Subban, Habs submit salary figures; Lacroix new assistant coach

With a salary arbitration hearing scheduled for Friday, the Canadiens and restricted free-agent defenceman P.K. Subban submitted salary figures on Wednesday and they are more than $3 million apart.

Subban is asking for $8.5 million for one season, while the Canadiens are offering $5.25. Subban, who won the Norris Trophy as the NHL’s top defenceman two seasons ago, earned $3.75 million last season when he posted 10-43-53 totals in 82 regular-season games and had 5-9-14 totals in 17 playoff games.

Canadiens GM Marc Bergevin made a couple of other moves on Wednesday morning, announcing that Dan Lacroix has been hired as an assistant coach to replace Gerard Gallant, who is now head coach of the Florida Panthers, and Rob Ramage has been hired as a player-development coach, replacing Patrice Brisebois, who left the job for what he said were family reasons.

“We are very pleased to welcome Dan Lacroix as part of our coaching staff,” Canadiens head coach Michel Therrien said in a statement. “Daniel earned the respect of his peers for his coaching skills and his impressive knowledge of the game. He has worked as a coach for almost 15 years, including seven seasons as assistant coach in the NHL. He knows the Canadiens organization and his experience at the professional level made him a much coveted candidate. He is an excellent addition to our coaching staff and to the Canadiens organization.”

Lacroix, a 45-year-old Montreal native, has worked as an assistant coach in the NHL for seven of the past eight seasons, and was with the New York Rangers last  season. He also worked as assistant coach with the Tampa Bay Lightning from 2010 to 2013 and with the New York Islanders from 2006 to 2009. Lacroix also worked as assistant coach with the AHL’s Hamilton Bulldogs during the 2009-10 season.

Lacroix played 188 regular season games in the NHL as a left-winger between 1993 and 2000 with the Rangers, Boston Bruins, Philadelphia Flyers, Edmonton Oilers and New York Islanders. He registered career totals of 11 goals, seven assists and 379 penalty minutes.

Ramage played 1,044 regular-season games in the NHL as a defenceman between 1979 and 1994 and was part of the Canadiens’ 1993 Stanley Cup team. He also played with the Colorado Rockies, the Blues, the Calgary Flames, the Toronto Maple Leafs, the Minnesota North Stars, the Tampa Bay Lightning and the Philadelphia Flyers. Ramage and Bergevin were teammates with the Lightning.

“We welcome Rob Ramage as part of our hockey personnel,” Bergevin said in a statement. “Rob is a dedicated and competent hockey person who will contribute to our player development group. Our entire organization, and particularly our young defencemen will benefit from his experience and his knowledge.”

Ramage, 55, spent the last two seasons working as an amateur scout for the St. Louis Blues.

The Canadiens also announced Wednesday that Rick Dudley now holds the title of senior vice-president of hockey operations and that Scott Mellanby has been promoted to assistant general manager, working along with Larry Carrière under Bergevin. Trevor Timmins added the title of vice-president of player personnel and will also remain the club’s director of amateur scouting.

There are currently only six NHL defencemen with a cap hit above $7 million and Subban could become the seventh. Nashville’s Shea Weber tops the list at $7.857 million, followed by Minnesota’s Ryan Suter ($7.538 million), Pittsburgh’s Kris Letang ($7.25 million), Florida’s Brian Campbell ($7.12 million) and Toronto’s Dion Phaneuf and Los Angeles’s Drew Doughty ($7 million each).

Goaltender Carey Price is the highest-paid player on the Canadiens at this point, slated to earn $6.75 million next season during the third year of a six-year, $39-million contract with an annual cap hit of $6.5 million.

Subban’s agent, Don Meehan, was on Sportsnet’s Fan 590 radio on Wednesday and was asked if it was important to him and Subban that he become the highest-paid defenceman in the NHL based on average annual value.

“Really, we haven’t approached it in that respect,” Meehan said. “That’s not something that he’s instructed us to attend to. When you get down to an arbitration process, it really becomes in many respects a statistical analysis, and it can be different from a negotiation you’re having with a club. They’re really two different venues.

“But he’s a remarkable player, and he has a remarkable presence in Montreal. I think Montreal acknowledges that, and I think we’re all trying to do our best to see if we can come up with something that makes sense from both sides’ points of view.”

