Weise will make Habs debut vs. Flames; White returns to lineup

Dale Weise will make his Canadiens debut Tuesday night against the Calgary Flames at the Bell Centre (7:30 p.m., TSN-HABS, RDS, TSN Radio 690).

Weise, acquired from the Vancouver Canucks on Monday in exchange for defenceman Raphael Diaz, took part in Tuesday’s morning skate in Brossard, skating on a line with Michael Bournival and Ryan White (photo above).

White, who led the team in its morning stretch, will be back in the lineup for the first time since suffering an upper-body injury on Jan. 2. He missed 14 games.

Travis Moen didn’t take part in the morning skate because of a lower-body injury and won’t play against the Flames. George Parros will be a healthy scratch at forward and defenceman Francis Bouillon will also sit this one out.

 ”I think I can bring a physical presence to the (Canadiens),” Weise, a right-winger, said on a conference call Monday after the trade was made. “I’m a good skater and I work hard and my success is down low and hanging onto pucks and being physical and trying to get to the hard areas to score goals.

“I’m not sure where I’m going to fit in just yet. I’m just looking forward to coming in and trying to play hard and trying to find a spot.

“(The trade) comes as a little bit of a shock to me,” added Weise, who will wear No. 22 with the Habs. “I think any time you hear rumours around you think about it but there’s so many (rumours) that go around and you just never know.

“I didn’t put too much thought into it … I was shocked when I heard about it today.”

The 6-foot-2, 210-pounder has 10 goals, 16 assists and 185 penalty minutes in 162 career NHL games. In 44 games this season with the Canucks, Weise had 3-9-12 totals with 42 penalty minutes and was minus-1.

Canadiens coach Michel Therrien told reporters in Brossard Tuesday morning that Weise fills a need for the team with his physical presence.

“He’s very explosive on the ice, especially on the forecheck,” the coach said. “That’s one of the reasons that we’re very happy to have acquired him. We told him that we want him to be himself and we want to make sure he’s playing his own game. He brings some speed, he’s good on the forecheck, he plays the wall well, and he’s got some size. He fills a need that we’ve been looking for.”

Alex Galchenyuk, who has been sidelined since breaking his hand in early January, skated before the team’s morning skate and was taking shots.

The Flames come to Montreal on a five-game winning streak and beat the Canadiens in their previous meeting this season, 3-2 in Calgary on Oct. 9. The Canadiens are 2-5-1 in their last eight games.

Carey Price is expected to start in goal for the Canadiens.

Here’s how the lines and defence pairings looked at the morning skate:

Gionta – Plekanec  – Briere
Pacioretty – Desharnais – Gallagher
Prust – Eller – Bourque
Bournival – White – Weise
Parros

Gorges – Subban
Markov – Emelin
Beaulieu – Murray
Drewiske – Bouillon

(Photo by Allen McInnis/The Gazette)

Habs vs. Flames preview, NHL.com

Game Day Report, Canadiens.com

Morning skate interviews (video), Canadiens.com

Projected Flames lines, calgaryflames.com

Latest Flames news, Calgary Herald

Habs acquire Weise from Canucks, by The Gazette’s Pat Hickey

Diaz ‘surprised and shocked’ to be traded, by Pat Hickey

Diaz comes to Canucks with some questions, Vancouver Province

367 Comments

  1. marvin20 says:

    Pacioretty is the only player on their top two lines that is over 6 feet tall and 200 hundred pounds, and he plays small. I do not expect many goals again tonight. Hope they prove me wrong.

  2. Ozmodiar says:

    Lovin’ all the puns, but…

    Weise, rhymes with geese.

    /that is all

  3. krob1000 says:

    If they move Markov then the tank is on….and it will be a two season tank…No Honour for Connor!!

  4. Mattyleg says:

    This is my favourite part of HI/O!!
    I’m so excited!

    A bizarre trade rumour comes up from the depths of nowhere, then it magically becomes a real thing, then Bergevin is an idiot for not doing it, then more ‘Bergevin never makes decent trades’ talk!

    And all this despite it not existing in the first place!!!

    My favourite!!!

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  5. Thomas Le Fan says:

    Although I had nothing against him, I don’t think we’ll miss Diaz a whole lot. Here’s hoping Weise will bring some much needed size, grit and added physical effort to our forward combinations. Go Habs!

    Hockey isn’t everything … it’s the only thing … except for beer and guitars!

  6. Scout says:

    Wondering if we can score more than one goal tonight? With White and Weise in the line-up, I think we’ll score 6. Wings anyone!

  7. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    One other thing on the Markov rumours (two actually):

    A) Does he have a NTC?
    B) Teams that would be interested in him are looking at him mostly (I assume) for help on the PP. What happens to our PP without him? Beaulieau ready?

  8. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    If offers for Markov are truly being listened to, that would leave a big gap in our D. But if the pot is sweet enough, would be tough to say no.

    Commenting on rumours is pointless, but it’s what we do here, right?

    All I’ll say is if it is something that is happening, I hope that MB is only listening to offers that include someone who can put the bloody puck in the net…

    • johnnylarue says:

      I think Markov would be next to impossible to replace for the short term (i.e. next season), and that the Habs would be in a drastically worse place without him in the lineup, even in spite of his limited mobility.

      That said, I kinda like the idea of renting him out to the highest bidder (i.e. 1st round pick +) and then re-signing him in July, provided that cranky old goat is cool with it…

  9. SmartDog says:

    Folks, I’ve asked around the dogpound and we’ve decided to put our sniff of approval on the Weise trade.

    MB traded an unneeded roster player who is about to become UFA for a 4th line RFA who is younger and faster and the kind of player (if he works out) we need more of. So at least he’s trading – and in the right direction.

    As long as he continues to trade old for young, tough for soft, AND to keep on trading, we’re all good.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • Chris says:

      I hate the logic that we’re all good as long as trades are made old for young, tough for soft, etc.

      Montreal is in dire straights because they lack talent, not toughness or size on their third and fourth lines.

      Chicago can ice Hossa, Sharp, Toews, Saad, Kane and Shaw.

      San Jose can throw out Thornton, Marleau, Pavelski, Couture, and Burns.

      Los Angeles has Carter, Kopitar, Richards, Brown and Williams.

      Pittsburgh has Crosby, Malkin, Neal and Kunitz.

      With Pacioretty and Plekanec, Montreal has two poor man’s versions of star players. There is great hope that Galchenyuk would give them a third. But let’s face it…Montreal is bringing a knife to a gun-fight. We’re fighting a nuclear war with water balloons.

      • Bripro says:

        Given the radiation fall-out from a nuclear blast, I’ll gladly take the water balloons! :)

      • Mattyleg says:

        How are Carter, Kopitar, Richards, Brown and Williams doing recently, I wonder…?

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

      • Forum Dog says:

        Good post. Depth of talent up front is the main problem for the Habs, but size is part of that equation. Note that, of the guys you mention, most are either over 6′ and 200lbs, or at least play like it. Talent will take you a long way, but if you don’t back it up with some physical attributes, you will get pushed aside by the NHL. Briere is case in point. On talent alone he is pretty good. On physical strength and desire, he is a non-factor.

      • SmartDog says:

        I don’t disagree with your overall point, but I’m not sure what it has to do with my post… the comment about trading for size and youth was a little tongue in cheek.

        Point is – Habs were not going to trade Diaz for Kane. We do need more skill but we also need more size and grit. To get that with SPEED may be a good addition. At least it’s better than trading for another small guy.

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • Forum Dog says:

          I agree that the Diaz/Weise deal was a good one for the Habs. Or at least as good as could be expected for a guy who a) didn’t play much, and b) was about to have his contract expire. It even opens up a little more cap-space now as they approach the deadline.

  10. CJ says:

    Decided to spend 15 minutes and check out some rumours around the league. An ESPN affiliate has noted that Markov is being shopped with the Kings, Sharks and Av’s as potential destinations.

    Asking price from LA included a first round pick, Tanner Pearson and Kyle Clifford.

    I’m not placing a great deal of weight into any of this, as these are just rumours, however LA has to be desperate now. 1 win in their past ten games played and a total of three out of a possibility of twenty points will force your hand.

    It would stand to reason that Markov’s value would increase further, as the deadline draws nearer.

    • AceTen says:

      If that’s the case… Do it MB! Do it now! Before he blows out his knee for a third time.

