Ryder sits, younger Kostitsyn on the first line

Sergei Kostitsyn will make his NHL debut on Thursday night in Philadelphia playing on the Canadiens’ first line with Saku Koivu and Christopher Higgins. Michael Ryder will watch the game from the Wachovia Centre’s press box.

Carey Price will get the start in goal against the Flyers, with Jaroslav Halak as his back up.

179 Comments

  1. Habs Suck says:

    Ryder, who needs a lot of space to score, would probably do well and score 30-40 goals annually in Europe or Russia.

  2. ccs says:

    All I know is that on Saturday night on HNIC the laffs will more than likely have a chance to pass us in the standings and we will be on the outside looking in. I hope I am wrong about Guy and he can turn this team around in a hurry. GO HABS GO.

  3. kevin m says:

    This team has to get a lot tougher mentally. They don’t play with any intensity. They’re soft… with the exception of Koivu and They lack confidence.

    Philly has had how many suspensions so far this year? 4?

    And where are they in the standings?

  4. johnny boy says:

    Richards is signing a 10 year contract. he’s the kind of player the habs could really use this year. We could have had him, but we drafted A. kastitsyn at # 10 ahead of him.

  5. Matt. says:

    Krob, every word you have said is gold. I agree 100%.

  6. krob1000 says:

    I was saying the move is STUPID! Because it is.

    When you can’t score and you bench (or demote) your best scorer for 10 games…….

    It is like being really hungry, complaining about how hungry you are and then putting down a slice of Pizza, starving again and then saying jeez I really need to eat you know.

    I am not saying to bench Koivu I am just saying that Ryder is not our teams downfall and there are plenty of guys to share the blame.

    Singling one guy out like this is pathetic when he brings an honest effort is foolish.

    There is no way that this has not spilled over in the dressing room and I am afraid that maybe some posters were right and Carbo is losing the room.

  7. Corio says:

    I will not blame Carbo for the team’s woes but there are some criticisms that he undoubtedly deserves like..

    - Publicly criticizing your players instead of always backing them no matter what the context..

    That is a big one and I am sure he has pissed off a few people in doing so..

    He needs to stand up for his players and always place them in the best light even if the situation says otherwise..

  8. Habs_008 says:

    Good, Ryder has sucked all year.

  9. Matt. says:

    Tell you what, even if we bring any superstar and ask him to skate on his hands he isn’t going to produce. At the beginning he’ll try, as hard as he possibly can i’m sure, but eventually, he’ll give up. Asking offensive players to sit at their blue line, forecheck with one man and let the opposition walk in with relative ease just doesn’t work anymore. We’re chasing the puck for 45 minutes a game! Can you imagine how frustrating that is?

    This has everything to do with Carbo. ABout 90% of it.

  10. ccs says:

    I think KIRK would make a better head coach than GUY

  11. fun police says:

    hard to defend the habs these days. media harps on us for not scoring goals, we counter by using two defensemen as forwards. leaf fan laughs because of the way the season finished last year. both are carbo’s fault. carbo can’t make in game adjustments, and obviously his pregame adjustments are brutal. i don’t care how good dandy plays this year, he’s a fourth liner who may get 6 goals this year. streit, may get 8. those are not first line numbers. ryder, even struggling will get at least 15. however, ryder will score in bunches once he shakes off this funk.
    CARBO, YOU ARE TERRIBLE.

  12. Corio says:

    At least Dandenault can put the puck in the net, eh? huh? eh?

  13. ccs says:

    Its not like all the others are lighting up the score board. Its not the players, they can score with the right system in place.

  14. Wops says:

    Can we agree on one thing though… Carbo does not make his decisions alone. If we blame him, we have to blame Jarvis and Muller too.

    If he has to go, because we do not like his choices or strategies, Jarvis and Muller too. They are all implicated in the decision making, do not think otherwise.
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  15. krob1000 says:

    It appears as though Ryder is taking the blame for this entire season and has been since the first hint of a slide. Pathetic……before this year I never even really liked Ryder but this situation is the worst I ever seen and reminds me of what my father said they did to Lafleur in the early 80′s (NO I am NOT comparing Ryder to Lafleur…just the treatment).