(Photo by Allen McInnis/The Gazette)

Habs, Subban $3 million apart on salary figures, by The Gazette’s Pat Hickey

Lacroix back in Habs fold, canadiens.com

Ramage joins Habs, canadiens.com

20 Questions with P.K. Subban, National Post

727 Comments

  1. Un Canadien errant says:

    New thread.

  2. Habitant in Surrey says:

    For a Pernell Karl diversion, I submit the #RogersPetition Update !

    Almost 2000, …1951 to be exact.

    C’mon Guyz, let’s get over the magic 2000 HUMP !!! :)

    I want to submit this sucker’s print-out to da boyz in Tarranna !

    I had upped the objective to 5000 from the original 2000, …but I don’t think we’ll get close to 5000 until We get closer to October when the fertilizer starts really hitting the ‘fan’ (the Habs Fans).

    Here are latest 10 Habz’ Amigos to sign;

    Peter Westcott
    just now

    Matt Sweet
    just now

    John Evely
    just now

    Tim Parr
    just now

    Cornelius Rooney, Canada
    just now

    Andrew Callum
    28 minutes ago

    mike wiewel
    16 hours ago

    tammy plante
    20 hours ago

    Wayne McCrae
    20 hours ago

    Daniel Lachance
    24 hours ago
    ____________________________________________________

    Listen to my CBC Radio ‘AirPlay’ interview, hosted by Dave White: https://soundcloud.com/yukonradiodave/habs-fans-shut-out-by-rogers?utm_source=soundcloud&utm_campaign=share&utm_medium=facebook

    Follow Me on Twitter: @HabInSurrey

    Petition To Protest Roger’s Blacking Out Of Habs’ Games On RDS West Of Quebec

    Read and sign at; http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/no-habs-blackout-rds

  3. Alvin says:

    I don’t understand. Why is PK asking for only 1 year ?

  4. Pucknut says:

    Thanks to UCe & HiB for their clarification of signing bonuses as they pertain to Salary & the Cap !!

    Posted @ 9:12 this morning.

  5. JohnBellyful says:

    There’s the Code, there’s the hockey code, and, believe it or not, there’s another code.
    (What is it with these code-makers? Did they run out of paper? Ink? Stone tablets?)

  6. habs001 says:

    Gallagher 45 goals,Galchenyuk 90 points,Eller 35 goals 70 points,Sekac 30 goals,Bourninal 30 goals,Beaulieu PK like numbers,Tinordi becomes Suter like…Most Hab fans would say this would be a dream scenario but in the cap world this would not work…This is why the cap waters down the league and teams…It almost puts the scouts in a position not too find too many stars as the cap will not allow you to keep all of them….Some posters will say you can trade some of your stars if too many but that really makes no sense..why do you have to trade a player you want for lesser players or draft choices where you hope to draft the same type of player you just gave away…This socialism will make sure that the majority of the clubs will have a chance to win the cup…but it will also make 50-75 years of no cup scenario very possible for the jewel teams in the NHL..

    • Cal says:

      “This is why the cap waters down the league and teams…It almost puts the scouts in a position not too find too many stars as the cap will not allow you to keep all of them…”

      Bunk. LA and Chicago and a few others have put together excellent teams. The cap waters down nothing but owners overpaying.

      • on2ndthought says:

        Chicago and LA built those teams while losing for years pre-cap. Chicago already broke up a cup winning team, ‘rebuilt’ around the same core, but now is going to have a hard time keeping support players signed. How will they keep Sharp, Hossa, Saad around for the next few years? The cap solves some problems and creates some too. If your organization is better at drafting (or able to lose long enough) and trading, but can’t find room under the cap for talented youngsters, it will lose them.

        “a cannonading drive”

      • habs001 says:

        The Habs of the seventies had 3 8M+ plus d and tons of 7m to 10m forwards…that team could never exist today…and Dryden..Also there are many players in Europe who are way better than your 4th liners here in the NHL..many of those dont play here because of the cap..no doubt it waters down the league

  7. habs-fan-84 says:

    …well that fun. Can thank 123456 for his post at 12:47pm.

