec 2016

    According to the fine folks at HEOTP both guys Clock have 11 days left on the roster before they will require Waivers in order to be sent down.

    http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/st-johns-icecaps/2016/12/15/13967352/montreal-canadiens-recall-sven-andrighetto-and-mark-barberio-roster

    • bwoar says:

      Trade coming before the freeze? These guys are not in Montreal long-term I’m thinking.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Perhaps, but the team had to have some bodies available for the weekend games. Once those 11 days have expired perhaps that forces the issue slightly. The IceCaps will suffer not having those kinds of players available to them.

        • bwoar says:

          Hmm… then I’m guessing they’ll get their time (and pay) up until Christmas, and then sent back down (or perhaps kept permanently if there is other movement.) I can easily see this being a simple reward in pay, for two bubble NHLers the team hasn’t given up on.

        • Strummer says:

          Ice Caps were in Binghampton last night and are in Utica and Rochester this Saturday and Sunday gives them some flexibility moving guys up and down.

          Roster freeze starts Monday the 19th of December.

          -Some folks really have trouble letting go of stuff, eh?-

  38. Bergevin's Foxhole says:

    So will we have Monahan in time for the Sharks game? Washington, maybe?

  39. Coach K says:

    Re: Price hammering on Plameri…

    More than anything, that was a message to both his team mates for failing again to keep his crease clear and to Bergevin and Molson to step up, do their jobs and go after the bush league that permits the crease crashing.

    He was saying to both groups and the refs too,

    If you don’t take care of this crap then I’ll do it myself.

    Honestly, it never should have come to that…

    -Adversity Does Not Build Character…it Reveals it-
    (James Lane Allen)

    • Habfan10912 says:

      Coach, we often tend to read to much into a players reaction but I find your take really intetesting. I wonder what Marty Brodeur who at one time yielded a ton of power in the league might have done, said if goalies were getting run during his,playing days?

      • Timo says:

        I remember Marty F Brodeur using his stick and blocker too to clear the crease once in a while. Things were a little easier for him when he had Stevens and Daneyko on the team, but had to do a bit more work himself after those two left.

      • Strummer says:

        I agree. Price just snapped and laid a beating on Palmieri.
        It was reactive as opposed to a thought -out- planned-message to anyone except the recipient of said beat down

        -Some folks really have trouble letting go of stuff, eh?-

    • New says:

      I think the best three game stretch the Habs have played in a long time has been since DD was injured, NJ through Boston. I think Price got them wound up in the Devils game, everything clicked in the Avs game, and after a day off the timing was out of sync against Boston.

      In Nilan’s epoch I think there was more of a tendency for the players to let the goalie take the shot. Today it seems the D want to get something in front of that puck. So a few years ago where you’d just flatten the oncoming forward even as he dished the puck off, today, you chase that puck and if someone touches your stick you drop it and they get a slashing penalty.

      The NHL wants goals so they ignore the rule changes they made which allow more scoring but somehow diminish it. They want parity but ignore that parity sometimes means dull, duller, and dullest.

      When you have refs looking at four minutes of video replay and discussing whether the guy who was shoving his butt into the goalie left before the puck crossed into the blue, whether the puck was loose when the goalie was shoved into the net by the opposing player, or whether the video is clear enough to dispute the decision on the ice, well, you have a bureaucratic mess shoved into a game.

      A goalie is just supposed to stop the puck from crossing the line. A goalie was never intended to hold the line. Football doesn’t have a goalie. Hockey does. That is why they are different games.

      Nice show.

    • Mavid says:

      I think he was just defending himself..no message..the talk below about Brodeur reminds me of Bill Smith, or Ron Hextall..they used to keep their creases clear..no messages being sent there..Price is a big boy..no reason why he cannot take care of it himself…Whenever Weber is on the ice..he stands guard..he doesn’t need to be told by Price

      º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º

      Weed Wacker -and now Flamethrower Grandma Smurf

  40. mrhabby says:

    MT is the best coach the Habs have had in years. Great record too.

  41. nbsjfan says:

    How soon they forget. Knuckles, Knuckles, Knuckles. What are we gonna do with you? You say you were dead wrong about Therrien last year for calling for his firing. Wasn’t it about this time last year that the wheels started to come off? Why don’t we just wait and see how the year progresses before we start calling for Therrien to be man of the year. What do ya think? The press (you included) seem to have put last year behind you (Molson and Bergy must be over the moon with you guys now) but questions remain with our coach. Once the real season begins we’ll see if he’s able to make the right decisions and make the proper adjustments. Wait and see Knuckles, wait and see.