    • Danno says:

      Very interesting…

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”
      Updates, highlights & great discussions on all things Habs

    • Forum Dog says:

      A team like LA could definitely benefit from Markov. They have the depth to insulate him 5-on-5, and they really could use him on the left point on the PP. LA’s PP is bottom 5 in the league, but they are otherwise a solid team.

      As for the return, I’d for one would be happy with it. Would hate to see Markov go, but if we are realistic about both the present and the future, that deal could help the Habs.

      • scarboro_habitant says:

        montreals PP continues to struggle, bringing markovs value down probably from game to game. MB needs to sh*t or get off the pot.

        • Forum Dog says:

          I’d say (or at least hope) that other teams would recognize that Montreal’s PP problems are not related to Markov. They are more a result of them not having any big forwards who go to the net or control the puck down low. The only option for Montreal these days is the point, and that is easy to defend. Until someone big (and willing) enough to block the goaler’s view is out there, and until the player on the half wall is strong enough to fend off a body check and hang onto the puck, the PP will be a one-trick pony…..

    • Ozmodiar says:

      I wonder if the folks at ESPN know we just traded for Weise. I suppose we could add to the 4th line posse seeing how the count is only at 6 or 7. :)

      Seriously, I’d consider that package. Would rather Zykov, tho. Zykov + a 1st would be nice.

    • govenah says:

      Go for it MB! cut the chord! release the hounds! Fire off all the guns at once!

      The glass is MT.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Wow, JB posts his suggestion for the big trade at 3:21pm and at 3:33pm you have already found out MB is listening! Or is he….. ever notice that JB’s initials are almost the same as MB’s? Just sayin’

      • JohnBellyful says:

        Actually, I tried posting it here last night but it’s still being moderated.
        (Hey, I betcha that guy in charge of the server passed my comment on to MB!
        I’m flattered — and angry!)

    • adamkennelly says:

      trade done…in a heartbeat.

      at least in that case MB will be clearly telling all that he understands our team is not yet good enough so trade assets while they are high to maximize for the future.

  11. JohnBellyful says:

    I think MB should bite the bullet, aim for the stars, get off the can, pull out all the stops, and make a big trade — and the sooner the better.
    http://johnbellyful.weebly.com/

  12. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …was it Gene Autry or Roy Rogers that was the yodeling cowboy ?

    …I should know because when I was knee high to a cricket I watched every western movie ever filmed

    …but, I’m an older cricket now :( …and today My memory is that of a knat

  13. Luke says:

    Hey Boone!

    If (when) MT Scratches Weise, can you please refer to him as “Idle Weise”?

    Thanks in advance. (And you’re welcome).

  14. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …was very surprised to find Corey Locke playing for the Abbotsford Heat last Friday

    I thought he was now playing in Europe ?

    …unless there is another Corey Locke

    …he still looks very young …and very small

  15. habs001 says:

    I am not sold that if a player and his team have good scoring stats based on lets say playing 7 minutes a game that those stats will translate into higher amounts if he played 16 minutes a game..

    • Strummer says:

      You have a point -however if given more ice time a younger player can be more productive a become a late-bloomer.
      An example is David Clarkson with New Jersey who didn’t hit his stride until a couple of years ago at age 27.
      Early in his career he was getting 20 points a season playing 13 minutes a night.
      His last 2 seasons with the Devils he was up to 16-17 minutes a night and his point totals went up

      ______________________________________________________
      “It’s just an opinion- I could be wrong”

  16. CalgaryHab says:

    No question Calgary has seen it’s fair share of bad hockey, these past 5 years especially. I hate playing the Flames mostly because the Habs are absolutely brutal when they come to the Saddledome -we’re constantly beaten by a lessor team.
    As thin as the talent pool is in Calgary, one trait they are not short on is work ethic. I’ve watched enough Habs games to know we are about to be schooled on work ethic by a less talented but harder working Flames team. I hope I’m wrong.
    Habs look awesome when they skate, horrific when they don’t. Not sure which team MT is bringing tonight.

  17. HabinBurlington says:

    Here you go Frontenac, the Yodeling Cowboy himself, Slim Whitman singing “That’s how the Yodel was Born”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5vreR8_iHKM

  18. secretdragonfly says:

    I don’t think the poor guy know what he’s getting into – he’s likely just gained about 100,000 followers on Twitter and is saying “what the…..?

  19. Luke says:

    So we seem to have come to a consensus regarding Weise.

    But just to clarify:

    Is he just going to break the modern goals in a game record of 6 or the historical record (Malone in 1920) of 7 tonight?

  20. HabinBurlington says:

    A summary of HI/O the past 24 hours:

    Poster A: I think Weise is going to be a 20-30 goal scorer for the Habs
    Poster B: No, Weise is going to be a steaming pile of dung for the Habs
    Poster C: Hang on, he may just end up being a 4th line grinder.

    Repeats Posts A thru C on a continuous loop like the cassette players we all used to have until the memorex breaks…….

  21. Mattyleg says:

    We are all aware of how this will go, right?

    Weise scores a goal: He is the second coming of Boom-Boom Geoffrion.
    Weise does not score a goal: He is the second coming of Sergei Samsonov.
    Weise has a goal scored against while he is on the ice: He is the second coming of Raphael Diaz.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • CalgaryHab says:

      When it comes to our Swiss D-men transactions, we got more for Diaz then we did for Streit, and Streit was a much better player.

      • Maksimir says:

        Letting Streit walk for nothing was another glaring mistake of the previous regime… a prospect or at least a decent draft pick might have helped this current team by now. Gainey also did that with Koivu and Kovalev… two more chances to stock pile for the future.

        • ClutchNGrab says:

          If we had a coach other than Carbonneau who played Streit on a fourth line, we may have had a better chance to evaluate him properly.

          Regardless, choosing between a the chance to fight for playoff spot or a to get a marginal pick/player is not that easy

        • Strummer says:

          Why would they trade Streit at the the deadline in 2008?
          You don’t dump your 3rd leading scorer when you win the Eastern Conference and are gunning for the Cup

          ______________________________________________________
          “It’s just an opinion- I could be wrong”

    • JohnBellyful says:

      It would be nice if Weise made his de but with le but
      (or something like that)

  22. commandant says:

    A look at the Flames current win streak
    http://lastwordonsports.com/2014/02/04/flames-streak-is-about-more-than-just-wins/

    Go Habs Go!
    Your 2013 NHL Draft Headquarters, Now Open.
    http://lastwordonsports.com/

  23. Eddie says:

    The guy is being brought in because he can skate very well, he can forecheck, and he can play defence.

    My guess.

    Habs will trade Moen and get a decent draft pick for him.

    We have too many forwards who are 4th line specialists and Moen is the one who can be moved for a decent return.

    • Sportfan says:

      As long as he is whiling to waive his no trade clause, maybe the Ducks will want him back for another Cup run!

      Sports and Entertainment in the link click and enjoy, clicking is fun!
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    • PeterD says:

      Agreed…and we get younger right away sans Moen…he just hasn’t been the same since his last concussion.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Agree that we undervalue Travis Moen here. Many teams would take that big guy with his reasonable contract in a heartbeat.

      Last season, he had a difficult year, and I think those analysts who said he resisted the attempts by the team to be the enforcer against heavyweights were probably correct. This season, with George Parros and Douglas Murray in the fold, he’s seemed more effective, more dynamic. He’s having a good season, and his trade value has increased.

  24. jimmy shaker says:

    Moen takes bournivals spot when back and then who sits for chucky……hopefully bourque.

    I would’ve got budaj in their today and let carey have the next 2

    Shaker out!

  25. Sportfan says:

    Saw a photo on twitter of Ryan White skating by MT and accidentally knocking him over lol.

    Sports and Entertainment in the link click and enjoy, clicking is fun!
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  26. sCOTT1243 says:

    Weiss just made this team bigger and tougher. Diaz was ok, nothing special.

    98% of the guys on this site said trade Diaz, well MB did…those who complain, did you think we were going to get the Sedins for him?

    We have Beaulieu, Tinordi and Pateryn to look forward to on D. This was a good trade.

  27. PeterD says:

    Bournival – White – Weise

    I like the look of this 4th line…good energy players…youth and energy…hopefully they can be defensively responsible.
    Hoping this line brings a high energy and provides some crash and bang hits.

