Sunday argument-starter

Emelin
If Chris Campoli draws into the Canadiens’ lineup, who sits?
The Russian Bear, Alexei Emelin?
Swiss Mr., Raphael Diaz?
And what happens if/when Andrei Markov returns?
Does Emelin stay on D and Diaz become the new Mark Strei Lite, dressing as a forward/Dman in place of his countryman, Yannick Weber?

Questions, questions and more questions.

We at HIO wish we had answers.

And maybe we do. But a full football schedule (plus Stoke City vs. surprising Tottenham) on the tube beckons, so the Commentariat can work this out.

Be nice! Both the Bear and Mr. have been pretty darn good for first-year defencemen.

Pat Hickey’s game story

Pierre Ladouceur’s game report card (Emelin and Diaz: 6.8 each)

François Gagnon on Pierre Gauthier’s brilliant acquisition

Kaberle loved Montreal even before he got here

474 Comments

  1. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …I wonder if Carey is destined to be Our Tebow :) ? …and make the seeming impossible …possible
    …and, speakin’ o’ futbol …My Packers 13-0 ! …hmmm Bart WHO ??? …Brett WHO ???
    …another Packer great QB in Rodgers …but ouff !, losing Greg Jennings will be tough

    Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
    http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

    • chemic says:

      haha but only if the Bruins trade for Marion Barber and their Defense Coordinator who decided to play that stupid prevent d#.

    • Lawrencetown Liquor Pigs says:

      Greg Jennings injury might end an undefeated fantasy season for me. Truly painful.

      ____________________________________________________
      They lost me 2 quarts of rum, better make it up next year with a cup!

    • HabinBurlington says:

      What about Lynn Dickey, you can’t leave him out!

    • Cam_1 says:

      Sorry to tell you…as much as I love the Habs ..and we are on same page on that…let me just put it this way…The Green Bay Packers are my Boston Bruins of the NFL …HATE THEM !!!!! *PUKE* …God I pray they don’t repeat. Go undefeated the regular season..will be all that much more satifying when they don’t win the SuperBowl !!! Hate them !

  2. chartraw27 says:

    Emelin must play. Weber, I wouldn’t cry if they traded him. They have too many of the same size, same skill set type of players on the team. We can’t keep them all and expect to compete with the bigger teams. Do we keep Weber and ditch Diaz or vice-versa? Campoli ? He is no allstar. The same issue exists up front. Lots of small shifty guys. The two best forwards right now are Pacioretty and Cole. They are not small and shifty. Gomez, Gionta and Cammalerri are all small and shifty and struggling. What to do?
    That Gomez for Stajan and Bourque trade sounds crazy but who know what could happen. Bourque has been in the doghouse a bit and Stajan has been a healthy scratch so who knows. I am not saying it will happen but trades don’t always happen because of skill set. Sometimes it is pure dollars and cents and term. I highly doubt that trade happens. Montreal would have to sweeten the pot in order to get someone to take Gomez. Maybe Weber and a pick to get rid of him. who knows? Should be interesting in the next few weeks. Hope for a win on Tuesday. Nah, I am feeling positive. 3 wins 0 losses this week.

  3. Marc10 says:

    Weber is not in the conversation. That leaves Campoli, Diaz and Emelin. None really offer significant offensive upside and they’re pretty average defensively. That leaves shot blocking and laying the smack down.

    The Russian Bear wins. Let the other two fight it out for the coveted Mark Streit Memorial 4th Line 7th D Spot…

    • nunacanadien says:

      Emelin provides the grit and the toughness we lack under the fairy leadership of that queer Gauthier and his equally unwilling to get his hands dirty Jacques Martin and their dream to have no contact NHL hockey and no penalties……Maybe we should reconsider Campoli, package him with Spacek and Gomez and you’ll have solved our wimpy smurf problem. Of course that doesn’t resolve the line of Gionta, but that should also send a message to Cammy that we are bulking up to support him. It is sad when one small smurf like Cammy has to go to the defense of the other smurf Gomez…..once these wimps of Gomez, Campoli and Spacek come back, we’ll be back to the horrible Jacques Martin five on five wimpy hockey that cost us a good start this year and the stanley cup last year.

  4. Trisomy 21 says:

    I didn’t watch the scrimmage but apparently Beaulieu stood out in the game, got an assist too. As Darth Sidius would say “Goooooood. Gooooooood”

    Nothing on Gallagher or Bournival though

    • habsfansince91 says:

      I watched a bit of the scrimmage and felt that Gallagher played fairly well. He’s always around the puck making plays in both the defensive zone and offensive zone.

      Didn’t notice Bournival much.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      I think Brendan Gallagher is a lock, the Team Canada coach is Don Hay, his Junior coach with the Giants, so he knows what he can do.

      Looking at the Preview show on TSN, Bob McKenzie did a good job of showing what kind of tough competition Nathan Beaulieu and Michaël Bournival will be up against. He mentioned that Nathan was one of many who had a shot at two ‘remaining’ spots on the blueline. He didn’t mention Mr. Bournival’s name, but stated that there would be more spots available at forward depending on how many current NHL’ers were released to play in the tournament.

      ———————————
      How about it NHL? No fighting, just hockey?

      http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

      • Trisomy 21 says:

        That’s interesting, only 2 spots on D that aren’t locks? I kind of want to see this video now.
        I heard about Don Hay being coach, but I’d feel better knowing Gallagher earned the spot from out competing other candidates. I heard Bournival was the final cut last year, so hopefully this year he makes it.

        Edit: I watched a clip on TSN and Ferraro said that Gallagher impressed him, so take it for what it’s worth coming from him

      • nunacanadien says:

        Imagine a tandem of Gallagher and Emelin alongside the other tough guy Cole!

  5. bellcentre hotdog says:

    Young.
    Good size.
    Great hitter.
    Plays tough.
    Emelin has to stay.
    End of argument.

    • nunacanadien says:

      Gauthier and Martin would be stupid to send Emelin down. They would be stupid not to keep Emelin in the lineup. Without Emelin Cole is the only other occasional hard hitter. With Emelin, Cole can at least hit back knowing someone else is making sure the Habs are not pushed around.

  6. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …I really like Diaz, and it is regrettable We are talking about sending Him to Hamilton or trading Him, because I think He is acclimatizing Himself to the NHL very quickly

    …I believe in speed, quickness, skill and intelligence is far more effective (aka …SPEED KILLS !!!) than size and brute ability to put someone through the boards whether on D as well as O

    …Emelin is a given, and should stick because He is providing the physicality, but yet is not simply a one-dimensional ‘bruiser’

    …I think Diaz has so far outplayed Weber, and has more latent-long-term potential, …Yannick will make some other team a good 3 to 6 defenseman, especially because He is now on a one-way contract and would be lost on waivers

    …considering how decimated and rebuilding Our defense has been this season, Our D has performed remarkably in-spite of it’s lack of NHL ‘experience’ …I don’t think anyOne knowledgeable would say Our recent ‘young’ D of PK, Gorges, Diaz, Weber, Emelin and St. Denis were not as effective or better (as a group) than at least 15 to 20 of the other 30 NHL teams

    …Kaberle, in My opinion, will be mediocre if not a liability in the defensive-zone, simply because He does not seem to have the ‘compete-level’ in the D-zone like Diaz or Weber …despite Kaberle’s many more years of ‘experience’ compared to these so-called ‘Swiss-cheeses’

    …yet, watching Kaberle’s smooth control and vision in the offensive-zone is a sight for sore eyes and will be essential to Our game while waitin’ for Godot (…I mean Markov), and for any chance to make the post-season

    …a healthy and productive Markov is still a large question-mark at this moment in time, but a healthy and productive Markov with a Kaberle, and the potential of a PK, makes for run-away visions of offensive production and excitement, especially with the man advantage (…though that is still yet to be confirmed in ‘The Real World’)

    …with an abundance of capable surplus defensemen, and with several teams like Anaheim and Tampa Bay hurting defensively, it seems like an ideal opportunity for Pierre Gauthier to at least trade (Campoli & Weber ?) for draught-picks, a prospect or a badly-needed physical 4th line stud

    Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
    http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

  7. Neutral says:

    The eastern division is so tight – losing streaks could cause you a playoff spot – the first 11 teams – anyone of them could beat the other – no team is safe – just hope the habs don’t lose to the weaker teams no matter what division or they’ll be doomed by the end of January 2012.

    • nunacanadien says:

      Such as when the Molsons decide to play Gomez constantly along with Campoli and Spacek….and watch as we get pushed aside while Emelin gets benched……and this Kaberle deal, honestly, sure the guy can make assists, maybe Kaberle will unfold as the hockey player we saw in the Olympics…or not. Maybe Kaberle would be our defensive version of Gomez. I don’t know what kind of advice Gainey and Gauthier are getting, sure we did great sticking with Emelin, the man was worth all this wait. But the others? So we have to wait for Gomez to evolve?