    • Timo says:

      So I take it we should hold off on naming Nilan as Therrien’s replacement? I think so… I think we should.

      • huge_polar_bear says:

        I thought that was what they were grooming DD for. Once he is done his career as a hockey player, he should be the Canadiens’ PP specialist/coach.

        —————————————
        Normal people worry me…

    • Mavid says:

      Of course we would put last year behind us, thats were it belongs, nothing wrong with giving credit were its due..

      º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º°¨¨¨°º¤ø ¸„ø¤GO HABS GOø¤º

      Weed Wacker -and now Flamethrower Grandma Smurf

  42. Strummer says:

    “How can you skate past the noise when you are the noise? Hello!”

    Chris Nilan commenting on Subban’s TV documentary.

    Stu referred to it as narcissistic.

    -Some folks really have trouble letting go of stuff, eh?-

    • huge_polar_bear says:

      Halak is way better … oh never mind

      —————————————
      Normal people worry me…

    • bwoar says:

      Clearly, not by going north-south. You need to take quite the route to skate past the noise. You have to beguile the noise. You need to sidestep it gracefully, one hand down on the ice as you turn, dazzling the casual noise enthusiast and bringing your fans to their feet.

      Sometimes you skate past one or two noises, but a wall of sound is waiting just beyond them and you’re forced to circle back and try again. Then you gotta skate away from the noise, then back towards the noise, then finally past the noise.

      Then you get distracted by the noise at the last second and miss the net. Dang it!

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      This summer, I saw a clip wherein P.K., being asked to respond to his many critics, stated that “Quite frankly, I’ve always preferred to let my game do the talking…”

      And I thought, come on man. I love you P.K., but you never let your game do your talking for you. It is eloquent in its own right, but you always make sure its message isn’t missed by anyone with a barrage of verbiage and on-ice chatter. You may think you pattern yourself after André Dawson, but you’re really being Gary Carter out there.

  43. HabinBurlington says:

    Not Habs related, so I apologize in advance. It seems 2nd year coach Blashill in Detroit recently described his teams game as good despite losing to the Coyotes, citing number of chances as one of his indicators of play.

    However, this measurement is being scrutinized as the Yote outplayed and scored the Wings in the first.. It is an interesting discussion, as score in the game often dictates who is getting chances.

    http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2016/12/14/the-flaw-in-blashills-defense-of-the-wings/

    This leads me to wonder back on last season after Price went down. How often did we hear the team played well just didn’t win? Were we behind early in many/most of the games?

    • Habfan10912 says:

      As a fan for me sometimes if I’m entertained I can better deal with a loss. For way too many coaches and their systems, playing close checking games which favors no risk taking is their idea of “playing well.”

      Quite frankly the games around the league absolutely suck. Instead of being able to enjoy the skill of the world’s best players we’really forced to watch the same 2-1 garbage night after night.

      Therrien takes a lot of heat here, I’m guilty as anyone in this regard, but it isn’t just him. It’s a league wife epidemic and it’s sucking the entertainment value out of the game.

      Oh the league is replacing the lost entertainment with loud music, cheerleaders, goofy sound effects and fireworks but thats,not doing it for me.

      So when I hear a coach say a team played well I’m gonna guess it wasn’t easy on the eyes.

      Morning bud

  44. Steven Finn says:

    I believe the loss of Galchenyuk’s onetimer from the right side on the powerplay allows teams to focus on taking Weber’s slapper away.
    They can cheat and over play Weber on the point, like they did with Subban last season, without having to worry about other hard and quick shooting options.
    I’d like to see Radulov playing in Galchenyuk’s spot or the point shooting more on the powerplay. I know he’s a pass first player but I think he has one of the best shots on the team and would like to see him shoot a little more on the powerplay………

  45. plouf says:

    I’m a huge fan of Chris Nilan, but he’s just coming up with headlines at this point. Last time it was “Therrien doesn’t run real practices.” Now it’s “the problem was PK Subban.” I don’t buy that speculation. I watched an unholy amount of last year’s games, and the problem was not PK Subban. The problem was the team as a whole.

  46. habs001 says:

    The Habs would not be a better team today if Eller and PK were on the team instead of Weber and who ever replaced Eller and they had the same stats as they are having now with their new teams….Just the minus stats of PK would have resulted in more loses…

  47. huge_polar_bear says:

    Best show of the season, good honest hockey talk. Something that has been lacking around these parts recently, not all debates are a personal attack. Disagreement drives discussion, discussion drives ideas. I for one will attempt to be more reflective and constructive in my few posts (read often, post seldom) on this site in an attempt to spark some meaningful hockey talk.