  8. Mavid ® says:

    69

    Weed Wacker Grandma Smurf

  9. JUST ME says:

    I have heard P.K.`s interview on TSN radio and i still maintain that he is the real deal. A bigger than life human being ,so well educated and polite. I have no reason to believe otherwise than he said about the negociations going smoothly and being fair on both sides.
    As he stated this is stricktly business and has nothing to do with low balling, personnal feelings or being fair or not. The deal will be done and P.K. will be a Hab for a long long time.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      He, Don Meehan and Canadiens brass are doing a remarkably good job of at least trying to douse the flames, of letting the air out of the balloon. As they did last time around, when both sides congratulated each other on a professional, respectful, courteous process.

  10. HabinBurlington says:

    Exclusive look in at the Inner Sanctum of HI/O…..

    Only look if you are brave.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXRH50fvHWA

  11. PK says:

    MB and Meehan must be working hard today?

  12. Forum Dog says:

    Stubbs photo grabbed from twitter. A few Habs at the recent golf tournament.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BtuOw2-IYAALUZb.jpg:large

    Regardless of what happens with Subban, you can see the future of the Habs defence looks big and bright. Tinordi makes Bourque look small, and Beaulieu looks pretty solid for 21 year old kid. Considering both have already seen some time at the NHL, these are sure-fire big-minute players within the next two years.

    • DeadEnd says:

      It’s a little crazy to think that Prust, our supposed “policeman”, is the smallest guy in that photo.

    • Chris says:

      Pretty good sign when 6’0″ and 194 pound Brandon Prust looks like a smurf!

      • Forum Dog says:

        Those measurements are probably a bit generous (they usually are), but I’m willing to bet that none of the other guys in that picture – and probably 95% of the NHL in general – would want to tangle with him if they could help it.

        On a related note, I am pretty high on the toughness that Beaulieu and Tinordi bring to the back-end. Both guys can handle themselves when the mitts come off, but are also skilled/effective enough to warrant important minutes. I know the fighting stuff rankles some, but it is a part of hockey last I checked and you need to have guys who are willing and able to ward off the crease-crashers of the world. Tinordi we know can deliver (just ask Gleason), but I think Beaulieu could surprise someone if challenged. I’ve already seen him give some aggressive face-washes, and you know where that tends to lead…..

        • bwoar says:

          Fun note – Joe Finley, recently signed by the Bulldogs, feed Prust pretty hard in a game vs. the Islanders.

          If ya can’t beat ‘em, sign ‘em !

          • HabinBurlington says:

            Did I read this right, Joe Finley 6’8″ 247lbs?
            http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=81039

            No longer can MOAR be typed on HI/O!

            Edit: Watched some of his fights, seems to still not have the balance required for a man his size.

          • Forum Dog says:

            Jeezus Murphy – that is a big man. Unlikely to see any time with the Habs I assume, but at the very least he can help protect the younger guys working their way through the AHL.

            Actually, when you look at the Bulldogs potential roster, there are a number of tough-ish customers eligible (i.e. Nevins, Thrower, Dietz, Crisp, Gregoire, etc.). It will definitely give the smaller, skilled guys (i.e. Hudon, Andrighetto, Bennett, Thomas, Holland, etc.) more room to manoeuvre.

    • stephen says:

      Nice to see Bourque as part of the group.

      Don’t know why, but I’ve always imagined him being somewhat distant and aloof. So in my own little Habs world, I’m happy to see René playing well with others. ;)

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        Ditto.

        René might not be able to focus, to harness all his energy and talent all the time, but I don’t get the impression that he’s disliked or unpopular as a teammate.

    • Un Canadien errant says:

      Based on his appearance during interviews at the prospect development camp, and his appearance in this photo, I’m really encouraged that Nathan Beaulieu will have a good start to the season, that his fitness will not lag behind his talent. It took him a while to get it, but if he fills out his frame and adds some strength and power to his toolkit, he might turn into the draft steal we thought he was in 2011.

  13. PK says:

    Have had trouble logging on….
    Does that mean that HIO is imploding?
    OR is the clock still ticking?

  14. habs-fan-84 says:

    haha Subban just crashed HIO servers in the middle of the summer

  15. Chuck Kept Calm and Carey'd On ® says:

    HI/O still functioning. Still no sign of white smoke.