  28. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …hopefully Weise is a Bourque that more frequently puts the puck in the net …if so I’m ok with the trade

    …anyhow, having 3 big bodies like Patches, Bourque and Weise with speed on the wings should add a much needed dynamic, …hopefully

    …the only burr in My saddle is Murray
    _________________________________________________________
    Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
    http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

    Campaign to Retire Toe Blake’s Number 6 !!!

    5

    • johnnylarue says:

      Chris, Bourque was on pace for a third consecutive 27-goal season when we acquired him.

      Weise has 10 in his career.

      At the risk of sounding like a broken record, Weise is Tom Kostopoulos in a bigger body. Point final. And there’s nothing wrong with that. But he ain’t Rene Bourque.

    • Mattyleg says:

      I don’t see a problem with Murray.

      He ain’t quick, but he’s big.
      He hits people and they stay hit, while not even Large Buff could shift him in front of our net.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • PeterD says:

      Actually I’m hoping Weise is less like Bourque the invisible and more like a Prust or a young Moen before his concussions.
      But having more wingers with size and speed can’t hurt.

  29. Ozmodiar says:

    #tradeWeise

    C’mon, MB, do it!! Trade Weise! He’s simply not good enough for us!

  30. JUST ME says:

    Through all this predictable circus about a minor trade i did appreciate the comments from you guys out west that know what Weise is all about. I do not think we were losers in the trade.

    Let`s play the questions game
    -1 Would you have given 3 milions a year to Diaz as he probably will make next year ?
    2- Do you think Diaz will sign a new deal in Vancouver ?
    3- Do you think Diaz would have been put back in the habs lineup eventually even with injured d-men ?
    4-Do you think Diaz fits in the top 6 d-men in MTL ?
    5-For a one on one trade did you expect to get more for Diaz?
    6-Did you think we were losing Diaz at the end of the season for nothing ?

    • The Juice says:

      1-no, he is not a good fit in Mtl
      2-who am I a fortune teller?
      3-of course
      4-no, mainly because he is too soft and Habs have enough puck movers (Subban, Markov, Beaulieu) who have a better rounded game
      5-no, but was hoping to see him as part of a package deal for a Vanek or Moulson
      6-likely

      __________________________________________________________________________

      “To you from failing hands we throw the torch, be yours to hold it high!”
      @JohnnytheJuice

    • johnnylarue says:

      Okay, my best case scenario for a Diaz trade?

      Let him play in Sochi, give him a chance to augment his value (which could not have been lower following repeated benchings under MT) and hope to get a second round pick for him. I don’t think that’s unrealistic.

      Habs cupboard is chock full of serviceable plumbers.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Mr. Diaz is somewhat of a fit in Vancouver, in that he’s a rightie, and the Canucks need more on defence. If they re-sign him of course that means the end of Yannick Weber there.

      Generally, the Canucks want to get bigger on defence to handle the big forwards in the Pacific division, so he would not really fit into that scenario.

      Best case scenario for Raphaël is that he regains his touch and confidence he seems to have lost since the concussions, that he’s effective the rest of the way, and that a team that has a lot of size on D but needs a puck-mover (Ottawa?) picks him up. They could surround him with the kind of players he needs to play his game.

    • PeterD says:

      I see Diaz signing and playing in Europe next season.

    • frontenac1 says:

      I like Yodelling. There used to be a Yodelling Cowboy a long time ago. He was pretty good.

  31. Mattyleg says:

    Not sure if this has been pointed out, but Weise has had only two coaches in the NHL, and half of them were Torts.

    He had an idea of what he wanted from Weise, and demanded it in NY and in Van. He had a season and a half under Vignault, true, but I wonder if his role was modeled on what Torts had wanted him to be in NY.

    If that makes any sense…

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  32. The_Truth says:

    Stats can say what you want them to say. In regards to someone bringing up Weise has more Points per minute than DD.

    Weise 1P / 27.5 Mins

    Chucky 1P / 28.2 Mins
    DD 1P / 32.4 Mins
    Pleks 1P / 34.6 Mins
    Gio 1P / 35.3 Mins
    Subban 1P / 37.8 Mins
    Eller 1P / 47.04 Mins

    So Weise is the most capable offensive player on the team and Eller belongs in the AHL?

    • krob1000 says:

      No but he isn’t someone everyone should assume has the ceiling of a plug 2 seasons into his career when never having been given a better role. We all know the impact of linemates and role…very few guys (only Pleks as a Hab) can produce with anyone. Dd without his top man role went a season and another 20 games in Gomez territory. Eller was 2 points off of Pleks last year as top center and was with him again this year early when he was getting those minutes. It is all relative to a lot of circumstnaces that are out of a players control and that can be impacted by a variety of external forces as well as internal ones like confidence and intellect. The fact a guy like Weise produced in junior and then produced even better at the AHL level indicates there was un upward trend….the fact he is outscoring Prust , Bourque, Bournival, Moen,etc in a very limited 4th line role with the most dzone starts on his team is a good sign……I am just trying to counter all of the posts that are writing the kid off instantly…ironically enough these are the same people who would have rather had a 3rd round pick that may never even get to where Weise is now….actually odds strongly suggest that pick wouldn’t…so why wouldn’t MB make this deal? I see zero reason once it was decided Diaz was going…

      • Old Bald Bird says:

        Please stop scrambling brains with your sounds analysis. It hurts, y’know?

      • The_Truth says:

        White had better numbers than Weise in Junior as did many other well known 4th liners. Junior numbers don’t translate well to predicting NHL success.

        DD had 2 less points than Eller last season and he was horrible, yet Eller was awesome? Anybody that watches the games objectively or goes through career stats can see that DD is a better and more skilled offensive player than Eller.

        I stated that I had no problem with the deal and that it was the best MB could hope for for a UFA Diaz. It does look like Weise has a tiny bit of offensive ability and could be a good 4th liner with a possibility of 3rd line play (on this team). Probably more ability than Moen or White, but not more than Prust IMO. I’m glad to have him for a guy who wasn’t going to play, but putting him on the top 6 won’t help anything.

        • krob1000 says:

          Check out their AHL numbers..those are far more indicative…..Weise was ont he upward swing. Therir AHl numbers aren;t even close…Weise put up 28 goals in the AHL and 50 points at age 22. At age 22 in the AHL Prust scored 10 gaols and had 37 points.

  33. montreal ace says:

    Weise had 28 goals, with 22 assists for 50 points as a 22 year old, in the AHL. A player does not put up numbers like that without talent, so I think MB and Dudley, seen a player under valued and not being used properly. I hope he plays well and I wish him the best tonight

    • rljmartin says:

      Players not being used properly….Where have I heard that before? LOL

    • johnnylarue says:

      Hmmm… Well, those numbers are admittedly better than the 16G/22A Mike Blunden put up with with Rockford IceHogs in 2007-2008… as a 21 year-old.

      Seriously folks, expect nothing and, I promise, you won’t be disappointed.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Really I expected he would at least put his jersey on the right way and come out for warmups. Nothing? Like he will trip in dressing room on way to ice and then not play?

      • Trollhunter says:

        “Seriously folks, expect nothing and, I promise, you won’t be disappointed“

        Sorry I had to paste that in there so it really hits home with them.

      • habcertain says:

        we can truly expect nothing in return for these types of trades, I would rather a draft pick, any pick, an hope we hit one out of the park. I’m sure we will see an initial spark out of Weise, then MT will have playing 4 min of TOI on the 4th line.

    • Sportfan says:

      Has he he only played under Torts, if so that could explain a little bit of the under value.

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    • Ozmodiar says:

      Tom the Bomb had better numbers as a 20 year old in the AHL.

    • Luke says:

      Darren Haydar: 2006-07 Chicago Wolves AHL 73 41 81 122

      NHL? 22 games. 1 goal, 8 points.

      Plenty of folks put up big numbers in the minors and especially junior, but it does not transfer to the NHL.

      Hey, I hope Wheezy bags 20 goals in his next 30 games. But I doubt it.
      I hope for an upgrade on White. And that may be asking a lot…

      • Mr. Biter says:

        Right on Luke. When the going gets tough, the tough get going or they end up in the AHL or Europe. Many a high draft choice for all teams who came from Junior with outstanding records to never even seeing the ice the NHL.

        Mr. Biter
        No Guts No Glory

  34. SteverenO says:

    I just heard that Marinaro read my entire article “Left Wing Unlocked” on the air about an hour ago.