    Ryder had better be traded or he should go sign in Russia and play with Perezhogin and score 30 or 40 there.

  16. Habsrule1 says:

    Sorry krob…your comment is the stupid one because Koivu is a playmaker, and it’s Ryder’s job to finish the play. Koivu has been setting him up, and Ryder misses the net or doesn’t shoot. Not to say Koivu has been lights out, but he’s been much better than Ryder.

    Watch the games please.

    Go Habs Go!!

    Habsrule

  17. ccs says:

    We need Ryder so that in the last game of the season he can score a hat tick against the laffs and put us in the playoffs. With a new coach of course…..

  18. Corio says:

    Koivu is the heart and soul of the team and the captain so benching him will do nothing but send the team into a serious morale crash..

    It’s not stupid, it’s necessary. PUNK! :p

  19. ccs says:

    Its no wonder players do not want to come here…Carbo has to go and soon. He cannot motivate players. They have given up on him and for good reason. If anyone believes he will still be coach at the end of this season you need to give your head a shake.

  20. johnny boy says:

    I’m not a huge Ryder fan, but this is a terrible decision. Streit has been playing worse. Dandenault is not as talented. He has to play himself out of the funk.

  21. Matt. says:

    I don’t even know what to say fun police. You know that guy who covered for carbo about 4 times a thread last and the beginning of this year; I was that guy. I feel the shame, like I should crawl under a heavy rock, settle myself into the fetal position and die.

    I-I-I think it’s time to slowly back away from Carbonneau like others have mentioned… Terrible, just terrible…

  22. Habsrule1 says:

    I think it’s better than having him play, including on the PP, and do NOTHING.

    I agree he needs to play, but he also needs to think. Put him back next game, give him good minutes…just that he hangs himself with the minutes he gets every time….and I’m a Ryder fan, but he’s slumping big time…and isn’t working when he gets the ice time. Blame Ryder, not Carbo.

    Go Habs Go!!

    Habsrule

  23. krob1000 says:

    By that logic should we sit Koivu then as he has 1 goal in his last 18 games and had been on every PP, played more minutes and been on the top line. This move is STUPID.

    STUPID!

  24. Wops says:

    I agree that Ryder should at least play on our fourth line. One day he’ll come out of his funk.
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  25. sidhu says:

    We’re doing amazing things for Ryder’s trade value by sitting him in the press box.

  26. Corio says:

    It has NOTHING to do with Carbo! Ryder was on the first line as usual at the beginning of the season, he wasn’t producing. Many things have happened prior to Ryder arriving at this unfortunate stage.

    - Chats with coach & management
    - shuffling of lines
    - More chats
    - less ice time
    - benching

    Nothing has worked!

    What do you recommend Mr Knowitall?

  27. fun police says:

    CARBO IS TERRIBLE!!!!

  28. ccs says:

    Oh yeah I know that Ryder has to take some of the blame as well but your not going to score many from the press box. Guy give your head a shake. Ryder needs to play alot of minutes per game on the top line to score. As well on the pp. Give him some more time. Play him in the right situation and with the right amount of ice time. The Press box will do plenty for his trade value if thats what is in his future.

  29. fun police says:

    does this mean streit as a forward again?

  30. coutNY says:

    Estimated $5.5-$6 per year???? looks like the’ll need to unload in July…

  31. Matt. says:

    Looks like Mike Richards is going to sign with Phili on a 10 to 12 year extension. <—- that is not a typo.

  32. ccs says:

    Wow Carbo really knows how to destroy players careers. Last season Samsonov this year Ryder and possibly Koivu. Ryder will score 30 goals again just not with the Habs.

  33. coutNY says:

    Carbo must have read the Béliveau article … cause he is heeding the Toe Blake strategy

    DAVE STUBBS
    The Gazette
    on Dec 11

    “I remember (coach) Toe Blake one day told me, ‘Jean, I think I’ll put all the youngsters coming up with you,’ ”Béliveau said.

  34. 24cups says:

    I am sure that all decisions made on the line up are reviewed by BG.