    Hab fans want choice! Sign the petition to give us back our games!
    http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/no-habs-blackout-rds

  16. 123456 says:

    Deal has been completed. To be announced at 1:00 EST

  17. kirkiswork says:

    It seems to me that everything is playing out quite normally and I am confident that PK will be signed long term before the arbitration begins.
    No need to panic.

  18. crane says:

    2 x 7.5 = 15
    2 x 8.5 = 17
    4 x 9.5 = 38
    70 million

  19. Paz says:

    Call Noah! We’re done!

  20. on2ndthought says:

    PK just quoted Carey “Chill out”

    “a cannonading drive”

  21. Shackles says:

    Just finished listening to PK chatting with the boys on TSN690 – MB should keep him around if not for his skillset then for his comic relief. The conversation flipped from shaving his back hair to excusing himself from an interview because he ate chicken wings last night with a little too much hot sauce and had to go to the washroom. How could anyone not like him?

  22. JohnBellyful says:

    NASA scientists have announced a massive asteroid is headed this way and could obliterate life on Earth when it hits the planet sometime around 7 a.m. Friday.
    The United Nations has called an emergency meeting for 2 p.m. this afternoon to activate plans to whisk a small group of men and women to deep underground bunkers to ensure the survival of the human race.
    The Montreal Canadiens have announced their arbitration hearing with PK Subban has been moved up to 5 p.m. today. Fans worry it will give the two sides less time to work out a deal before one is forced upon them.
    “If it’s arrived at acrimoniously, the residual effect will be brutal on their working relationship,” one fan blogged.

  23. Un Canadien errant says:

    The latest post from Sean McIndoe:

    http://grantland.com/the-triangle/looking-back-at-the-10-biggest-nhl-trades-from-2013-14/

    ———————————————————————–
    It’s somewhere between a toothless attack and a vicious homage.–Paul Rudd

    http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

  24. CHicoHab says:

    2 games away from the Stanley cup finals without their all star goalie. Yep. MB and MT are screwing things up.

  25. scrotchland says:

    bergivin the brain dead GM is going to screw this up too.
    Bad signings in the past (brierre, prust, desharnaise to name just 3) should have taught him a lesson.
    Now he has the most electrifying player and he is going to lose him. (maybe not now, but in the very near future).
    And all because pk hates therian and thats the reason he hasnt signed.

  26. habs-hampton says:

    What’s kind of lost in the PK salary debate is “what are you basing his new salary on?”. Are you paying him for what he has already done (ala Heatley), or on what he potentially will do (ala Alex Daigle)? Its always risky both ways, but I feel that PK is worth 7 based on the past and 9.5 if its over 8 years. The risk of PK turning into a Wade Redden is very small. Pay the man!

    • New says:

      The PK salary debate has raged on and on because quite frankly there is little else to debate. Canadiens fans love to be d-o-o-m-e-d!

      PK is like any other really good player. There are nights when you would put a C on his chest and nights when you put a hand over your eyes and wonder what happened.

      The fun isn’t in what happens to PK and his bank account, but in chattering away about it and reading the other opinions. Poor Weekes tweeted an offhand comment dismissing the Habs offer as insulting and starts a mini-uproar.

      The joy is in the journey not the destination.

  27. NightRyder says:

    Hickey on the radio out this way saying he doesn’t think there will be a captain to start the year.

    • shiram says:

      I can see why they would go this way for this year, but it would be kind of sad to think it would only be the second time this team did not have a captain.

      Only other season was : 2009-10, IIRC

  28. Rob says:

    Man. I’ve been very calm and logical about this whole PK thing from the get go, always believing it will get done right before the deadline. But i have to admit…..this is stressful!

    The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

  29. Thurston says:

    I’m sticking with my prediction of an eight-year, $64 million contract for P.K.
    If that turns out to be the case, please be notified that I will be keeping my predictions for the winning lottery numbers to myself.