    Knuckles said he doubts the coach is even aware of those kind of numbers (minutes per goal scored/allowed) and someone should give him that info.

    regards,

    Steve O.

    http://www.hockeydata-central.com/blog/

  35. Stevie.Ray says:

    Is it pronounced why-zee?

  36. Sportfan says:

    I know a guy in one of my classes from Vancouver, big Canucks fan said that we will like Wiese and the speed he has and the effort he brings.

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    http://nickolaisblog.wordpress.com/

  37. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    This game is huge though. Win and we pass Toronto (based on ROW) and get back into third in the division.

    And I have lots of pints riding on it with the gents in the office here in YYC.

    Obviously the team is (one would assume) more concerned with the latter.

  38. D Mex says:

    Torts had Weise on for the opening brawl vs CGY – wondering if MT will do the same tonight to make him feel ” at home ” – lol.

    ALWAYS Habs -
    D Mex

    • DadidolizedDougHarvey says:

      They’re just jealous.

    • Mattyleg says:

      I saw that piece of sh!t on Facebook and tore it apart there.

      Just stupid hating.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • jackbutt says:

      Any idiot can rant a city, all that was said happens everywhere, governments are corrupt everywhere, and religion is for the most peat a big sham. You can’t go to Toronto and not put your self in danger, the last time I was there, in the first hour, I must of being approached about 8 to 12 times for smokes, and change. That guy needs to move to Toronto.

  39. --Habs-- says:

    Lets give the kid a chance and see what he can do! Hopefully the coach will give him some ice time for more than 1 period!

    “Habs” Watch and learn….! Or Not!

  40. jols101 says:

    TSN does this on purpose I think. Just clicked on their site and a big picture of Cammalleri pops up with a headline ” Montreal Mike.” For a split second I think Bergevin made another trade. I don’t know how I feel about it because I don’t know the details yet, so I read the first line, a story about his return to the Bell Center. Big Deal. lol

  41. Chris says:

    On December 1st (about the 1/3 point of the season), the Eastern Conference standings looked like this:

    1. Boston (18-7-2) – 38 PTS
    2. Pittsburgh (18-9-1) – 37
    3. Tampa Bay (16-9-1) – 33
    4. Montreal (15-9-3) – 33
    5. Detroit (13-7-7) – 33
    6. Toronto (14-10-3) – 31
    7. Washington (14-11-2) – 30
    8. NY Rangers (14-13-0) – 28
    9. New Jersey (11-11-5) – 27
    10. Philadelphia (12-12-2) – 26
    11. Carolina (10-11-5) – 25
    12. Ottawa (10-12-4) – 24
    13. Columbus (10-14-3) – 23
    14. NY Islanders (8-15-4) – 20
    15. Florida (7-15-5) – 19
    16. Buffalo (6-20-2) – 14

    Most teams are now sitting at the 2/3 point of the season, and here is how they have done since December 1st:

    1. Pittsburgh (21-6-1) – 43 (+0.22 PPG)
    2. Columbus (19-9-1) – 39 (+0.50)
    3. Tampa Bay (16-9-4) – 36 (-0.03)
    4. Philadelphia (16-9-4) – 36 (+0.24)
    5. Boston (17-9-1) – 35 (-0.11)
    6. NY Rangers (16-10-3) – 35 (+0.17)
    7. Toronto (16-11-3) – 35 (+0.02)
    8. Ottawa (14-9-7) – 35 (+0.25)
    9. Carolina (15-9-4) – 34 (+0.25)
    10. New Jersey (12-10-8) – 32 (+0.14)
    11. Montreal (14-12-3) – 31 (-0.07)
    12. Florida (14-12-2) – 30 <strong(+0.37)
    13. NY Islanders (13-13-4) – 30 (+0.26)
    14. Detroit (12-12-5) – 29 (-0.22)
    15. Washington (11-11-7) – 29 (-0.11)
    16. Buffalo (9-12-6) – 24 (+0.39)

    We all know that Montreal is playing poorly lately. What is more alarming for me is that the rest of the conference (with the notable exception of Washington, Boston and Detroit) have very much improved in the second third of the season.

    This means that there are really no easy games on the schedule anymore. Buffalo is no longer quite the pushover that they were earlier in the season, although they continue to be the worst team in the conference. Florida, Philadelphia, Ottawa, Carolina, Columbus and the Islanders have all improved significantly in the second third of the season.

    Montreal had a 6 point cushion, which they pushed to 8 or 9 points in early December, on the 9th place teams. That cushion is now down to 2 points on Philadelphia and 3 points on Ottawa, Carolina, Washington and New Jersey. Three of those teams have been trending upwards quite strongly, so the Habs are absolutely up against it for the rest of the season.

    As others have pointed out, their schedule is brutal: Detroit (home), Pittsburgh (road), Toronto (Saturday night home), Los Angeles (road), Anaheim (road), Phoenix (road), San Jose (road), Boston (home) and Ottawa (home) in a 15 game period.

    Ouch.

    • krob1000 says:

      The East is evening out with teh West lately…seems every time I look at the results Eastern teams are now beating the West and when two teams from the East paly it seems to be a 3pt game…I agree Montreal is in a dog fight. I think the fight is worth having though….

    • jols101 says:

      That is a horrifying schedule. That Western road trip could be the final nail in the coffin.

    • CJ says:

      Long story short, it could be worst case scenario time.

      We will likely win 2/3 this week, which will be enough to steady our hold as the number one wildcard. We fail to move any of our UFA’s at the deadline, or worse yet, make a move sacrificing our future for a rental.

      Deadline passes and we lose 5/7, dropping us into 10-12 place in the east. Now we have failed to make a move and sit on the outside looking in.

      At the end of the day we are too good to drop into the lower tier, but we are not good enough to be serious contenders. This is going to greatly test our management team. Decisions in the next month will impact our future. Decisions in the next six months will greatly shape our future.

      • Ghosts of the Forum says:

        This game is huge though. Win and we pass Toronto (based on ROW) and get back into third in the division.

        And I have lots of pints riding on it with the gents in the office here in YYC.

        Obviously the team is (one would assume) more concerned with the latter.

      • Ghosts of the Forum says:

        Dunno why that attached as a reply to your comment, apologies!

      • kalevine says:

        I don’t known how you can say we will likely win 2/3 this week. Have you checked our record lately?

        • CJ says:

          We are 2-1-1 this month. Based on the opposition, I think we could win 2 out of 3 games. Am I missing something?

          • CJ says:

            Additionally, I was also identifying what I believed to be a worst case scenario, if you hold an opinion, as I do, that we are further ahead to build for the future then stay the course.

    • Cal says:

      Habs are still a bubble team, even with a decent core. If they don’t go on an extended winning streak, the playoffs won’t happen. I’m okay with that- a higher pick will result.

    • Phil C says:

      What is interesting in those results is two wins separates 3rd from 12th. In otherwords, the East is still wide open. Any team that can find a way to improve could suddenly become a contender, especially if there are a few upsets in the playoffs and a team like Pittsburgh gets knocked out.

    • --Habs-- says:

      Chris don’t want to burst your bubble but they haven’t been playing well all year! But I can have a conversation over a beer to describe the words “Play Well”. There was the Chicago game that we thought was a good game but now I’m wondering how bad Chicago really was vs how good we were. The Bruins game was good although I sat behind PB for 2 periods and he made some amazing saves and we can thank the lord the Bruins don’t have top notch goal scorers becaue that game would have been a different outcome. What other game tinking back. Maybe the Leafs game early on in the season! I’m trying to think really really hard here!

      “Habs” Watch and learn….! Or Not!

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Thanks for crunching the numbers Chris, and it confirms my gut feeling. The Canadiens were a pleasant surprise and over-achieved early in the season, now their luck has turned, injuries have chipped away at the depth, and we’re going through an under-achieving spell. Opponents have figured out P.K. and Andrei, and the team scoring, the three lines that we snapped our suspenders about earlier, when teams didn’t know who to check against, Lars’ or Tomas’ or David’s line, that’s gone dead too.

      I think this is the team we have. We’re not getting Matt Moulson or Jamie McGinn to rescue us for a playoff run. If we get out of this slump and start rolling again. If not, tough.