  8. LafleurFan says:

    How in the world are the Minnesota Wild in 1st place in the West?!

    “May you live in interesting times.”

    • jmsheehy19 says:

      Yoe’s a boss. Also ridiculous goaltending.

    • LafleurFan says:

      Anemic Lemaire/Martin type offence but wicked goaltending:
      Josh Harding, .932 save %, Niklas Backstrom .932, and 21 yr old former 3rd rounder Matt Hackett, .974.

      Carey is great, but there seems to an abundance of good goalies.

      “May you live in interesting times.”

      • savethepuck says:

        When you have 3 guys with #’s like that, I think it is more of a team thing. Even though I’m proud that a former Hab, Jeff Hackett’s nephew is doing well.

        “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
        Carey Price

      • DorvalTony says:

        He’s not that great. And it’s not Martin or Gauthier between the pipes in the shootouts. Price is 20th in the league great. Theodore is playing well, Halak’s had a terrific month and Elliott, that’s just sick. Great.

        ——————————–
        “The fish is rotten from the head.”

        • DorvalTony says:

          Sorry he’s now “up to” 16th in the league in stats

          http://www.nhl.com/ice/playerstats.htm?fetchKey=20122ALLGAGAll&sort=savePercentage&viewName=savePercentageLeaders

          ——————————–
          “The fish is rotten from the head.”

          • DorvalTony says:

            Goalies with better stats than “the great” Carey Price. No excuses. Black and white.
            1 Brian Elliott
            2 Tim Thomas
            3 Cory Schneider
            4 Nikolai Khabibulin
            5 Josh Harding
            6 Niklas Backstrom
            7 Henrik Lundqvist
            8 Jimmy Howard
            9 Jonathan Quick
            10 Tuukka Rask
            11 Kari Lehtonen
            12 Jean-Sebastien Giguere
            13 Mike Smith
            14 Jose Theodore
            15 Jhonas Enroth

            “Just sayin’…”

          • Natrous says:

            Maybe you should include an * for most games played (26)

          • shrack says:

            Here are the ages of the goalies you listed, 1)26, 2)37, 3)25, 4)38, 5)27, 6)24, 7)29, 8)27, 9)25, 10)24, 11)28, 12)34, 13)29, 14)35, 15)23. Carey Price is 24, and getting better every year. If you look at the youngsters- Schneider, Backstrom, Quick, Rask, Enroth and see how many games they have played: 15, 19, 23, 10, and 17 respectively.You will see that Price has played the most with 26 games. He is carrying the team. Black and white. You obviously don’t recognize a thoroughbred when you see one. Just sayin’

    • savethepuck says:

      Dallas was close to in the same position last year around this time, and didn’t make the playoffs. Just saying

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

  9. le_vrai_jacques says:

    Rangers up 6-1 against Panthers. Mcdonagh (McDoughnut?) minus 1…

  10. savethepuck says:

    Haven’t been on here since Thursday morning. The Kabarle deal was a head scratcher for me, only because of the 3 year term, because of the youth we have on D. I am sure PG has a plan and I’ll have faith. If Kabarle does well here until Marky comes back, which he will BTW, maybe he has good trade value.
    Can’t believe that the results in the poll are favoring that Marky doesn’t play a game this year for the Habs but the max value of him playing over 20 on the poll are a close 2nd. I think maybe people are thinking “why else would PG get Kabarle if Markov was coming back”. I don’t think that’s the case. I’m confident Marky will be back, even the guys on CBC Saturday afternoon were saying positive things about that.
    We will have a log jam on D tho, and I’m curious to see what happens then. I’m confident that Campoli will play a few games and be on the trade block because he was supposed to the Marky band-aid, he just has to show suitors that he’s healthy. It’ll be interesting here, but I trust our GM. I can’t complain about any decisions he’s made uptil now.
    Keeping Carey-check
    The Wiz as a band-aid when we were without Marky and Gorges followed by Sopel and Mara-check
    Signing Cole-check

    “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
    Carey Price

    • I voted for Markov not returning. I’m not in Montreal, I haven’t seen him practice and I haven’t heard one reporter say (while he was practicing) things like “he looks amazing”, or “looks like he’s in top form”.

      Not one update saying he’ll fit right in. Nothing. If the boys say he’s back, then Great.

      So until this guy is playing, I say he’s not coming back this season. When you’re out for this long, and then have aset back, logic tells me he should sit the remainder of the season out, get healthy, and play like he’s never played before. AKA Sidney Crosby ( I know concussions and that’s what he should do again).

      Shane Oliver
      http://www.Sholi2000.com
      Brandon, MB,Canada
      R7B 2R7
      hockey@sholi2000.com
      Ph- 204 724 8418

      • savethepuck says:

        According to what I’ve heard on here(except for the rumors), and from the HNIC crew Saturday, he could of returned and was cleared to return earlier. This scope on his knee was just a precautionary thing to clean up debris and scar tissue to be sure that he came back at 100%. I choose to trust that prognosis and expect him sometime between early and late January. I also heard reports that he looked great in practice when he was waiting for clearance just before the California trip.
        I will live by my words that Marky will make as many people on here eat crow as Carey Price did.

        “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
        Carey Price

      • LA Loyalist says:

        I have ripped you a new one on various topics, BUT, I want to be fair and thank you for a good post.

        re both Markov and Crosby, they both have to live long lives after hockey is over, and money is an issue for neither. If Markov is 100% yeah! Timing is unknown, and not looking good.

        What is bothering me is the timing. If Campoli was the Markov insurance (not Markov, of course, but a functional PP QB – why move on Kaberle if Campoli is about to come back?

        My only theory is that PG is stocking up D assets to make a big move on a forward from a seller team in March. The wrinkle in that theory is that Kaberle is a big, expensive risk, notwithstanding a good first game.

        Maybe he will gell with Habs and we can off-load Weber/Campoli/Diaz/Cammi for a photocopy of Eric Cole – I don’t know, what theories do you guys like (my alternate theory is PG is just out to lunch).

        The timing seems very strange.

        • savethepuck says:

          The reason the Kabarle signing had me scratching my head so much, was because I heard Campoli was day to day. I will still stand by my opinion that Marky will be back and heathy. We will then have a lot of D assets to make moves later. I trust that PG has a long term plan on this. I liked Kabarle’s 2 assists, but am not going to over analyze it based on 1 game. I trust our GM on what his long term plans are for this team. One thing I strongly think tho, is that unlike a lot of posters on here, this organization thinks they have an elite team with what they have, not a bubble playoff team. PG thought he had to get something now to keep this team in the running now, not for maybe 8th, but for challenging for at least a division title.

          “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
          Carey Price

    • The Juice says:

      Well said. Other good moves for PG:

      Not re-signing an aging Hamrlik
      Not re-signing the Wiz for to a ridiculously inflated contract

      __________________________________________________________________________

      “To you from failing hands we throw the torch, be yours to hold it high!”

  11. Un Canadien errant says:

    So the question is posed: who plays, who sits on the Canadiens defence corps when everyone’s healthy and rehabbed and we’re living in Happy-Land, in a gumdrop house on Lollipop Lane.

    In order of my depth chart:

    1) Andrei Markov comes back in time to play 35-40 games, mid to late-January, but takes five games off as Sidney Crosbyesque ‘maintenance games’, ideally during the second of back-to-back games. He is limited to 15 minutes a game for the first two weeks, and if his knee is 110% after that we increase him to a 20 minute maximum for the rest of the season. We outfit Mr. Martin with a shock collar that buzzes him when he exceeds these strict guidelines, since he does love his veterans, and who could blame him for being tempted?

    2) Pernell Karl Subban is a young buck, takes a licking and keeps on ticking, and plays every game and eats up minutes. Only hiccup is if he needs a Jacques Martin Pressbox Timeout™, which he will probably richly deserve if it happens. Randy Ladouceur is on his left shoulder like the Great Gazoo on Fred Flinstone, and directs his attention to Andrei whenever he’s on the ice, or at Nick Lidstrom or Dan Boyle or Duncan Keith when they’re the opposition.

    3) Josh Gorges gets lots of minutes and is on the first wave of the penalty kill, and whenever we’re protecting a lead at the end of the game.

    4) Alexei Emelin plays a tonne of minutes, and we give him time on the special teams. To borrow from Whitney, I believe that Alexei is our future, coach him well and let him lead the way.

    5) Tomas Kaberle is on the powerplay, and cross your fingers. Forgive him his sins, for (unbelievably) he (still, at this point in his career!) knows not what he does.