  30. sirs81 says:

    PK has another important call to take now so he is delayed to talk on TSN team radio…. lol

  31. HabsWin-nipeg says:

    As much as I want Subban to sign a long term deal with the Habs, I can’t help thinking of the worst case scenario (in my own mind), which would be that Subbans/Meehans demands are just too much for MB to consider and he is “forced” to accept a one year arbitration decision and then trades PK (I believe it can’t be done until January sometime). The return on PK would be huge in terms of picks/prospects and roster player(s). It wouldn’t be my ideal end to things, but it helps me not be too wrapped up in the “doom and gloom” scenario.

    For those worried that MB will “screw this up” – MB has consistently shown keen insight into what the Habs need, even when everyone else questioned him (hiring MT comes to mind). If he thinks that signing PK has to be done at any price, he will do it. If he believes there are options even if Subban isn’t signed long term, he will weigh that and make his decision. In my opinion, MB can’t really screw this up – he either has a star player locked up long term, or he has a star player that numerous teams would unload the treasure chest for if it came to that.

    Having said all that, I am firmly of the belief that a deal will be made prior to arbitration as I believe PK when he says Montreal is where he wants to be, and I believe that MB wants that as well.

    • on2ndthought says:

      They can’t negotiate a new contract until January, but can be traded any time (I think).

      “a cannonading drive”

    • bwoar says:

      MB can only screw this up by not giving Subban whatever money it takes.

    • Paz says:

      Anyone who signs Daniel Briere for 8 million for 2 years is very capable of making further mistakes.

      I will be surprised and disappointed if this goes to arbitration.

      • bwoar says:

        Anyone who signs Daniel Briere for 8 million for 2 years is very capable of learning from mistakes.

        • Paz says:

          Everyone is capable of learning from mistakes, but GM’s are hired to avoid these mistakes.

          Otherwise you or I could be the GM.

          • shiram says:

            Turning Brière into Parenteau could work out very well.
            We’ll see, and it’s too soon to judge.
            But that seems like a lesson was indeed learned.

            And no one makes no mistake ever.

      • HabsWin-nipeg says:

        That was a risk taken with certain unknowns in the picture (was Briere still good enough to merit the money). I don’t think there are any unknowns with Subban – they know exactly what they have and how much they are willing to spend to keep him. As much as I want PK in Montreal long term, I would hate to see MB be handcuffed in the future by a ridiculous contract. One player is never bigger than the team. How much is too much? 8 million? 9 million? 10 million? We don’t have any idea what Meehan/Subban are asking for in terms of cap hit. Would you be OK if the cap hit was 9.5 to 10 million per year? We can say “give PK what he wants” but MB has to look long term at the team that he is trying to build and what he will have to pay for others down the road. He also has to look at precedent – if he’s willing to “overpay” to keep Subban, what about when one of the other young stars takes the next step? PK sets the bar for the future. Lots for MB to think about – far more than all of us, who only have to worry about will he sign long term or not.

        • Paz says:

          There are 29 GM’s who would overpay Subban. That’s why whether its today or next year Subban will be overpaid by someone.

          I just hope it’s us.

          • HabsWin-nipeg says:

            I guess it depends on how much you are willing to “overpay”. Do I think PK is worth 10 million a year? It’s hard for me to get my head around anyone being “worth” that kind of money, but in the NHL economy, I would have no issue with a long term contract that ended up with PK making $10 million in the final 3-4 years of the contract, because he will very likely be “worth” it in 8 years according to the NHL pay scale. I’d be comfortable with a contract that started around 6.5 million and ended worked it’s way up to 10 million.

          • Paz says:

            I agree. Make it so, Number 1.

          • HabsWin-nipeg says:

            And harmony is restored – at least for us. Always appreciate your posts Paz.

          • Paz says:

            Right back at you sir.

  32. Un Canadien errant says:

    Using a metric that measures how many goals a player scores at even strength per minutes played, Pacioretty scored an average of 1.61 per 60 minutes of ice time, second only to the Ducks’ Corey Perry (1.66).

    http://www.si.com/nhl/2014/07/30/top-nhl-goal-scorers-even-strength-advanced-stats

    ———————————————————————–
    It’s somewhere between a toothless attack and a vicious homage.–Paul Rudd

    http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

  33. HabinBurlington says:

    The point of PK doing charity work was brought up on the previous page of this thread. I have no way of knowing if PK, his father and his brother receive money from Hyundai, but I would expect that at a minimum they probably cover his expenses as related to the charity.