    Any one else notice the psychedelic effects that Nilan’s tie did on camera?

    —————————————
    Normal people worry me…

  48. HouleLovesYou says:

    MT does the best he can with some players underperforming balancing out those that are overperforming, injuries, etc. Weber seems to be slipping from his hot start. Gally and Pleks need to step up quickly. I don’t find myself missing Subban on the ice or in the room. Good tests this weekend.

  49. Cal says:

    According to Nilan, Therrien’s problem last year was Subban. What a load of utter nonsense. Therrien deserves some love? How about winning when your best player, Price, is out? How about being competitive and finding ways to win? How about adjusting the bleeping PP right now?
    Therrien is only there because Bergy was a panicked hobo last season after Price went down. He and eMpTyhead then blamed PK and Eller for all their problems. What an absolute load of rubbish.
    Other than that, it was good to see a 15 minute show, not one that was a weak 10 minutes with so-called “bonus” segments issued later.

    Pittsburgh, with one more game played, has now passed the Habs. Philly, with 3 more games played are 1 point behind and the Rangers are there, too, with 2 more games played. I know the point isn’t 1st in the East, but the Habs are 5-3-2 in their last 10 when the going has gotten tough. Resilience is important and both games this weekend will be a test to see if this version of the Habs belongs in the upper echelons. My take is it’s all on Price, just like last year.

    • piper says:

      It looks to me like if Price goes down again it would be the same thing all over again. Montoya may be an upgrade over last years backups but I won’t be enough.

      • on2ndthought says:

        I can’t remember the poster who was upset this summer when we ‘cheaped out’ and signed Montoya instead of spending a little more on Chad Johnson.

        Montoya is as good (or better) a backup, but nowhere near as good a replacement should Price go down.

        Free Front.

        • Timo says:

          Agreed. The only better replacement for Price is Halak.
          Because Halak > Price.

        • 24 Cups says:

          That was probably me. I thought the Habs should have signed Johnson instead of Montoya even if the difference in pay is an extra 750,000. I believed that Johnson was a better goalie and could carry the team long term if Price got hurt again.

        • Un Canadien errant says:

          I’m not sure that Chad Johnson was available to sign by the Canadiens last summer. Some fringe goalies will choose their opportunities, will prefer a team where the #1 goalie job is up for grabs.

          For example, when the Canadiens had Devan Dubnyk in their organization in 2014 after the trade deadline until July 1, he apparently never seriously considered signing a new contract with the Canadiens to be Carey Price’s backup. He wanted to go to another org to rebuild his career and become a starting goalie again. I ‘regret’ that we never signed him to a cheap-ish Jacob Markstrom deal, and have a potentially great backup for a few seasons, but that was fantasy hockey GM’ing, and never really in the cards evidently.

          James Reimer was another name that was batted around last summer, but again, he’s a guy who had his eye on being a #1 again, and he saw/sees Florida as an opportunity to be that when Roberto tails off.

          On the other hand, Al Montoya, kind of like Peter Budaj, have embraced their reserve goaltender status, will work with the team and the incumbent in that mindset, won’t make waves. They would willingly sign in Montréal understanding the situation.

          So the Johnson + $750 000 vs. Al Montoya decision may not have been one that Marc Bergevin had to make, it might have never been in the cards. Maybe Chad Johnson didn’t see Montréal as a desirable place to play, as clear second-fiddle to Carey. It wasn’t as clearcut a choice as Marc Bergevin being at the store and unwisely choosing the house brand goalie rather than paying a little more for the better premium brand.

          • The Big E says:

            “when the Canadiens had Devan Dubnyk in their organization in 2014 after the trade deadline until July 1, he apparently never seriously considered signing a new contract with the Canadiens to be Carey Price’s backup. He wanted to go to another org to rebuild his career and become a starting goalie again. I ‘regret’ that we never signed him to a cheap-ish Jacob Markstrom deal, and have a potentially great backup for a few seasons, but that was fantasy hockey GM’ing, and never really in the cards evidently.”

            … that sets my mind at ease a bit about that issue. I had been having the same thoughts, especially during the last three-quarters of last season, so it’s kind of good to know that it was “never in the cards” rather than “oops, shoulda kept him” scenario.