    6) Hall Gill gets a regular shift and PK minutes. He gets regular days off for a breather and to get ready for a playoff run.

    7) Yannick Weber sits some games, plays some games at forward/powerplay specialist on the blueline, and spells Andrei Markov and Hal Gill when they take their maintenance days. He gets constant encouragement and assurance that the team believes in him and he has a future here, that he’s still young and will become a regular. He’s coached up something fierce, gets lots of extra attention before and after practice.

    8 Chris Campoli is kept as insurance. Unfortunately, the insurance policy had a loophole and didn’t pay off when we needed it. He may get sent down to Hamilton, and may get claimed on waivers, and we wouldn’t mind too much if he did.

    9) Raphaël Diaz gets sent down to Hamilton since he is not subject to waivers. Unfair, since he’s playing well, but he isn’t Top 6 with everyone healthy. We only have room for 23 skaters, and he shouldn’t be in the pressbox constantly, so he goes to Hamilton and plays and plays and plays. He’s the first callup if we need injury help. Some will argue that he is outplaying Yannick Weber and should get to stay, but they’re essentially equal in production and what they provide to the team, and Yannick’s seniority means he’s subject to waivers, so Yannick’s not getting sent down to Hamilton.

    10) Frédéric St-Denis is the feelgood story in Hamilton.

    As far as pairings go, nothing too fancy:

    Gorges-Subban
    Markov-Emelin
    Gill-Kaberle

    Powerplay

    Markov-Weber
    Kaberle-Subban

    When Weber is in the pressbox, PK goes up to the first wave, and Alexei Emelin gets on the second wave.

    Penalty Kill

    Gill-Markov
    Gorges-Subban

    ———————————
    How about it NHL? No fighting, just hockey?

    http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

    • LafleurFan says:

      Dan Boyle, respectfully.

      “May you live in interesting times.”

    • LA Loyalist says:

      So in your interesting and nicely laid out scenario who gets traded in March to a contender to get us some offense?

      Or do Montreal Canadiens no longer care about offense?

      Did I miss that memo?

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        It depends on the offers and where we’re at at the deadline. Of course if we’re out of the playoffs then we’re sellers in a big way. Andrei Kostitsyn, Hal Gill, Josh Gorges and Travis Moen are going to be most interesting to buyers, and I’d let them all go for picks and prospects.

        If we’re in the playoffs then we have an obligation to give it a shot. If we have a surplus of healthy defencemen, then our tradeable assets are Tomas Kaberle, Chris Campoli, Raphaël Diaz, and Yannick Weber in my descending order of preference of who gets shipped out, in exchange for a rugged scoring winger. These guys would have to play very very well for us to receive anything of quality. I would not add in any picks or prospects, I’d rather take my chances with our roster rather than mortgage the future.

        ———————————
        How about it NHL? No fighting, just hockey?

        http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

    • Habsolutely says:

      Great analysis/summary dude. Very astute.

  12. andykirstein says:

    Emelin has to play. Period!
    Opposition forwards have become aware of his presence due to his physical play. No more free passes into our zone which somewhat slows up the opposition
    By adding Kaberle to the mix makes Diaz less required. Too many “soft” puck moving d-men. Emelin is “only” physical presence

    • savethepuck says:

      Think you have to trust the organization and coaching staff on this one, it’s obvious by Emelin’s increased minutes that he’s moved up a lot on our D depth chart. All fears about him early should be alleviated, they were just acclimatising him to the North American game.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

  13. showey47 says:

    You can watch the team canada red vs white game here. Its apparently free but you need to sign up first.

    http://hockeycanada.fasthockey.com/login.php

  14. ont fan says:

    The Habs are never healthy. Play the healthy vets until the next D gets hurt.Take some pressure off the kids for awhile.

  15. slapshot777 says:

    Anyone think Campoli will be in the lineup come Tuesday? I think until we get a full or most of our regular defensemen back in the lineup. Then we will see a little more speed from the Habs with a better breakout game.

    Also, teams won’t be so eager to jump on our veteran defensemen as they are willing to do now with our rookies in there.

    • nunacanadien says:

      What has Campoli ever delivered in the teams he’s gone to? Like Gomez, a flashy talker, but no action. No checks. No scores. Just fancy skating and passing the puck to an invisible lineman like Gomez. When will people realize that the Habs have decided or at least the owners have given the province of Quebec the big middle finger over taxes. Molson et al. are giving it back to the province. Sad part in all of this is fans end up paying for this. When will the rich ever think they pay enough taxes?

  16. I perfer the “D” pairings being like this until Markov gets 10-20 games under his belt. JM needs to ease Markov back in very slowly. Habs needs a very healthy Markov for a good playoff run.

    1st – Kaberle – Subban

    2nd – Gill – Gorges

    3rd – Markov – Yemelin

    Here are the fwd lines I like to see once everyone is healthy. JM needs to roll with 4 lines. Gomez and Moen used as 1st PK unit.

    1st Line – Cammalleri – Plekanec – Gionta

    2nd Line – Pacioretty – Deharnais – Cole

    3rd Line – A. Kostitsyn – Eller – Leblanc

    4th Line – Moen – Gomez – White

    • Nojo says:

      I would really like to see Kostitsyn,
      Eller and Leblanc be given a chance to compete for 5 games.

      You cannot spend your way out of recession or borrow your way out of debt

    • HardHabits says:

      I like it except that 1st line has been getting eaten alive as of late. Better to switch up Cammy and Patches so that both of the top lines has a power forward.

      • Lawrencetown Liquor Pigs says:

        My fantasy teams are kind of liking Pacioretty playing with Cole, but if it’s for the good of the Canadiens I’d sign off on it I guess.

        ____________________________________________________
        They lost me 2 quarts of rum, better make it up next year with a cup!

      • Sean Bonjovi says:

        I agree, but I’d like to note that it’s sad that the team needs to “hide” Mike Cammalleri.

        Edit: don’t totally agree I guess because I see Max Pac as more of an “outside player” than a “power forward”. I like those lines, but for a slightly different reason.

    • LA Loyalist says:

      Can’t Gomez play on the 5th line?

  17. 24 Cups says:

    There was some discussion earlier in the morning about signing Shea Weber this summer because he’ a UFA. Just to set the record straight, he will be a RFA this summer.

    The Habs would have to trade for him which means Subban or MaxPac would probably be going the other way.

    • Da Hema says:

      I would love to get Weber. Fast, durable, mean, talented. I’d send Subban in a heartbeat if Nashville would agree to such a trade. The Habs could try to sign Weber next year as an RFA, but unless I am in error, the cost would be high. Given Weber’s salary — 7.5 million dollars — the Canadiens would have to provide Nashville two first-round, one second-round, and one third-round compensatory draft picks. That’s pretty steep. On the other hand, assuming Montreal continues its middling regular season performance over the next few years, they almost assuredly would not produce even one-half of a player of Weber’s talents with those picks. Tough call.

      • Lawrencetown Liquor Pigs says:

        Subban and a wack of picks for Webber? Where do we file the paperwork? I like Subban as much as the next guy, but you couldn’t pass on a chance at Shea Webber I don’t think. Larry Robinson for my generation?

        ____________________________________________________
        They lost me 2 quarts of rum, better make it up next year with a cup!

      • Richrebellion says:

        You sound like a crazy person, yes everyone would love to have Weber but selling the future for the guy I’m not down, he plays in the best defensive system in the league and has a boom shot but that system hides a lot, PK Subban alone could easily be as good as him ( maybe not as tough) People on this site are delusional and just want to go after the player with the biggest name! If we ever got Weber at 7.5-8 mill a season by the end of his contract he would be hated as much as Gomez. This would never happen for so many reasons so keep dreaming!

        • Da Hema says:

          What is difficult to determine is whether to characterise your reply as a rant or a diatribe. Weber is 26 years of age, 6 foot 3 and 230+ pounds, a three-time all-star already, and a key component of Canada’s Olympic gold-winning squad. He is, by every measure, an elite defenceman. If I am “crazy” to ponder what it would take to secure Weber, you are a moron for comparing Weber to that slug Gomez. Subban will, I believe, be a fine defenceman, but I doubt he will ever be one of the top four defencemen in the NHL as Weber currently is.

      • LA Loyalist says:

        Let’s keep fantasy hockey separate, please. Weber’s $7.5 mill are in Gomez’s bank account.

        Aside from that, Nashville can’t be that dumb, and there would be other teams with depth who could offer more than we can.

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      Suter is a UFA. He’s pretty good too.

      • jmsheehy19 says:

        Suter is at the top of my Totally-unrealistic-but-technically-not impossible-list. Along with Pavelski, Backes, Clutterbuck, Duchene, Franzen, Callahan, and Evander Kane.