    Here is an article from a couple years back, along with a video. You can hear PK discuss how this program could have helped his family, you hear him also say words like my family and I helping kids.

    Perhaps he gets something for being an ambassador, but to think that PK is being disingenuous with his passion for this program and the charity it represents, seems ridiculous to me.

    http://thehockeywriters.com/what-contract-p-k-subban-focuses-on-underprivileged-youth/

  34. Luke says:

    Re-Post from the last page ‘older comments’ section. Because I would like to clarify the PK-Brand concept:

    I mentioned the PK-Brand earlier today (Actually a few weeks back as well) and I would like to state, I’m all for him doing it.

    The league needs a little freakin’ personality. As much as I hate Marchand, at least he isn’t the Rice Cake of Boredom that Toews the Boy Turned Robot is.

    So build a brand, PK. Success in the league is what will drive the relevance, so it shouldn’t hurt his play.

    Now, I’d prefer he do it in Montreal. I don’t see much added value in Toronto over Montreal, but I could certainly see it in the USA.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      So Toews used to be much different? I had the impression he was this way all along, thus the Captain Serious, and perhaps why at such a young age he was appointed captain. Damn, now I have to reconsider my man crush on him, and my pipe dream of him one day being a Hab.

      • JohnBellyful says:

        The man crush is okay. It’s all the screaming and jumping up and down that crosses the line.

      • Luke says:

        Are you saying he was born a robot?

        Whenever I looked upon him, I always thought I saw the faint glimmer, the tiniest spark, of humanity, in his eyes trying to re-ignite.

        • shiram says:

          That’s a cyborg then!

          • JohnBellyful says:

            If he was ‘born’ a robot, that is, made, he’s an android.

          • shiram says:

            I thought the spark of humanity would come from him having been human, but got “upgraded” to cyborg status.

            But indeed, if he’s always been non organic, that’s an android.

          • Luke says:

            When all the Insiders said that they “broke the mould” with regards to Toews, I always thought they were speaking figuratively.

          • JohnBellyful says:

            Only one way of knowing for sure, by applying Asimov’s Three Laws of Robotics:
            1.) Has Toews ever injured a human being or, through inaction, allowed a human being to come to harm?
            2.) Has he ever obeyed orders given him by human beings (this would rule out coaches) except where such orders conflicted with the First Law?
            3.) Has he protected his own existence as long as such protection did not conflict with the First or Second Law?
            Hmmmm, I’m leaning more toward his being human.

          • Luke says:

            Yah, but what about Asimov’s Unwritten Laws of Robotics?

  35. Maritime Ronn says:

    Just had some news from Dunboyne Mike (aka Irelend Mike) and he said to say Hello to all his HIO buddies.

    Dunboyne is in the western part of France not far from the sea in a little town called Quimper.

    He mentioned he was completely out of HIO touch and was wondering if the PK contract was an ongoing story….
    I told him no – that it was pretty quiet on that front.

  36. sirs81 says:

    If PK is a team guy like some people think he is. He would take less money to stay in Montreal and help the team with the cap space to bring people later on to win the cup. Simple as that. Markov and others have done that for their NHL clubs…

    • Chris says:

      Subban has already done so, on his previous deal.

      Subban will accept a long-term contract that he feels fairly compensates him within the NHL salary framework. I don’t know what that number is, nor do I suspect that many outside of his family and Don Meehan.

      There aren’t many star players that take a “discount” to stay with their team. Markov, in that respect, was somewhat unique. We just saw that Jonathan Toews, considered the ultimate team guy by many around the league, just accepted a cap-crippling $10.5 million contract. Is Subban significantly less valuable to the Montreal Canadiens than Jonathan Toews is to the Blackhawks? I will leave that to smarter minds than me to debate.

  37. Mattyleg says:

    I honestly hope that someone is thinking of the children…

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  38. JohnBellyful says:

    At 8:39 a.m. when I did a search of Subban I was given 1,180,000 choices to click on.
    At 11:42 a.m., 1,280,000.
    This is the guy who should be the arbitrator. He knows how to get results.
    Especially when it involves a stud of a player with lots of energy.


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