  35. Wops says:

    A.Kostitsyn 46
    S.Kostitsyn 74

    Andrei should change is number to 47 to be AK47.
    and it would be sweet too with Sergei’s 74.

    ;-D
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  36. Corio says:

    He has had MORE then ample opportunity to get his ass in gear and shrug off this so-called slump to no avail. It’s time he looks at his reflection on this ice from the press box and reevaluates his existence in the NHL imo..

    Oh and Dandy, yes, at least he has scored in the last what 15 games? How many points has Ryder had?

  37. JF says:

    I’m glad to see S. Kostitsyn getting the start on the first line. Of the others who have been tried there, only Dandenault has not looked out of place. Perhaps he will be the spark that will get Higgins and Koivu going.

    I hope the Habs have studied videos of their last game against the Flyers, which was perhaps the best game they’ve played all season. They played an aggressive, fast-skating, hard-hitting forechecking game. In fact that’s the kind of game they were generally playing at the beginning of the season. It worked, so I’m at a loss to understand why they got away from it. They look feeble when they try and play a game based solely on defense. They get few scoring chances, create many turnovers, and spend most of the game trying to dig the puck out of their own zone. What happened to the aggressive, offensive game that worked so well? It was also a lot more fun to watch! Games these days are agonizing.

  38. Matt. says:

    Poor Ryder, he’s holding that stick so tight it’s going to explode into a million pieces… And as if Streit is playing as a forward and we have a forward in the press box… what a mess.

    On the plus side, Gorgeous Gorges is in, S. Kostitsyn is in AND as of 1:12 this afternoon, the score is still 0-0!

  39. christophurrr says:

    so streit and dandy are both playing wing again? wicked.

    let the 30 goal scorer sit. that’ll get him kick started

  40. ebk says:

    excellent post.

    If the Habs are going to struggle to make the play-offs, let’s do it with prospects, not two Defenseman as forwards and a couple of questionable FA pickups.

  41. Da Hema says:

    I think we all need to lower our expectations about some of these younger players. We are getting a youth movement–including all its associated growing pains.

    I continue to be confused about sitting Ryder. Certainly he has been a disappointment in terms of scoring goals, but he is not a liability on the ice. Nor for that matter has he single-handedly cost the team a game like, say, Kostopolus, Smolinski, or Huet.

    I am also puzzled about sitting O’Byrne for a bouncing, bad-luck puck that ended up in the net. I have seen Brisebois screw up like that a 1000 times and no one ever benched him.

    What puzzles me most is how the Habs over the past few years bring up younger players, who play well initially, and then all of a sudden just vaporise. I distinctly remember Hossa played well at first, and then was no where to be found. Perezhogin also comes to mind.

    This raises some disturbing questions, at least for me, about the coaches and the veteran players. What are they doing with these younger players? I categorically refuse to place any blame on the Habs’s younger players for the team’s poor play of late. The veterans on this team are not providing leadership, pure and simple.

    The good news is that our slump began in early December, unlike last year where it started at the end of the month. Gainey was handcuffed on making trades because the team still had a reasonable chance of making the playoffs. If in January this team is in 10th or 11th place, then trade Koivu and Kovalev and get some young players and draft picks in return. I would much rather watch youthful errors than veteran mediocrity.
    _________________________________________________________
    “How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?”
    –Jacques Plante

  42. Smart Dog says:

    Sitting O’Byrne is moronic.

    Brisbois must have made a deal with the Devil. Doesn’t matter how much he screws up or how stupidly… he gets to play. It’s the only answer.

    _________________________________________________
    My favorite player is Grab-ARF!-ski

  43. 24 Cups says:

    This probably isn’t the best time to discuss it but what is up with Esposito? Total free fall or what? Would make a great debate on this site on a non Hab game day.

    The Original 24 Cups

  44. habsfan80 says:

    carbo try this:

    s.k74 s.k11 a.k27
    a.k46 t.p15 c.h21

    Dose anyone know what ryder’s + – was this time last year. he is only -1 which is good and last year he ended up with a -25. i would rather 15 goals and a – 1 then 30 goals and a – 30

    bob try this:
    fire carbo hire someone with NHL experince

    pat burns
    scotty bowman ( i wish )
    or take down our last stanleycup winning coach from the pressbox

  45. Habs Suck says:

    I like the idea of Demers, but I also think Hartley would do a great job here. Both of these guys are proven winners with much experience and coaching excellence.