        Now if you’ll excuse me, I have an urge to play NHL 11.

  18. HABZ24 says:

    we need vet d men to hold a lead, rooks struggle to hold leads. send diaz down. markov wont return im sure.kabrele pickup great…so far.weber is trade bait not developing after all this time.

    GO HABS GO

  19. Subban’s game will improve now that the GM brought in a NHL caliber d-man to fill Markov’s spot. Way too much pressure was on the kid, and that really showed.

    So I see more W’s than L’s in the future.

    This is the week that tells us to compete or sell come deadline.

    League Standings, says that you can bubble all the way and till make the playoffs.

    Just get in.

    Shane Oliver
    http://www.Sholi2000.com
    Brandon, MB,Canada
    R7B 2R7
    hockey@sholi2000.com
    Ph- 204 724 8418

  20. --Habs-- says:

    Where is Gomez! Is he on extended leave!

  21. rogieshan says:

    If Markov returns and stays healthy, demote Weber to Hamilton or trade him for a draft pick and package Campoli off in a deal to strengthen the fourth line and bring some cap relief. Keep Diaz as 7th-D and rotate him and Gill on the 3rd pairing.

    If Campoli stays, then Diaz will go down to the farm. Under no scenario should Weber remain.

    Markov – Emelin (Campoli)
    Subban – Gorges
    Kaberle – Gill

    • Habitoba says:

      +1

      Thoughts exactly. Only way I would want to see Emelin in Hamilton is if we’re out of the playoffs and they need a hand. We’ve given Weber many chances but he doesn’t quite seem able to get over that one little hump preventing him from being a really decent asset. We’ll get a 4th round for him… maybe 3rd

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Yannick Weber has something you can’t teach, which is an accurate bullet of a shot. All the other areas of concern he can be coached on. So we keep Yannick Weber, he’s only just turned 23. Give the kid a chance.

      Also, he can’t be sent down to Hamilton without going through waivers, so that’s not an option.

      ———————————
      How about it NHL? No fighting, just hockey?

      http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

  22. I figure Diaz has to be next sent down. Emelin is our only real hitter and Campoli played about 3 seconds as a Hab, have to play him a bit even if only to showcase him.

    http://www.puckbandits.com

  23. youngwun says:

    Emelin will not sit . He is our only physical dman and when markov returns he will be paired with him. Id like to see campoli in instead of diaz as well . If campoli doesnt play well just rotate with diaz. Weber is done or this year. We dont need him.

  24. NoTinFoilCups says:

    On the subject of Eller’s development. If you compare his stats with those of Plekanec at the same age then it does not take a genius to figure out that we have a diamond in the rough. At the same age Plekanec was barely on the radar. Not every young player is a Jeff Skinner or Nugent-Hopkins. Some fruit takes longer to ripen. (Somehow that didn’t sound right)

    This is in response to the annoying Blues poster (don’t they have their own forum).

    • Mike D says:

      Fair comparison of Eller and Pleks and of course, players develop at different rates.

      On that note, while I often lament that Eller gets less playing time in less advantageous situations than DD, and with lower quality wingers to boot, I also see that he is developing the defensive side of his game. That makes me wonder if they are grooming him to be Pleks 2.0, and if so, then I am okay with it for obvious reasons.

      On the other hand, I do see flashes of brilliance in his offensive game sometimes and wonder if he’s being “neutered” a bit. Maybe we have more of an offensive juggernaut than we think and that side of his potential is being ignored. His career stats in his pre-NHL development years seem to indicate otherwise though, but Logan Couture was never selected to represent Canada as a junior and look at him now.

      – Honestly yours

      • NoTinFoilCups says:

        I think you’re right about him being ‘neutered’ somewhat. It’s just a case of his circumstances right now. DD is fortunate in that he is filling the only role he is fit for (and doing it admirably!). In a year or two I think we could see Pekanec shipped out in a blockbuster deal, then it will be a whole other story.

      • rogieshan says:

        My thoughts exactly. When he was coaching in Ottawa, Jacques Martin tried in vain to “neuter” a young Jason Spezza’s game and the two clashed as a result. He is applying the same approach here and sometimes it’s frustrating to watch because we can clearly see Eller has offensive instincts which are being stifled. I suppose it’s a testament to Eller’s potential that he is identified as someone who could mature into a complete player and, perhaps, a number one centre.

      • ABHabsfan says:

        I’m pretty sure Couture was injured or had mono or something like that the year he was supposed to play for Canada. He was talked about as a shoe-in, I think it was mono

    • Everlasting1 says:

      Why the Plekanec comparison? That’s right genius, every fruit develops at diff times, and at their own pace. Pleks was still in Hamilton developing till 23. Perhaps Eller would benefit with more experience in the AHL (only one season!) Look what it’s done for Patches.

      ——————————————————————-
      “For I will go through the land of Egypt on that night, and will smite all the first-born in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the Gods of Egypt I will execute judgments: I am the LORD.” Exodus 12:12

      “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

    • LA Loyalist says:

      The problem is because the Halak trade was controversial (you think?) management felt they had to play Eller to justify the trade. He should have spent a year in Hamilton. That he has progressed is a credit to him and no thanks to us.

      • Everlasting1 says:

        Exactly. To appease the fans and justify ‘the trade’ with an immediate impact player, but it hasn’t paid off. He needs time in Hamilton. I actually feel sorry for him..brought up prematurely with only one season in Peoria before thrusting him into a hockey hotbed and the harsh lights of Mtl. under those circumstances. The expectations and pressure can overwhelm a 20 yr old.

        ——————————————————————-
        “For I will go through the land of Egypt on that night, and will smite all the first-born in the land of Egypt, both man and beast; and against all the Gods of Egypt I will execute judgments: I am the LORD.” Exodus 12:12

        “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

  25. chemic says:

    trade Campoli, go with the youth! if there is a chance for an serious player, put Weber on the block too. however keep Diaz because he did his job well as a rookie under the circumstances of this banged up defense.

    no hating but with Campoli back how about sit Subban a couple of games, no?? someone should tell him that his fancy plays did work anymore because everybody in the league knows what he does. he needs to rethink his game, keep it simple and stop being selfish like in new jersey. eveytime he put up his stick like a berserker i could throw my remote at the tv. but also to JM stop playing him 30+ minutes because the margin for mistakes increase dramaticly with this kind of icetime. to critical?

    • Danno says:

      I think PK was fine until J-Mart started messing around with his head. Now he’s playing so tentatively. He’s scared stiff about making a mistake. With his confidence shattered he’s not half the player he was not so long ago.

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

      • Arrow77 says:

        I love Subban and I hate Martin but I can’t blame the coach for what happens to Subban this year. He’s a very young defenseman who fooled us into thinking he was ready to dominate but he can’t hide his inexperience anymore.

        His development makes me think of Price in a way. Price was so good his first year, he to crash into the ground to develop properly.

        • Lawrencetown Liquor Pigs says:

          And he thinks he needs to carry the team. Where as last year he was probably still playing on skill and instinct, this year he wants/needs to be somebody else and looks like it most nights.

          ____________________________________________________
          They lost me 2 quarts of rum, better make it up next year with a cup!

      • CharlieHodgeFan says:

        The NHL level has messed with his head. He’s a known quality now, and it’s sophomore slump time. With a little training and good coaching, he’ll be a star. His talent has made it easy til now, but the time for the thinking side of the game has arrived. He seems a smart enough player to learn his way out of his slump.
        You can blame JM for being dull, but not for Subban’s problems. PK is a player in need of tough coaching. He is a little too individualistic and not enough of a team player yet. He’s young, and he will be something in a couple of years.

      • LA Loyalist says:

        Because PK is creative and of course will make mistakes. JM doesn’t like creative.

        He would have benched Bobby Orr for going into the offensive zone.

    • Mike D says:

      Perhaps a bit too critical of Subban but he does need to adjust hs game a bit so I see your point.

      I’m all for trading Campoli but I hope PG and JM realize it would be smarter to showcase him between now and the deadline to increasehis value. He’s not worth much right now but if he gets playing time and plays well he could be worth quite a bit come late Feb. I’d actually have him run our second PP unit with one of Weber/Diaz/Emelin (whichever one isn’t scratched) and hope he finds success. If he does, he should fetch us a 2nd round pick no problem.

      – Honestly yours

      • Trisomy 21 says:

        Going from a UFA who wasn’t signed before the preseason to returning a 2nd round pick would require a lot of success until Feb. And I’m not talking Josh Gorges kind of success, he’ll have to put points up, because he was only signed for 1 year right? so he’s going to be a rental if a team takes him in Feb. But he is at a perfect age to be sought after and to have a career season.