    • Coach K says:

      Ok, I can see PK’s antics being a bit of a distraction last year but he was the one player who:

      -NEVER mailed it in all season long,
      -led the team in points,
      -tried in his own way, to keep things light in the room when it was clearly and quickly becoming a dark place as the team imploded and
      -gave back to his adopted community like like nobody else. Anywhere but Montreal, or HiO for that matter, that would be considered as leadership. I love Nilan but for anyone to imply that PK was THE problem is simply wrong.

      -Adversity Does Not Build Character…it Reveals it-
      (James Lane Allen)

      • Dust says:

        He was also doing things on the ice that were not helping the team play as a group. If everyone is pulling the boat in one direction but one person is going off diagonally it makes it harder to get to your destination.

      • GGtheHab says:

        and he did all those things on his own..as in not a part of the team..
        giving it all and not mailing it in is fine if you stay within the framework of team concept..too many times he dangled instead of passing the puck, circling back and leaving guys standing at the blueline..you see it all the time with players that think they can do it alone.
        I was a PK fan since his Belleville days but even I grew weary of defending his antics to my leaf buddies.

      • piper says:

        There is no way MT and PK were going to work. MB chose MT and the rest is history.
        If not for the age difference and length of Weber’s contract it would be a good deal.
        MB wouldn’t have looked good in the eyes of his boss if he admitted he made a mistake in giving MT the contract he did.
        I know a lot here disagree but that’s my take.
        As for Nilan, I’m really surprised he’s coming down on PK like he is.

    • Timo says:

      Can we conclude that Nilan is just another talking head that is much better suited to be on a low profile webcast than behind a professional hockey team bench?

    • PeterStone says:

      speaking of utter nonsense a few days ago you wrote “Reimer and Luongo aren’t getting the job done this season. Watching the highlights for the last Panthers game I noticed how poorly Luongo was moving. Reimer has been AHL caliber this season. Add that to losing Huberdeau for a lot of games and you have a recipe for failure”

      Huberdeau = Price and Gallagher
      Reimer and Luongo = Condon

      Utter nonsense.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Do you understand that juvenile almost-jokes like “eMpTyhead” do more to injure your reputation as a poster than Michel Therrien’s standing and job security?

    • GGtheHab says:

      5-3-2 pace over 80 games is 40-24-16 good for 96 points with 2 games left over for a possible 100 pt season

  50. 24 Cups says:

    Here are MT’s stats during his second go-round with the Habs.

    182/108/33/.632 (average of last five seasons including this year)

    Just to set the record straight as a point of comparison.

    Boucher – .546
    Roy – .572
    Hartley – .554
    Gallant – .515

    NOTE: Stats are from the Hockey-Reference site.

    • huge_polar_bear says:

      I think people’s aversion to MT stem from three things. First his over-employment of his favorite player at the time. Secondly the ease with which a player can enter his doghouse and seemingly the hardships to get out. Lastly his aversion to keep lines intact. These overshadow his winning ways.

      —————————————
      Normal people worry me…

      • 24 Cups says:

        I think those are valid points that you make. I would also add that it is very difficult for young players to get extended periods of ice time to gain a footing and show what they can really do.

        Part of the problem is that from Day One it was never truly about a rebuild. Once the team bounced back from the 2012 debacle, MT and MB were full throttle ahead to try and make the playoffs. That meant over playing Price and Markov and not giving young players extended units of games to gain experience and build confidence.

        • huge_polar_bear says:

          I do wonder how much better this team would be if Beaulieu, Pateryn and Tinordi were handled differently. The first two may still make it happen, the later is probably done due to his abuse of banned substances. But one has to wonder if it was a contributing factor to his downward spiral the way he was developed early in his career. In the brain of a young man trying to make the club, dealing with paternal pressure of the ex NHL player and never really getting a chance to stick with the team. I wonder if he started to dope to get that edge. It’s not an excuse as I am sure many in the NHL have similar challenges. I just really thought that he would be a NHL defenceman.

          —————————————
          Normal people worry me…

          • 24 Cups says:

            I would add Daniel Carr to your list, as well. I’d love to see what this kid could do if he played 40 games in a row on a secondary line.

      • Dust says:

        Look at Babcock. If a player enters his doghouse it’s worse than MTs. See Holland and Corrado for examples of this. All coaches play favourites and don’t play players they don’t trust or like their style of play. Their goal is to win as many games as possible. If they think a player isn’t going to help them win… well doghouse it is.

  51. CaliHabFan says:

    First to say Happy Xmas all…..


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