      Lots of posters bemoaning Marc Bergevin’s ‘terrible’ decisions, but I’m very happy that he’s been strong on the big stuff. He’s beefed up our player development and scouting, he’s stockpiling and hanging on to draft picks, and he’s not mortgaging the future for immediate help. Douglas Murray, George Parros, Davis Drewiske, Jaromir Jagr, even Daniel Brière, that’s all fringe stuff. It won’t really affect the big picture. The central pillar, unloading bad contracts letting the kids learn the game in the minors, that’s happening right now.

  42. CJ says:

    I’m hoping White can have a positive impact on the team tonight. I know, what can a fourth line centre possibly do?

    White’s return will take added pressure off of others on the PK. He is solid defensively and a good face off man. People suggest that no player has improved under Therien, but I find White much better this season. I’m not laying praise blindly on Therien, but this is an example, albeit an a pretty exclusive one, of a player who has taken a step forward this season.

    There is no doubt in my mind that Briere is a much better player then White, but IMO, White is a much better fit as our fourth line centre.

    Having a fourth line that can extend a shift in the offensive zone through an effective cycle down low helps to wear down the opposition’s defence. Containing play in the offensive zone reduces stress and strain on our defence and helps build the foundation for a win. I’d love to see 8:00-10:00 minutes from our fourth line tonight.

  43. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    Weise is a fourth liner and will play as one. Brings us some depth for games like tonight’s were Moen is hurt.

    That’s it, that’s all. And to me, that’s fine return for a guy who was going to walk for nothing on July 1

  44. Un Canadien errant says:

    I will state again that after a few seasons of watching Dale Weise play, hoping/expecting that he’ll be anything more than a fringe fourth liner is much too optimistic. Sure, he could surprise us, but that would be us getting lottery lucky.

    Again, the Canucks have been searching for an appropriate right winger for the Sedin brothers for a decade or so. If Dale Weise had any kind of skill or productivity, he’d have been plunked down on their right a long time ago. But no, Mr. Weise played on the fourth line exclusively. Even if we take into account the poor relationship with John Tortorella, he didn’t fare any better under Alain Vigneault. To think he can be “the answer” for David and Max, or that he’ll turn our third line into a scoring line, is not realistic.

    Our expectations for Dale Weise should be that he’ll skate and play hard on the fourth line, he’ll crash and bang and cause some havoc, but will frustrate us with how few of the scoring opportunities he creates he actually cashes in.

    ———————————————————————–
    … you know, because there’s no way hundreds of overcompetitive stars with massive egos would ever cheat to gain an edge with hundreds of millions of dollars at stake.–Bill Simmons

    http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

    • WindsorHab-10 says:

      I’ll take him over Diaz anytime. At least he protects his teammates. Win win.

      • johnnylarue says:

        If by protecting his teammates you mean he absorbs copious amounts of punches with his face on their behalf, then yes, I suppose he “protects” his teammates…

        Anyone here old enough to remember Tom Kostopoulos? Here is his heir apparent–only bigger, and lacking the above-average defensive acumen of the former.

        But hey, I agree with the general sentiment that Weise in return for Diaz is, literally, better than nothing.

        • WindsorHab-10 says:

          Only time will tell. We’ll see.

          • johnnylarue says:

            No, seriously–Dale Weise has yet to win a fight in the NHL. And he’s fought a lot.

          • CJ says:

            He is not a great fighter granted, but he has won fights.

            I’m not expecting him to come in here and punch his way into the lineup. I’m hoping he is Mike Blunden (speed and size), with more grit and skill. I’d honestly like to see what he can do, given an opportunity on our third line. It’s a gamble, which might result in a bust, but at 25 there could also be some upside.

          • johnnylarue says:

            CJ, this isn’t really my bag, but I wasn’t able to find a single decision better than a “Draw” on his Hockey Fights page… (Out of the ~20 fights I looked at.)

    • Cal says:

      So, he’s Higgins with a lesser cap hit. Nothing wrong with that.

    • krob1000 says:

      Um does the fact the Canucks have been searching for someone to play with the Sedins for over a decade not infer that they are more the problem? If that many players have been unable to play with them…maybe those players aren’t the problem…
      Nobody expects the kid to light it up…but if he can add 10-15 goals and some grit to a top line the net effect with the trickle down would be a huge bonus. Factor in the speed and defensive side of his game, his toughness and the fact he makes less than a million and the effects go beyond what he offers if it does work out that he can capture a top 9 role…..and it doesn’t have to be this year.
      Worst case scenario he is as responsible defensively as any of Bourque/Prust and Moen..and better offensively and faster as well….and the cheaper is a huge plus as well as having some size on the right size (size that isn’t playing out of position). This move may not seem significant and may never prove to be all that significant but there is more to it than the stats will say …no matter what the HAbs got soemthing for a player they weren’t using, they got a kid who is a far better gamble than trading Diaz for a 3rd round pick, he is at the perfect age to see if he turns out, he has some serious speed and a change of scenery may help him out.
      No matter how you slice it the deal is a win…even if Diaz goes on to at op 4 role we weren’t able to afford him and his status as a UFA meant getting nothing or somethig minimial in return…Weise could potentailly fill a void and at worst is an upgrade at the bottom end.

      • johnnylarue says:

        Sorry to harp on this krob, but what part of “26 points in 162 NHL games” suggests this kid has any offensive upside?

        • krob1000 says:

          The 12 points in 7 min a game? does this mean Bournival has no offensive upside? he is outscoring Bourque, Prust and Moen this year as well. He also scored 28 goals in the AHL at age 22…not easy to do. I am not saying the kid is going to be a 30 goal guy…but he could be what we thought Bourque was going to be or what someone like Benoit Pouliot is right now…he saves money, is a fast, big guy who wnats an offensive role…
          Someone posted an incredible stat the other day…he gets more points per minute than DD who gets offensvie zone starts, first unit pp and top wingers on team…and Wweise had the most d starts on his team and got 7 mins a game …..there is plenty to believe there could be upside here…quite honestly not sure how anyone cannot see this is a gamble worth taking….

          • johnnylarue says:

            I hear what you’re saying. And ultimately, I think you’ll see where I’m coming from once you’ve watched him play a few games. This is not a player who exudes “diamond in the rough” to me…

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        krob, the Sedins take a lot of crap from people that is completely undeserved, so I usually reply when someone takes a cheap shot. It seems most people’s image of them is of being punched by Brad Marchand with impunity, and that somehow that demeans them, instead of demeaning the Bruins creep, or the NHL and its impotent refereeing.

        The Sedins are warriors and good citizens of Vancouver who are involved in the community. They would be much bigger stars if they played their games in the Eastern time zone. They have racked up points and been leaders of the Canucks for years, despite having to sustain slashes and hooks and trips and other indignities, yet never losing their cool or discipline.

        There is no inference that ‘they are the problem’, as you posit. They have made average players like Anson Carter or Alex Burrows into scoring stars when they played on their wing. If they had had the luxury of playing with an Erik Cole, an Alex Tanguay or a Jarome Iginla, their line would have been the most productive in the NHL by a wide margin.

        The fault definitely lies with three different GM’s, namely Brian Burke, Dave Nonis and Mike Gillis, who never realized the full potential of that line, by not paying the necessary price to outfit them with a big fast winger who can pot goals and maybe instill a little more respect in the opposition. More than the goalie situation or the search for a powerplay quarterback, this should have been job 1, it should have been taken care of years ago. Instead, the Canucks have gone a decade with patch jobs and experiments on their right wing.

        Since it wasn’t taken care of, the Sedins were a partially unrealized asset, and the Canucks, while they got full value from them personally, missed a great opportunity. Sure, a power forward is hard to find, they don’t grow on trees, but not getting one is like not fixing the transmission on your roadster since it costs a lot, and you can get into first and second and reverse anyway, so that’s all you really need…

        • krob1000 says:

          Not saying they are a “problem” in that sense..I like the Sedins and wanted MOntreal to go after hem when they were UFA’s ..I am saying they are linked together and play a two man game out there for the most part…nobody has been able to stay with them and remain and evolve with them. They are a great duo…but to say Weise isn’t capable of filling a need because he couldn’t play with one of the toughest duos in the league to play with isn’t fair either. Whoever plays with them has to do some grunt work, be able to read two minds that operate as one and stick up for them. They are naturally inlcined to look for each other out there..they have been doing it for decades..and doing it well…but nobody should be criticized for not being able to mesh with them..especially a kid with 2 seasons under his belt who is actually TOI and role

          • Un Canadien errant says:

            Good points. I wouldn’t say I’m criticizing Dale Weise, I appreciate him for what he is. He’ll be a good teammate and he’ll work hard. The Sedin example is strictly a counter to those who think he’ll be a candidate for top-line duty. The Canucks are more starved for forwards than we are, and they didn’t use him any higher on the roster than their fourth line.