        I do question, however, if we’ll be selling assets such as him on the trade deadline. I see PG holding onto him in case of injury and since we’ll be fighting for 8th we won’t be able to predict whether we’ll need depth for playoffs. Then it’s too late unless someone wants to trade for his rights.

  26. Funny what a puck moving defensman will do for a team. My favourite was Carey’s audio about Kaberle. Move out of our zone faster,quick tape to tape passes, and actual shots on net during the PP

    I hope the trend of getting points continues. 7 out of 10 possible points in December, and an improvement to the team on Friday will get us in the playoffs again.

    Three W on the way Isles, Devils, and Flyers.

    Shane Oliver
    http://www.Sholi2000.com
    Brandon, MB,Canada
    R7B 2R7
    hockey@sholi2000.com
    Ph- 204 724 8418

  27. 21.273 says:

    Who’s going to sit when Campoli returns?
    Me. Of course.
    As always sitting in front of the computer, eyes hooked to some bad atdhenet feed, a 1:30 am start in Europe, some December game against the Panthers or Preds, hope for the best, expecting the worst. So, that’s that.
    That’s who’s gonna be sitting.

  28. Ozmodiar says:

    Think the Flames would go for this?

    Bourque + Stajan for Gomez

    Assuming we leave our 4 centers intact, Bourque would be a better fit on the wing than Gomez when he returns. Our bottom six would be something like:

    Bourque/Eller/AK
    Moen/Nokie/White
    Pressbox: Stajan, Weber
    To the Hammer: Darche

    If there’s an injury to Plek/DD/Eller, Stajan is a better temporary replacement than Engqvist.

    In the offseason, Stajan follows Darche to the Hammer, which would be 2.5/year cheaper than sending Gomez down, so Molson saves money….allowing him to keep beer prices at 10/ at the bell center.

    • Trisomy 21 says:

      Would you go for that trade if you were Jay Feester?

    • habs_fan101 says:

      I seriously hope you’re joking… one of the budding power forwards in the league, a serviceable center for a guy who’s been either hurt or invisible with the worst contact in the NHL. Sometimes people on this site drive me nuts. How could you in any way think that’s a fair trade? Feaster isn’t fergie Jr. I don’t even think Fergie Jr. Was that dumb.

      Do you believe?

      • Ozmodiar says:

        Budding power forward? Budding? Did you know he’s 30?

        • Shmitzy says:

          I don’t care if he’s 40. This isn’t EA Sports. If anyone wanted Gomez, they’d have him by now. I’m with habs_fan101, people on this site are awe-strikingly out to lunch sometimes.

          • matt jordan says:

            A couple of weeks ago someone posted that the Habs were about to acquire Shea Weber for Jarrod Tinordi and Scott Gomez, and said the Predators were interested in Gomez’s offense….

            That’s my favourite H I/O trade rumour.

        • Mike D says:

          I don’t think the trade you proposed is as ludicrous as some are making it out to be. Not only is Bourque 30, but he’s signed until 2016 (though at a reasonable cap hit of only 3.33mil).

          Stajan isn’t good……about as good as Gomez but without the past success, and has a more reasonable cap hit of only 3.5mil and is signed until 2014 like Gomez.

          Basically the trade is one very overpriced underachiever for a somewhat overpriced underachiever and a player who’s fairly productive but signed for too long. Not that far-fetched and the questions would be can Gomer and Stajan regain/find success with a fresh start, and how long until Bourque’s play starts to deteriorate due to age. On the salary aspect, the totals on both sides are close, but Calgary is SO close to the cap that the extra $ for Gomez puts them basically at the limit.

          All in all though, I don’t think Calgary would do it. They have cap/contract problems and a pretty bare cupboard of prospects. Any moves they make would likely be to rid themselves of those handcuffing contracts without taking any more on and add prospect depth or picks.

          – Honestly yours

        • habs_fan101 says:

          Actually he’s 29, but he only broke into the league full time at 23. As a forward playing on a deep chicago team he didn’t get lots of minutes. His goal totals had increased every year from 08- until the last two years where he has scored 27, so budding okay maybe not he’s into his prime. Budding isn’t age restricted, you can be 35 and be budding, just means you’ve got stuff to learn until you take your game to the next level, but sorry he’s established himself. I appreciate you nitpicking my choice of words.

          Do you believe?

    • cuzzie says:

      I rather a bag of pucks then Stajan.

      Mr. Bad Example!

      • Trisomy 21 says:

        I’d trade Gomez for a bag of pucks

        • longbow says:

          I’d be happy to get an ECHL 4th liner for him or the rights to a washed up KHLer. I’d be really miffed to find out the Goat turned down a deal for Gomer because he thought he wasn’t getting enough in return.The most valuable asset we could get in return is the 7.5 million in cap space. I sincerely hope Gauthier keeps that in mind.

          “A constant smirk upon the face, and a whiffing activity of the body, are strong indications of futility.” Lord Chesterfield

        • Ozmodiar says:

          Maybe the teams could just trade pucks. That could work out for both teams.

    • HNS says:

      Only if they were stoned.

    • ProHabs says:

      I think the Flames would have to throw in Iginla and a first along with Stajan and Bourque to pry Gomez away from us.

    • harpman says:

      Dream on…

  29. Mike D says:

    BTW, if anyone hasn’t listened to Price’s audio clip in the previous thread, I highly recommend you do!

    The first few seconds where he’s responding to H I/O’s Pat Hickey are gold!

    – Honestly yours

  30. Vid says:

    Kaberle, Gorges, Subban & Emelin are pretty much guaranteed spots in my opinion. They all bring different strengths to the D corps that are necessary.

    The third pairing will be Campoli or Gill with Diaz or Weber depending on what team we’re facing and who’s playing better.

    Gill is good on the pk but not much else and at his age, I think we should be giving the young guys as much ice time to learn. It’s not like the Habs don’t know how to penalty kill without Gill. That would be pretty sad if that were the case.

    Worry about Markov when it actually seems like he will play another game this season which won’t be in at least 4 weeks or more. Lots of things can change between now and then.

    • SteverenO says:

      What gives you the impression that Coach Martin would adjust his lineup based on who we are playing?

      History proves that this coach pays no attention to how the players are performing or what their strengths and weaknesses are .

      He cost us the regulation win versus Vancouver, and did his best to do the same thing versus the Devils.

      This coach must be fired! the sooner THE better.

      now posted on youtube. http://youtu.be/ZVb2CrFC7E4

      Here is the breakdown on our defensive corps in even strength situations: MInutes of ice time (even strenghth) per goal allowed

      from worst to best:

      Gill: 19.5
      Weber: 21
      Subban:21
      Diaz: 23
      Emelin: 27
      Georges: 27
      St. Denis: 44.5

      Kaberle : 17 (in Carolina)

      Here are the stats for offensive productivity in even strength situations. Minutes per Goal scored (team) .
      From worst to best

      Emelin: 36
      Gill :31
      Webber: 30
      St.Denis: 29
      Diaz: 29
      Subban: 18.5
      Georges: 16

      Kaberle : 31.9 (with Carolina)

      now posted on youtube.
      http://youtu.be/ZVb2CrFC7E4

      regards,

      Steve O.
      Qlik View – Data Discovery.
      Every team needs it- Every coach needs it.
      Every fan needs it!

      http://litcosys.ca/QV_videos.html

      • Stev.R says:

        Ya but we play some players only when the play is in our end and replace them as soon as the puck goes into the offensive end. It makes sense that Gill is on the ice for a lot of goals against because he’s always on the ice when the other team is in scoring position, and never on the ice when we are in scoring position.

        • SteverenO says:

          That’s a spurious argument Stev R.

          In fact , If I were you I would erase it. this is not football. Players go on the ice with objective of getting the puck into the other teams zone. There is no “offense” and “defense”. You could argue that he is matched up against the other teams top players, but if he is that is the coaches mistake.

          The reason that Gill is on the ice mostly when the puck is in our zone, is the problem. He is not very good at clearing the zone, and he doesn’t even offer his defensive partner the help that is required to get the puck out. When Gill was paired with Subban, Subban was a minus in the plus/minus rating.

          Gill is both a defensive liability and an equally larger offensive liability as we almost never score a goal when he is on the ice.

          If anyone thinks that Gill has any value at all, it can only be due to his penalty killing “skills” Which is slightly above averagae, but it does not merit his taking ice time away from a younger, faster, and less expensive player.

          Habs Rule: your comment is equally moot. Obviously it was his choice of players on the ice. The players have to take credit and blame for the teams winning and losing That is their job. The coaches job is to put the right players in the right situations.

          When the game is on the line, I would expect, in fact I owuld demand, that my coach be aware of who his most effective players are in every situation.

          FIRE the COACH|

          The proof is in the data!
          http://youtu.be/ZVb2CrFC7E4

          Regards,

          Steve O.