            Another example might be the “American Express” line from a couple seasons back. The Canucks for twenty or thirty games struck gold when they put Chris Higgins and David Booth on the wings with Ryan Kesler. The three American players meshed instantly, they all could skate like nobody’s business, and other teams couldn’t keep up with them. Unfortunately, injuries broke that line apart, and David Booth hasn’t been able to get back in gear. This season the Canucks are desperate for secondary scoring, and tried every combo imaginable to get Ryan Kesler his own line apart from the Sedins.

            This could/should have been a great opportunity for Dale Weise to move up in the lineup and assume David Booth’s role on that line’s right wing. His speed and putative scoring ability would have come into play. Yet he was never given that chance, the coaches just don’t see enough from him in practice or games to think he’ll be able to accomplish that task.

            Sometimes things look good on paper but aren’t really workable on the ice.

            I do understand your point that his goal production per minute played warrants a closer look, but I’m tempted to think that it’s an artifact due to a small-sample size. I’ve seen quite a few Canuck games this season, and he hasn’t caught our eye as a guy who is effective and would score more if he had more chances, like Daniel Brière right now, or that he’s buzzing around the net creating chances and causing havoc, like René Bourque and Lars Eller the last couple of games.

    • 44har48 says:

      uhhhh I think this is obvious to most of us. We have no place for Diaz and now he has a chance to play and contribute somewhere. A draft pick in return would have been better in my mind, but hey, I won’t argue getting some more sand paper in the lineup.

      This is an insignificant transaction like most MB has done to this point. The real moves come this summer and when we get into the next two seasons.

      • 44har48 says:

        ..and I think you would be surprised how much the scoring woes would be alleviated if someone, anyone other than our smallest player(s), would go to the net and make it at least a little hard for the other team’s goalie to track the puck and see shots.

    • habs-fan-84 says:

      “To think he can be “the answer” for David and Max, or that he’ll turn our third line into a scoring line, is not realistic.”

      I don’t think anyone is expecting that.

    • bwoar says:

      Been watching him too. Totally concur, if we wan’t a fourth liner he’d be in Van right now.

      Still wish it was Sestito but eh, dems the brakes.

      “thoroughbred”

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        Yeah, Tom Sestito has as much a role to play in this transaction as Raphaël Diaz or Dale Weise. He’s the one who made Dale Weise expendable.

        The funny thing is, some thought that Tom Sestito would relieve Dale Weise of the need to punch it out with all comers, with heavyweights, kind of like George Parros did here with Travis Moen and Ryan White, and that it would allow Dale Weise to be more of a grinding winger who pots goals and fights on the odd occasion.

        Another big reason for the trade is that the Canucks lost both Chris Tanev and Kevin Bieksa to injury, which meant they had no right-handed defencemen at all, save for Yannick Weber, who has really struggled, and Frank Corrado, who was recalled from the AHL. So all of a sudden, Mr. Diaz was an acceptable alternative.

    • SteverenO says:

      @UCE :

      Until we find out otherwise I would not respect Torterella’s ability to evaluate a player’s performance any more than I do Therrien’s.

      If you said that Torterella tried Weise on the right wing with the Sedins, and he did not produce you would have a point .

      Torterella is a funny fella. Weise has been on the ice for the same number of PP goal as Higgins. ONE. Weise has seen 3:48 on the PP Higgins has played more than 90 minutes with the man advantage. Torterella idea to “fix” one of the worse PPs in the NHL was to move Higgins from the second wave to the first, At that time he had played 80 minutes on PP unit and the team had scored but one goal.

      Read my blog post; Vancouver PowerPlay in DisArray

      regards,

      Steve O.

      http://www.hockeydata-central.com/blog/

  45. WindsorHab-10 says:

    Would love to see a 4th line that remains intact no matter what consisting of 3 of the 4 players White, Prust, Bournival or Weise. Your thoughts.

    • monmick says:

      Like Boston’s Thornton-Paillé-Campbell; of course, barring any suspensions…

      ~~~> Mathematically eliminated…

    • Ghosts of the Forum says:

      I wouldn’t mind seeing Bournival getting some more, consistent, top 9 minutes. He’s shown he can score.

      And then, White, Prust, Weise and Moen as your rotating fourth line.

      Moen has been good this year — kills penalties, can shut down guys. I know his hands are deplorable, but if we’re looking to him for scoring then…..

  46. billylove says:

    Find all the suggestions of line combo’s interesting though it seems to me this roster could be shuffled forever without producing anything other than a second rate, popgun attack.

  47. shiram says:

    Bruce Garrioch ‏@SunGarrioch

    Mike Babcock tells Hockey Central at noon he will split two goalies in first two games in Sochi.

    • Ghosts of the Forum says:

      That seems weird: what is he hoping to learn from games against Norway and Austria?

      I say start the hot hand and stay with him unless he falters against Finland.

      • Habsrule1 says:

        How do we start with the hot hand before a game is played?

        I say do exactly what he is doing. Whoever looks best in the games, combined with how focused and ready they seem to be in practice, should be the starter against Finland and beyond, barring a catastrophe in nets.

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • monmick says:

          Hot hand (leading up to…), obviously….

          ~~~> Mathematically eliminated…

          • Habsrule1 says:

            Well, it may be obvious, but I don’t think what happens in the NHL should really have much impact on the decision in Sochi. Believe it or not, a goalie can be really good here and stink it up on European ice due to the size. That is not an exagerration either. I think Babcock is aware of that and that is why he will judge them almost entirely on how they look in practice and in the first 2 games. Not a huge sample size, I agree, but that is what he intends to do, I think. I also think tha is the right way to go about it. I also think that even if Price looks a little better, he’ll start with Luongo unless and until he seriously faulters.

            That said, I’d probably lean towards Price, myself. I’m looking forward to seeing him in meaningfull games with a far above average team in front of him.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • Ghosts of the Forum says:

          Yes, sorry — hot hand in the NHL.

          I just think it’s going to be awfully tough to gauge anything against those two teams.

          Also assuming that given it’s the Olympics, both will be intense and focused. But it’s a good point, if one starts to stand out in practice, that could be an indicator.

  48. 25 while im alive says:

    Weise eller chucky
    Maybe soon

  49. RetroMikey says:

    Off topic, but I don’t understand the Citizenship process being run in this country of ours in Canada.
    My brother in law (who is employed full time, pay his taxes, owns his own house and car) is waiting almost 4 years to get the good news he is Canadian.
    How the heck can they speed up the process for this American athlete who knows absolutely nothing about Canada and grant her this status so she can participate in the Olympics.

    Check the link below ……..read the stories…..make your call. Is it fair?

    https://twitter.com/ResidencyQ

    and the athlete who bypassed the system and leaving others still waiting.

    http://www.thestar.com/sports/sochi2014/figureskating/2013/12/17/sochi_2014_piper_gilles_lands_canadian_citizenship.html

    “We will win the Cup one day only with ? in the nets “

  50. AceTen says:

    re-post from previous thread:

    There’s been some talk on here this morning of trying out Weise on the DD line. I actually think this is a great idea, mainly because it would allow us to reunite the EGG line (once Chucky is back). With that line together we had two forwards in the top 10 scoring leaders. Currently our highest ranked forward is Pacioretty, he’s at 100th in the league with 33 points (not going anywhere with that kind of production). Would love to see these lines:

    Bournival – Pleks – Gio
    Patches – DD – Weise
    Chucky – Eller – Gally
    Moen – Prust – Bourque

    That would leave us with Briere, Parros and White to sub in as needed. It would also give us three legitimate scoring lines. Of course this will never happen but it doesn’t hurt to dream.

    • Habs_101 says:

      At this point we might as well trade RB for anything, he doesn’t have a place with this version of the Canadiens… Weise now is a natural on the right side, actually outscoring Borque this season, and much more physical by all accounts, keep White on the fourth and scratch Borque in my opinion when healthy…

      Patch – DD – Weise (scoring line)
      Chucky – Eller – Gally (scoring line)
      Bournival – Plek – Gionta (shutdown line)
      Prust – White – Moen (energy)

      In times where these lines are struggling, Borque, Briere and Parros can be substituted into the lineup. Just my opinion, but I like your idea with the Weise experiment anyways…

      GO HABS GO!

      • AceTen says:

        Very true, I wish we could unload Bourque and Briere as they are both useless. They are tieing up 8 mil of cap space that could be put to far better use. I still believe Bourque can be moved. Obvioulsy we wouldn’t get much for him but right now his salary is a waste.

        I also really hope they buy out Briere in the summer. The only reason I wouldn’t is if he lights it up in the playoffs (if we even make the playoffs). Some people on here were saying if we buy him out, there would only be a 1 mil cap hit (or somewhere around there) next season. If that’s the case I say do it!

    • Ghosts of the Forum says:

      Weise is a fourth liner. No way he should be on that line.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      Did I miss something? Why would Weise EVER be in our top 6?!?

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • AceTen says:

        To be honest this team does not have a top 6. Those 3 lines are interchangable and ice time could be split evenly. We could play the pleks like against other team’s top lines. That would allow us to play our real scoring lines (DD and EGG line) against their weaker lines. On the PP we could sub Briere or Bourque in for Weise.

  51. Forum Dog says:

    Glad to see Whitey back. Him and Weise together = a couple of Manitoba boys running around causing trouble. If they can keep the puck away from their net, they’ll be a nice 4th line.

  52. New says:

    Hey good luck tonight to Weise and the returning White. Make those five minutes count. Pull a Beaulieu and take someone’s job away…and grab their bigger slice of the pie.

    • Habfan17 says:

      I don’t think it is a good idea to put Whitey, who will be rusty after being out injured, with a new guy, who hasn’t had time to get to know the system or players. Although, the way MT moves players around is bound to make Weise’s head spin. I would rather they put Prust with White and Briere, and move Weise up with Eller and Bournival

      Habfan17

      • bwoar says:

        I get what you’re saying, but it’s not like he has to play PP, or do anything particularly cerebral. There’s no mystery to chasing loose pucks, laying hits and going to the net.

        “thoroughbred”

        • Habfan17 says:

          Very true, I guess I would also like to see what Weise could do on the 3rd line with a bit more ice time. His production with limited time is not bad and if he is that fast, it would be fun to see more of him!

          Habfan17

  53. Say Ash says:

    So we picked up David Clarkson’s production for an eighth of the salary. Is that about right?

  54. Timo says:

    Other than the Diaz trade, some please catch me up on the last 10 days.

  55. SteverenO says:

    re poisted form previous thread:

    If not for my lack of confidence in Therrien’s ability to put , and keep, together 4 effective lines I would say that the team is almost in a position to compete with the top teams in the eastern conference:

    Here’s why I am optimistic:

    Briere/Plek/Gionta – most productive line this season. let them play
    Galchenyuk/Eller/Gallagher= reunite the EGG line
    Pacioretty/DD/Weise– Speed and size on the wing frees up #11
    Prust/White/Bournival/ Solid 4th line
    ————————————
    spare parts;;;

    Moen/Bourque/Parros/Leblanc/Dumont/Thomas/, etc.

    On the defensive side ; just as Beaulieu has shown that he is an improvement over Bouillon (and Diaz), I am confident that Tinordi and/or Patteryn would prove to be an improvement over Murray.

    Considering how poorly Murray skates, it is amazing how well he performs, but his (lack of) speed is simply too much of a liability in today’s fast paced game. I would love it if he become our defensive coach. His anticipation of the play, hockey instinct and intelligence is beyond compare.

    Although he is “touted” as a stay at home defensive, defenseman , Patteryn he has 7 goals (Bulldogs team leader has 9) 3 of them on the PP.

    regards,

    Steve O.

    • Steeltown Hab says:

      Just sad that lines that make sense don’t manifest.

      Can’t fathom a situation where DD doesn’t play with Pacioretty and Gallagher unless we acquire a stud better than Gallagher to ensure DD looks good.

      ———————————

      Lars, PK, Galchenyuk, Gallagher, Emelin, Bournival, De La Rose – @J_Perez22

    • The Jackal says:

      Hey Steven, appreciate your lengthy, thought-out posts.
      I wish I were as optimistic as you about the current lineup, and if I may say so, I’d venture to say that you’re basing this optimism on some statistical analysis of the kind you post here. As a disclaimer I’d like to say I appreciate stats and advanced stats, and I think that in the right context, they elucidate a lot about players and team performance and can help make changes and tuneups. However, I also think that stats miss various factors that are not measured as on-ice events, mainly intangibles but also tangible factors.

      For example, you note that your first line above has been the most productive, and I’m guessing your measure is goals per TOI or something similar. No doubt Briere has scored some clutch goals this year, but his line and DD’s line are often exposed because of the lack of size, and though unprovable, I’d go as far as saying that if those guys on our team were bigger, their stats would be even better.

      In the end, I don’t think stats measure the effect that bigger players can have, be it intimidation or opening up the ice or establishing a forecheck better. But when we watch the games, it is painfully clear that although we have talented players, we don’t have the right mix of players. Our top two lines can be shut down by the use of sheer size and also by the use of good coverage, and we are too small to win most physical battles for the puck.

      ______________________
      Hockey sine stercore tauri.

      • SteverenO says:

        @Jackal :

        Thanks for the kind words, and a well written post.

        I can<t disagree with anything you say and even though it may seem like it, I don't think that analyzing stats (and assembling the "optimal" combos based on data analysis alone) can turn a weak team into a contender.

        My frustration stems from the fact that the Habs (with Price playing his best) have shown that they ARE capable of beating most any team they play on a regular basis DESPITE the fact the coach is not just ignoring the players past performances but actually making personnel and ice time decisions that are completely opposite to what the data indicates would be best for team,

        Combing his ignorance of the performance metrics with the fact that he shuffles players and line combos that are doing well just as much as he does those that are not producing.

        There is no question that winning physical battles for th epuck is a critical part of the game, but when a team is not built for winning the "physical " battles they MUST rely on speed and puck possession.

        The statistics do not lie, but they don't always tell the whole story.

        It<s impossible to tell from "goals per minute of ice time" whether line is winning more puck battles than they are losing or simply capitalizing on a high percentage of their opportunities at an unusually high rate, but does it really matter?

        What is the alternative to using using performance metrics and relying on goals scored and allowed by player and line combo?

        Does anyone really believe that Therrien, or the majority of NHL coaches, have the ability to make accurate decisions as to which combination of players are most likely to "win the most battles" and even if they did will that result in the maximum potential for goals scored and the fewest goals allowed?

        How does it help if a player such as Murray wins 100% of physical battles yet the team only scores one goal every 79 minutes when he is on the ice while allowing one goal against every 22 minutes?

        As an owner of a business would you tolerate a manager/decision maker who RARELY, or never, allowed a workgroup that has been successful to stay together, and also never allowed a new group the opportunity to gain some familiarity with each other?

        There is a coaching staff, in the NHL that continue to keep their jobs despite using a player on the PP for 90 minutes of ice time with the man advantage and the team has scored only ONE goal while he is on the ice. Does it matter how many puck battles he has won?

        regards,

        Steve O.

        http://www.hockeydata-central.com/blog/

        • The Jackal says:

          Good post, and I would agree that while our roster is not ideal, the coach has made some decisions that have not played to our strengths. But nonetheless, I think when you look at a player’s GF and GA per TOI, that is not that great an indicator because you need to look at everyone who is on the ice. Maybe Murray is not a contributor to the offense but who else is on the ice with him? The fourth line and another third pairing D, the PK… not really players or situations that create offense.

          I think Murray leaves something to be desired, but he has helped the team. Generating offense is not his job, and he’s been good on the PK and a good physical presence.

          ______________________
          Hockey sine stercore tauri.

    • thorandresson says:

      Re: You’re comment on Murray becoming D coach, I had the same thoughts about Gill…

    • Ghosts of the Forum says:

      Swap Bournival and Weise and I’m with you. I’d argue that Moen has been effective this year, would like to see him in the rotation on the fourth line, unless Weise demonstrates himself to be as good as he thinks he is.