          .
          Qlik View – Data Discovery.
          Every team needs it- Every coach needs it.
          Every fan needs it!

          http://litcosys.ca/QV_videos.html

      • Habsrule1 says:

        I assume he cost us the win because he told the players to stop scoring and just sit back and protect the lead? Or was it his choice of players on the ice?
        Perhaps the players deserve some of the blame considering they are the ones actually playing?
        That said, leads are hard to hold. Every team has been come back on. Human nature is not to want to take the chance that costs a goal, so mistakes are made and opponents capitalize. It happens regularly, and at every level too.

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  31. BKAK72 says:

    Here’s our defense:

    Gill 6’7″ / 241lbs
    Emelin 6’2″ / 223 lbs
    Georges 6’1″ / 200 lbs
    Kaberle 6’1″ / 214 lbs
    Campoli 6’0″ / 200 lbs
    Subban 6’0″ / 206 lbs
    Webber 5’11” / 193 lbs
    Diaz 5’11” / 194 lbs

    IMO the ‘core’ defense is Markov, Emelin, Subban and Gorges. I would imagine that Kabrle (may) be the guy that replaces Gorges for next year if the budget doesn’t allow to sign Josh.

    Weber, Diaz and Campoli don’t offer anything to this roster that they don’t already have i.e. small. The HABS need a couple more bruisers back there to make one think twice about cutting into slot, or hanging in front of our goalie.

    — HABS INSIDE/OUT R.I.P. –

  32. novahab says:

    So here is a question. Was there no practise this morning and if so what were the d pairing? Kaberle is about to find out what kind of hockey Towm Montreal is when this team hit the ice for the practise and these D pairings are up in the air.

  33. derfab says:

    Nothing against Diaz or Weber (though I thought Carle was better) but this is no contest. Emelin is our best hitter and second best defensive d-man after Gorges. He has to play and get good minutes. If Markov ever does get back, Weber and Diaz or Campoli should be shipped out with one of our smurf vets for picks.

    • Habfan10912 says:

      Jury still out on Diaz and who knew Weber would take such a huge step backwards. I liked Carle also but we should give Diaz some more time and hope Weber finds himself or we find a taker for him.

  34. Chuck says:

    Boone? HI/O needs and ‘argument starter”? As of when? ;)

    Just scanned through a couple of comments…

    “Trade Kaberle and keep Campoli, because we haven’t seen them play on the team.” Wouldn’t you want to see what bothe of them could do before making up your mind about which you want to trade away?

    “Subban will get $4-million/year on his next contract.” I can’t see that happening. He’s an RFA coming off of his entry-level contract. There’s no way that he scores a bigger deal than Price did when he was in the same situation.

    • Ton says:

      Subban is not a great defensemen nor will he ever be! Make an argument out of this. He telegraphs, predictable, not tough, but in end he will have a 10 year career playing in the top 7 of any team’s D. Is he worth signing to a 4 to 5 mill deal for 7 years, no way, my opinion

      • Habsrule1 says:

        I disagree.
        I see Subban as being a superstar offensive defenseman in a couple years. He’s going through some growing pains, but he will be a very good player in this league for many years. The plus side of his sophomore slump is he’d sign for 3 years at $2.5M-$3M/year or so.

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • Ton says:

          so do agree with me lol. 3 years at 2.5 max because he has not proven he is a superstar! I don’t think he will be , a superstar is robinson, borque, orr, potvin, coffey, chara, and of course lidstrom. that is superstar status field!

          • Habsrule1 says:

            Not completely. I am saying sign him asap before he becomes the superstar that he will. Now you can get him for a good price, but not in a couple years.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Trisomy 21 says:

            HR1 that’s the problem though, Subban knows he’s going to be a star, he’s not stupid. He hears what the media says about him. He’s not going to get locked up now, during his rookie slump, he’s going to want a contract that’s backloaded that ends while he’s still a RFA or so, then mtl has a chance to sign him long term, for a cost that he likes.

          • Habsrule1 says:

            You’re right Trisomy. I think he knows he’s going to get better, but I also think he wants to play for the Habs for a while. My feeling is he will take a fair offer and will wind up signing for 3 or 4 years and roughly $3M per year (maybe it goes up slightly over the years?).

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • CharlieHodgeFan says:

          Subban is a very young player. I can see him becoming an offensive defenceman with defensive ability – gold in the NHL. Those guys are rare. Look at the power-play guys in the past few seasons – Souray, MAB, Brisebois, Wisniewski and probably Kaberle – they are great to have as long as their defensive lapses are outweighed by their offensive contribution.
          Markov (healthy) is worth the big bucks because he is a defenceman who scores, and not a simple powerplay quarterback. Subban could end up in the same category once he learns and gains experience.
          You can have great players like Gorges – real defensive players who are essential for winning teams. Kaberle is a QB – weak on defence but strong on shifting to offence (we hope). A Markov or eventually, a Subban, can be both to a certain degree. A little patience will go a long way.

          • Ton says:

            well said. i think he can be very solid, and hence the reason why he was picked in the second round but no not a superstar! some maturity, less telegraphing his passes and shots. i think our newest addition could polish up some of his offensive game!

      • habs_fan101 says:

        Everybody and their mothers teapot knows that Subban has top pairing offensive defensemen potential. What makes you the all hockey knowing genius to say that he doesn’t? Seriously though, the kid is 22. Defensemen only hit their prime in mid thirties.

        Do you believe?

    • Danno says:

      PK is a superstar but J-Mart the Jacques @ss is trying hard to ruin him.

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

      • Habfan4lfe says:

        As he will be doing to Emelin, notice his hits dropped dramatically in NJ? Where is that big whammy from Subban. All but gone. Domesticated by the BIG JM.

    • I see him getting the typical 2-3 million raise for two years then if his progression continues he may see a payday worthy of the Hall lol

      Shane Oliver
      http://www.Sholi2000.com
      Brandon, MB,Canada
      R7B 2R7
      hockey@sholi2000.com
      Ph- 204 724 8418

  35. LatheDog says:

    Why hasn’t anyone mentioned in the last 24 hrs that the reason New Jersey scored was because Kaberle wasn’t doing his job defensively and allowed the Devils’ forward to get a shot off? That was his man, his fault. Yes I’m glad he was the reason Montreal won yesterday but he is a defensive liability that will probably hurt us in the long run……no?

    • cuzzie says:

      Nit picking.

      Mr. Bad Example!

    • Habsrule1 says:

      It figures someone would mention it. I see what you’re saying, considering how none of our other defensemen have caused any goals against. It looks like we have found a defenseman who actually makes mistakes out there.
      It was his first game with Montreal….never even practiced with the team.
      Nobody brought it up because it made no sense to do so. Granted, that normally does not stop people.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • SmartDog says:

      You’re absolutely right. I said to a friend “he was key on all 3 goals!”… and he was. To his credit it was bad luck. He had his stick there, it actually deflected the puck up, just not enough. And this IS the knock on him, that he can be a little too relaxed, just a little lazy. I was thinking about how incredibly calm he is on the PP, it’s a treat to watch…. I’m still dubious about the trade but he’s very good up there. I think that calm is what makes him good there but makes him maybe prone to lazy mistakes. Hopefully all that needs is for the Habs to work with him on it. Good article about him loving to play in Montreal… that’s really something. Maybe PG did good afterall. I f-n hope so…. we can’t take another bad contract.

      Anyway, I agree it’s fair to bring it up. And that’s not just the canine brotherhood. :)
      ————————————-
      Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • Hab-Q says:

      Price mis-played the puck behind the net that started the sequence of events that led to NJ’s goal.

      can’t really blame Kaberle- he shouldn’t have to be in that situation one-on-one with the shooter.

      ______________________________________________________
      “I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out”

      ~Rodney Dangerfield

  36. Richrebellion says:

    Martin is the king of changing up his lineup, either diaz or emelin may sit when campoli is back but they will rotate in and out of the line up based on how they play. As for when Markov comes back, if you don’t realize it by now but there are always injuries having 8 solid d is never a bad thing, injuries WILL happen its almost a guarantee with this team and they will get their chances. The habs will keep them both up and when Gill and Campoli are gone next year they will become full time d men!

  37. kholdstare says:

    If the NHL was like transformers the movie and the Habs the Autobots, with the Kaberle addition they have merely changed engine parts. Like they added a new Kaberle shaft. So this new unit gives the autobots a bit more speed. Enough to pass the decepticons. Is it enough for them to save cybertron? We’ll have to wait and see as the story unfolds. Will Markoptimus Prime be back and as strong as ever? Will this speedy little bunch of autobots be able to pass the much bigger yet equally fast decepticons. Or will it get crushed to the wall by Megatron?