  56. Habfan17 says:

    Not sure what goes through Therrien’s head. I would rather see
    Patches DD, Gallagher
    Bourque. Pleks, Gio
    Bournival, Eller, Weise
    Briere, White, Parros, since Moen is out. Briere can also play PP

    Habfan17

  57. The Jackal says:

    Pacioretty – Desharnais – Gallagher
    Brière – Plekanec – Gionta
    Bourque – Eller – Prust
    Bournival – White – Weise

    This lineup actually looks decent.
    As is the case, we lack size in the top 6, but that bottom 6 has grit and some scoring touch, if they play well and stick together throughout the season, we may be getting some good energy and secondary scoring from those guys.

    ______________________
    Hockey sine stercore tauri.

  58. The Jackal says:

    Are we really better now that Diaz is out of town?
    The reviews of the trade have been a mixed bag.
    One way we can know for sure if the trade is bad is if HABS-PROFESSOR says it is, since he hates Diaz and Weise is kind of a NAG guy – if this guy does not like the trade, you know something is up.

    ______________________
    Hockey sine stercore tauri.

  59. jon514 says:

    A very Weise Decision by the coach!

  60. Chris says:

    I see that Nik Kulemin is being dangled by the Leafs…he and Clarke MacArthur were always guys that I thought were heavily undervalued because they played with the Leafs. Kulemin had that one big offensive year, paired with MacArthur and Grabovski, but has struggled offensively since then, although part of that can be traced to the Leafs dismal centre depth.

    Kulemin is an excellent defensive player that has shown he can score. I would be interested to see him and Eller on a line together, perhaps with a guy like Bournival.

    Now I expect a flurry of posts about how he sucks. :)

  61. prep says:

    CHicken Fried Weise!!

  62. HabinBurlington says:

    Will Putin care if the entire world laughs at how piss poor a job he did with these Olympics?

    http://deadspin.com/staying-in-sochi-is-a-hilarious-adventure-1515722114

    • shiram says:

      Olympics makes a mess of any city, but when that city was already a mess, and a Russian mess… well it reminds me of polishing a turd.

    • HabFab says:

      Very third world but was good for a chuckle.

    • RetroMikey says:

      No, Putin won’t care and neither should we but respect the host nation organizing the Winter Olympics.
      When you are in another country, respect their rules and customs whether you are an athlete or not.
      Putin will have the last laugh.

      “We will win the Cup one day only with ? in the nets “

    • arya13 says:

      While the article points out many inadequacies in preparation for the Olympics. The main picture is a bit of a cultural Red Herring.

      Many countries don’t allow toilet paper to be flushed down the toilet, it’s not because they bought shitty toilets (see what I did there), but because the entire water system can’t handle it (pipes are too small, pumping stations too weak, purification systems lacking in technology).

      I think it’s culturally ignorant to mock a country for having alternative habits due to a lack of infrastructure. Some hotels not being finished in time for the games? Giant joke. All the hotels being unable to accept toilet paper? A reality most people outside of the Western World deal with each day.

  63. Steeltown Hab says:

    Bourque – Eller – Prust is a Pre-2004 lockout type of 3rd line.

    Not a new NHL 3rd line. Bournival and Briere clearly belong in the top 9. You place 1 with Pleks and 1 with this line.

    Basic logical decisions, painfully difficult for MT. I could even give a pass if it was Weise not Prust on the 3rd bc you’re giving an acquisition a shot. This is just re-icing the same ineffective line.

    ———————————

    Lars, PK, Galchenyuk, Gallagher, Emelin, Bournival, De La Rose – @J_Perez22

    • Forum Dog says:

      I’m not even sure Bournival should be in the NHL at this point. Playing 4th line minutes does not help his offensive game, and he has enough that they should be trying to bring it along. As good a skater as he is, I haven’t found him to be all that effective physically. If they are grooming him for a 3rd or 4th line role, fine. But what he is currently providing could just as easily be provided by Weise, Bourque, Prust and Moen.

  64. habs001 says:

    Unless the Habs add some scoring forwards this season this team has to win most games 2-1, 3-2..Management realizes this…Again i have to say beyond Borque every other forward is pretty well on pace to score the number of goals i expected…There is no magic line combinations or ice time that will increase goal scoring on this team…

    • Cal says:

      How about the Habs throw 8 men on the ice?

    • shiram says:

      Keeping Brière and Bournival in the top 9 would be advisable to help scoring. Neither of them are really suited for a 4th line role, and both can produce some.

      • habs001 says:

        Not sure that by playing Briere more minutes he can score more…Many shifts he seems physically overwhelmed..he is just not the same player he was…Bournival is young and i am not sure if he is a scorer..he had success early but he produced a lot of points on minimal chances and even some lucky points…he has to be able to generate more chances than he has to keep producing…on the other hand the Leafs since last year have scored on less chances than most teams and it keeps continuing…

        • shiram says:

          Brière needs a sheltered role, but that’s not happening, DD’s got a strangle hold on the easy minutes.
          But having either of Brière or Bournival on the 4th is kind of wrong, they don’t fit the mold of a 4th line role at all.

          Brière for the little TOI he gets does manage to produce some, but he has to be sheltered, I just don’t think playing with Pleks and Gio is the best, but it’s a compromise.

          Bournival is just looking for his chance I think, and as people are asking for Weise to get top 9 minutes, I still feel Bourni should be getting some too.

          The kid’s been told to get an apartment in Mtl at the start of the season, I doubt they send him back to Hamilton, even with the player crunch.

        • The Jackal says:

          Yeah that Leafs trend is annoying, but then again they are getting those goals from Kessel, JVR, Kadri the Rat 2.0, and Lupul – pretty good scorers who are more naturally talented in putting the puck behind the net than our guys are, unfortunately.
          Also, Leafs get a lot of rushes and a lot of their goals come from a rush or a mistake by the other team rather than sustained pressure.
          Not a recipe for long-term success. Now, if they managed to get a good forecheck going, watch out!

          ______________________
          Hockey sine stercore tauri.

      • Forum Dog says:

        Bournival has 12 points in 48 games, and has not scored since November 19th. He is also a -5 in his last 15 games. I don’t think he is the answer to Montreal’s top-six scoring problems. At least not this year…..

  65. Stimpy007 says:

    We should be playing Parros in this game.

    We now have Weise, White and Parros all righties! I doubt they will ever all play together?

  66. Mavid says:

    Whiteys back…I like it alot…

    Weed Wacker Grandma Smurf

  67. jols101 says:

    Finally got around to checking out some video on Weise. He is very much a human punching bag. He makes Moen look like Ali.

    Real good skater, very fast and has decent hands in tight for a grinder. Anyways, I don’t think we are any better with him in the lineup and Moen out of the lineup. I’m just happy Diaz isn’t an option anymore. Hope this is a trend of moving out the small and soft.

    • New says:

      Maybe they got him to play hockey and not just get punched out? :-) You never know, they might have been looking for a hockey player. Sounds like that’s what he wants to do. Like Gallagher. Play hard, play rough, but join a MMA club if he wants to fight for a living.

  68. durocher says:

    According to John Lu, Moen is also sitting:

    Pacioretty – Desharnais – Gallagher
    Brière – Plekanec – Gionta
    Bourque – Eller – Prust
    Bournival – White – Weise

  69. krob1000 says:

    Hmmm…so who is sitting? Briere? Bourque? Moen?

  70. adamkennelly says:

    Habs should be harder to play against w/ White and Weise (I learned how to spell it – gonna take some practice to get it right all the time).

    Lets hope McGratton doesn’t smear Gallagher – cause if he does – then Prust is gonna have to fight him and that won’t be good.

  71. Bripro says:

    Tres!
    Or for our Russian friends!
    три

  72. krob1000 says:

    if a post was posted by desertman and noone was there to read it did it really ever get posted?

  73. Habsrule1 says:

    His stats and everything I have read about him suggest he’s a 4th liner, but I hope he’s more. How much were we expecting for a guy who hasn’t played for the last 8 games anyway?

    I like it and I haven’t seen him play (or remember seeing him play).

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  74. Cal says:

    Hey Kreskin, got the 6/49 numbers for tomorrow night?

  75. Mattyleg says:

    C’mon, cheer up!

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  76. Luke says:

    soooooooo around 200 goals and probably 500 points or so?

    interesting… i’d be ok with that

  77. Cal says:

    That would be amazing!

  78. JohnBellyful says:

    I wouldn’t pay him any attention.
    That guy’s a nutbar.

  79. shlamiel says:

    The deal fell through no trade.


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