    • Higman says:

      Whenever I’m down about the Habs I repeat this aloud several times, until I’m laughing:

      The Leafs have “Optimus Rhiem” and “The Monster”!

      Man, I’m laughing even now. Ah, that feels better.
      ———————
      When the tough gets going, the laughs start flowing. Like Price said, “Chill.”

  38. Mike D says:

    Reading through the comments I see a few opinions that Weber should be traded for a gritty/tough 4th liner. Granted he has not played well at all recently, but still, I have to strongly disagree.

    Weber is only 22 or 23 and has just 84 NHL games under his belt. Lots of window for him to develop still.

    If JM or PG decide the team needs a grittier 4th line, we can call Blunden up from Hamilton. Plus, those types of players are readily available on the waiver wire anyway so no need to give anything up to acquire one. Hell, JF Jacques from ANA has cleared waivers a few times this season already.

    On that note, it appears the powers that be don’t really see value in a traditional 4th line so what would be the point in getting that type of player?

    Trading a young, cap-friendly, right-handed, offensive Dman with potential and a cannon of a shot for a 4th line plugger does not make any sense at all. None.

    – Honestly yours

    • cuzzie says:

      I totally agree with you. Enough of getting rid players for nothing. PG has the Hammer.

      Mr. Bad Example!

    • Trisomy 21 says:

      I think you’re absolutely right about this, not to mention Dmen mature later because it takes a bit of time to learn positioning, which is the biggest part of the job. Gorges is a perfect example, he looked like fodder when came from SJ in the Rivet deal and it seems like he’s reaching his peak this year.

    • Rad says:

      I like JF Jacques. Big, tough French Canadian who takes the body every chance he gets. He can fight, too.

      • Mike D says:

        Yeah, I’ve got no problem with JFJ but there’s no way in hell I’d give up Weber for him. The fact he’s cleared waivers so many times this year is pretty telling that other teams don’t see enough value in him to grab him even though they wouldn’t give anything up to do so. Hell, if a team grabs him on re-entry waivers they’re only on the hook for the pro-rated amount of $325k (which is about $215k at this point). Peanuts.

        Every team has a tough guy or two in their system so the need isn’t really there and certainly not if you’re giving something up in return.

        Personally I couldn’t care less whether a player is French Canadian or not, but that’s me.

        – Honestly yours

  39. Exit716 says:

    Campoli is expendable. He can be dealt to a team needing depth on defense.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      Nobody wanted him before so I doubt many teams would line up now that he’s played 1 game this season. With injuries, it’s possible we could find a taker, but don’t exect much more than a 5th round pick, unless you just add him to a package.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • Mike D says:

        100% correct that Campoli’s value right now is low, but he’s ready to return and there is still plenty of time for him to be showcased before the deadline. Players values can change dramatically in a relatively short time span.

        Case in point – there’s no way we could have traded Spacek for Kaberle with Toronto this time last year. And yes, I do realize that Burke and Rutherford had different goals and reasons for trading Kaberle (wanting a 1st round pick vs. wanting to clear cap space) but the point remains. Kabs’ value was greatly reduced during his short stints with Boston and Carolina.

        I think the reason Campoli was unsigned during most of the summer was that he was holding out for more money/term at first knowing the worst case scenario was that some team would sign him for decent dollars eventually. Also known as the Dominic Moore Special.

        If Campoli can play well between now and the deadline and provide some offensive production, we’ll be able to get a 2nd rounder for him in February no problem.

        – Honestly yours

      • SmartDog says:

        Someone might want him at the deadline. He’s experienced, has played well and costs next-to-nothing. He could be moveable soon to any team that needs depth on D for a playoff run. As a package with someone else we want to get rid of might even be possible.
        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • kempie says:

      For a fifth rounder. A second if you’re good/lucky/patient/sneaky.

  40. Xsteve50 says:

    Who sits who plays depends entirely on who is healthy. There is no way the team will go through the rest of the season without another injury. Assuming everyone is truly at 100%.. I would rest Gill a few games a month. I like what he brings to this team but he is not young and a few games off once in a while would do him good. I would wait to see how Campoli plays, we only saw him for what 17 min so far this year. Keep Gorges, PK, Diaz, Emelin, at the 20 min mark, and play the other less.

  41. Rad says:

    Weber is a good spare part because he can play D if someone gets hurt, or forward if we’re short up front. I thought he was quite tenacious against NJ. Nonetheless, I would trade him for some more size on D (someone like Colten Teubert, currently a 7th defenceman in Edmonton), or for a 2nd round draft choice. I would try and get a 3rd rounder for Campoli at the trade deadline.

    My D pairings would be
    Emelin-Diaz
    Gorges-Subban
    Kaberle-Gill

  42. Ian Cobb says:

    OK, after running all the numbers through the best mind in hockey, I have forwarded this to JM for his conformation.

    Starting D, line up,

    Kaberle RD with Subban LD—-1st pair on the PP.
    Gorges with Emelin —-2nd pair on the PP
    Gill with Campoli —-1st pair on the PK
    Dias is 7th D

  43. bighabber says:

    Right now I say Diaz to Hamilton, Weber in the press box, Emelin and Campoli in. That is until the inevitable d injury that comes along. Longer term trade Weber. I’m a big Emelin fan but he needs to be on the left side.

  44. HardHabits says:

    Habs finally win a game in regulation time and you’d think they won the Stanley Cup reading some of the comments unable to contain their elation here.

    The Habs dodged a bullet yesterday aft. Parise fanned on his penalty shot and had he managed to lift the puck as he intended it would have been a much different story. Nice save Carey but it was a flubbed shot. Bullet dodged.

    How many more times will the Habs be expected to hold off the pressure and the barrage of shots late in the game to avoid the equalizer?

    Another 2-1 win. The System versus the Trap. I’ve seen paint dry that had more action. Then again that was some good LSD.

    Marty no-longer-F Brodeur has a 3.18 GAA with a .884 SV% after last game… which is to say his numbers improved after playing the Habs.

    Don’t plan the parade just yet.

    =========

    The who sits when Campoli and Markov return debate is another example of a smoke screen. Knowing Martin 8 defense men will dress. It’s not like the Habs have any intention of skating a 4th line, which should be the real question.

    When will the Habs have 6 defense men that they can count on to be 6 defense men without the need for a 7th just in case? When will the Habs have a 4th line that matters, that can crash and bang, be defensively responsible or better yet do both?

    =========

    If there was no salary cap the Spacek for Kaberle move would be a no brainer.

    Which brings me to my next bone of contention. The Habs have handicaps that other teams don’t have to deal with, at least not as accumulated as the Habs do, high taxes, the storied past, fans high expectations, intense scrutiny from the press and other media, french language requirements, the supposed almost religious adherence to making the play-offs and the notion that missing them is paramount to blasphemy, the need to over spend on big money contracts to free agents because there is a lacking patience with building and developing from within the prospect pool.

    =========

    If the NHL was an F1 race and the Habs one of 30 race cars, with the Kaberle addition they have merely changed engine parts. Like they added a new Kaberle shaft. So this new unit gives the race car a bit more speed. Enough to pass from 22nd to 19th in the race because they just inched past a slower car on the last turn. Is it enough to get them to pass the finish line in the top 16 to get into the big race? We’ll have to wait and see as the race unfolds. The bottom line is there is still the same driver in the car. Will the new improved Markoverator bring more torque to the engine? Or will it blow out after only a few laps leaving the rest of the machine sputtering again? Will this speedy little car be able to pass the much bigger yet equally fast cars up ahead. Or will it get crushed to the wall when it tries to make a pass on the outside or simply run off the road on the inner turn or perhaps crunched late in the race when it is spent and caught in between two bigger vehicles?

    It’s tough to win when the driver is not paying attention to the road and rather is texting messages while at the wheel.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      You have a point about Parise’s shot, but Price was following it real well and there’s no reason to believe he would not have snagged it with his glove if the shot was lifted.
      A win is a win. I’ll be completely satisfied if they win every game 2-1, boring or not….because when they win, the end is always exciting to me.
      I’m not planning a parade though. We have a long way to go but getting Kaberle was a good move.
      Every team should have a 7th D-Man…cause injuries happen. It should be your 7th best defenseman. Pretty simple, really.
      The whole race car analogy got boring, so I stopped reading it, but I’m sure the Habs are not about to let PK & Price walk, so let’s wait and see what happens.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • habsfanforever7631 says:

        Agree, I think people are geting a lil to crazy on Price and subban.
        There going to be signed!
        We’re not going anywhere with out them!
        I also agree who cares if boring games, whatever it takes to win!

        Go Habs Go!

        • Lawrencetown Liquor Pigs says:

          I just worry about angry, foolish negotiation that burns bridges. They’ll be back, but will they bolt when they can? A tough place to play when you feel wanted. If you get the inkling the team doesn’t agree with your worth, wouldn’t you go looking elsewhere.

          Regardless of what you think of how young, modern players act, feel, behave, it happens. They need to be coddled, it’s part of the scenario now.

          ____________________________________________________
          They lost me 2 quarts of rum, better make it up next year with a cup!

        • boonie says:

          Of course THEY will be signed. But if we don’t unload unneccessary hefty contracts, then we lose other valuable parts. NFL teams (pats) learned long ago, you minimizing waste is the key to success in a capped league.

          Kaberle and Gomez may not cost us PK or Price, but we might not have AK or next year’s shiny free agent.

          • Habsrule1 says:

            That’s up to management to decide. I’d buy out Gomez, but we should wait and see what they do before condemning what we think they might do.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • G-Man says:

      Where’d the lego avatar go? Unhappy when the Habs win and unhappy when they lose. What a conundrum!

    • Trisomy 21 says:

      Love it HH, you somehow creeped up to becoming my favourite poster… but that changes almost as often as JM changes his line combos.
      But haven’t you heard? after 1 game and 2 assists, the old Kaberle is back!

      • Habsolutely says:

        It really is unbelievable isn’t it? One game and the I told you so crowd is out in full force showing off their ignorance. Maybe we should hold off on giving the guy the keys to the city till after he’s played a few games and see how he does against teams like Philly and Boston who are really gonna expose his defensive inabilities.

        • Trisomy 21 says:

          Hahaha the keys to the city

        • Habsrule1 says:

          If he would have sucked his first game, would you have said “it’s only 1 game”?
          Why not be positive about it, given the choice? He played a good game. Will he get 2 points every game? No, but I think that’s all you would accept.
          The funniest part about yours and Trisomy’s posts is that you seem to think because Kaberle played badly in Boston & Carolina his career is over. The fact is he still got 47 points last year. He did not fit in Boston, and everyone is bad in Carolina.
          Give the man a chance in Montreal.

          Go Habs Go!!

          “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Habsolutely says:

            Uh ya, I would have said it’s only one game. I’m not an ignorant fool who would come on here yelling I told you so at the top of my lungs after one game, like a lot of the idiots here did. One game is not enough to make a decision either way. He was great on the PP, no doubt, I gave him credit for that a number of times. But he was also a little shakey defensively, and he’s known for that. Like I said, let’s see how he performs when he’s playing a playoff seed team.

          • Habsrule1 says:

            Good. Then we agree. It’s 1 game. He looked good for the most part…for 1 game. Let’s hope he keeps it up.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Habsolutely says:

            I think with the right D partner, he’ll work out for us. but that is the key. He needs to paired with someone who he is comfortable with and develop some chemistry. If that happens it should turn out to be a really good trade.

          • Trisomy 21 says:

            Back the truck up, I never said his career was over. I merely stated one game doesn’t make him that elite defenseman that PG was hoping he’d acquired. I don’t hold anything against Kaberle, it sucked he played for some hated teams in his past, but so did Hal Gill. I can respect the skill he had, but I’m not about to say this was a genius move after one good game. And as Habsolutely said, no I wouldn’t have said I told you so after one game if he coughed up the puck and lead to goals against. In fact he can have a couple bad games in the next week or 2 because I don’ expect him to develop chemistry and a good understanding of our system immediately

        • dallyd31 says:

          See…the funny thing is that works both ways. When they got Kaberle, everyone had already tossed him under the bus. I said they should wait until he had played 10-12 games before they pass judgement, but no…he sucked.
          Now, when he played well, everyone is saying “it’s only one game…wait until he plays some games”

          Too funny…

          • Trisomy 21 says:

            I think you’re misinterpreting people’s opinions ddalley. People were upset about trading a contract that was almost up for one that’s bigger and longer. As for the skill comparison, I would be surprised if people actually thought kaberle was a downgrade from Spacek.

          • Habsolutely says:

            reading comprehension isn’t one of his strong points…

      • HardHabits says:

        I have anger management issues I’ll admit. I try to not explode but every so often my emotions get the best of me or shall I say the worst. The Kaberle trade set me off.

        I guess a stressful day can do that. A job interview that reopened old wounds and my day starting off with the Google app I used to depend on to help me get directions being ripped from my smart phone in favour of a much crappier Bing app.

        So I can over-react at times. However I also grab the bull by the horns. I resolved a major ongoing technical issue at work and have decided to stay at my current job and not take this new one. Rather rule in hell than serve in Heaven for the moment. Will wait for the chance to rule in Heaven when it comes.

        I also managed to install a highly sophisticated yet geeky GPS navigating system called Navit on my WebOS phone and in unison with the Bing maps app now have rendered my phone worthy of not being thrown out the window.

        The Habs on the other hand… I am holding my nose, not my breath.

        • Trisomy 21 says:

          I got a $10 app for free, I was pretty proud of myself. Go me go

          • Habsolutely says:

            I got that guitar tuner app, it’s awesome.

          • Trisomy 21 says:

            wtf i didn’t know there was one.
            I’m going to download that right now that’s amazing

          • Habsolutely says:

            its awesome when your at someones place and they find out you play guitar so they pull out their old untuned guitar out of the closet for you to play. :-)

          • HardHabits says:

            Good call. I just added one to my phone and an e-Guitar too.

            Is there a guitar tuner app that works like a meter? The one’s I see are just E-A-D-G-B-E notes which is better than nothing I guess.

    • mrhabby says:

      give some credit to the team once and while. price was going to make the save and the devils were not going to win…geesh.

    • Gerry H says:

      C’mon. Coulda-shoulda-woulda works both ways. Cammalleri hit the post twice. And Parise’s failure to get the puck in the air was at least partly because of the way Carey played it, giving him no room to follow through.

      • HardHabits says:

        Price played it well that much I agree. Had Parise lifted it, it would have at least forced a much better save to keep it out. There was much room top shelf though. The other factor is dems da breaks is equal to coulda-shoulda-woulda.

    • neumann103 says:

      “If the NHL was an F1 race and the Habs one of 30 race cars, with the Kaberle addition they have merely changed engine parts. Like they added a new Kaberle shaft. So this new unit gives the race car a bit more speed. Enough to pass from 22nd to 19th in the race because they just inched past a slower car on the last turn. Is it enough to get them to pass the finish line in the top 16 to get into the big race? We’ll have to wait and see as the race unfolds.”

      The Formula 1 comparison is an interesting choice. The view of success there is antithetical to the “we must win the Stanley Cup every year or else the entire season is a failure…a FAILURE I tells ya” meme that prompts our tank, grit, smurf-purge set.

      In F1 winning is not everything. Teams count podium finishes as much as they do wins. Teams that are outside the top 3 constructors (and therefore have almost no hope) are elated with Podiums.

      If you are Sauber (roughly around equivalent of 18th in your NHL analogy) you are delighted with an occasional podium finish and validated by scoring points.

      If you were Lotus or Williams – two proud names with history, but currently occupying the cellar – even making the cut of 16th in preliminary qualifying would be an accomplishment.

      Now I cannot imagine any organization spending $300 Million a year and always finishing at the bottom, with no hope of doing any better barring years of development work plus a miracle. That goes too far for me.

      But taking a bubble team through a winning 82 game season then getting to the Conference Finals is nothing to be ashamed of, just because they didn’t win the cup.

      So I don’t know about the F1 analogy. The notion of Win the Drivers or Constructors Championship or you are just the best of the LOSERS cow excrement insanity that gets trotted out here about the NHL is about 180 degrees opposite the reality of F1.

      “Et le but!”

  45. Danno says:

    You have to keep Emelin simply because when he’s paired with Kaberle the two of them become Ka-BOOM!

    ________________________________________

    “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  46. Hab-Q says:

    When all have returned from injury, we have 3 offensive-d-men in Markov, Kaberle and Subban.

    we will have 3 defensive d-men in Gill, Emilen and Gorges.

    That’s our top 6- pair them up as we see fit.

    Campoli was only signed because of the injuries in September so trade him.

    For a seventh it’s Diaz/Weber- I’d stick with Weber as a d-man/forwardfor now and give Raf more playing time in the Hammer.

    ______________________________________________________
    “I went to a fight the other night and a hockey game broke out”

    ~Rodney Dangerfield

  47. SmartDog says:

    You cant’ sit Emelin. He’s been part of what’s gone right with this team.

    I like Diaz and Weber but we have too many D now.. it’s crazy. Trade any of Weber, Diaz, Campoli, for something of value and we’re better off. Bundle them with an under-achieving small forward (take your pick) and pick up someone useful and we’d be looking better long term.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!


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