  46. habsfan80 says:

    steiner good luck on your exam and you should see a good show on express tonight, i have a feeling koivu will break from his slump.

    Go habs Go
    #25 in 08

  47. moeman says:

    First line for Kjr. Wow.

    ~ have a powerful day ~

  48. MannyP says:

    Here’s an interesting thought: We need a big, powerful centerman, right?
    Which current Canadiens forward was drafted as a centre, as is now considered our best forward AND a power forward? That’s right: Chris Higgins. Why not have Chris Higgins play at the centre position? We could then trade Tomas Plekanec, and take advantage of the fact that his value has never been so high. I’m sure we could get something interesting in return. It’s either we trade Saku Koivu or Tomas Plekanec, at this point. We can’t have two small centres and expect to win the Stanley Cup. The most successful GMs out there, are the ones who aren’t afraid to cash in on a player’s value at its peak. So that’s what I would do. Test the market for Tomas Plekanec and stick it out with Koivu and try to win a Cup with him.

    PS: Carey Price looked GREAT tonight. Much better than he’s looked the last few games. He was finally coming out of his crease and challenging the shooters. He finally looked ALIVE and moving. That’s always good.

  49. HabsFansince49 says:

    I’m sorry, but Carbo even looks bad! Night after night, he looks lost behind the bench! He instills no confidence, projects no vision, rallies no troops. He is lost in the desert.

  50. downeast hab says:

    Julien was let go because Gainey never hired him. Everyone has their tag alongs and if something happened that Gainey was no longer GM, carbo would follow the same fate as Julien. why not go back to the line combinations of early season. Couldnt hurt. Also, what about Robinson for coach, any one second the motion.

  51. Da Hema says:

    I am not in agreement with the rising sentiment to fire the coaches. All it would do is lead, perhaps, to a few games where the players put out their full efforts, but then the players will revert back to the way they are playing now. The negative message to the players will be this: they are not accountable for their play on the ice–just blame the coaches.

    As much as I love and admire Robinson, he simply could not handle the emotional wear and tear of being a head coach in Montreal. Robinson had a meltdown as head coach in Los Angeles for heaven’s sake! Indeed he is even more inclined than Carbo to call out his players publicly. I would love to see Robinson at some future point as an assistant coach, but he definitely cannot be a head coach in this league.
    _________________________________________________________
    “How would you like a job where, every time you make a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?”
    –Jacques Plante

  52. habsguy says:

    Chuck…thanks bud, but it’s ok, he just comfirmed what other posters have told me about him..

  53. habsguy says:

    cournoyer12 ….come on bud, yesterday you said he was plaing better and shouldn’t even be benched…make up oyur mine there buddy

  54. habsguy says:

    well said WOPS….

  55. Chuck says:

    cournoyer12, the poster in question that you’re referring to is “habsguy”. Please stop typing his name incorrectly in an effort bait/insult him.

    .
    .
    .

    ______________________________________________
    “Vote Saku for All-Star… or little Timmy gets it!!!”

  56. PattyBoy31 says:

    Ryder didn’t look bad last game, he made a few good plays. I’m all for bringing up the younger talent but come on, we’re basically closing the door on ryder now. I’m not a ryder fan or anything, but I think although he hasn’t been producing, its still not time to give up on him.

  57. HabsFansince49 says:

    This is at rock bottom! There is no way Ryder should be benched.
    The depths of Carbonneau’s stupidity are endless. He has got to go! And I realize that he is Gainey’s protege, so poor ol’ Bob must go.
    C’mon Mr Gillette; this is not Liverpool – get rid of the incompetence at the top, please.

  58. Corio says:

    Wow, awesome! Really looking forward to seeing this kid’s skills..

  59. RS says:

    As we all know, those lines will last maybe half a period.

    Win or lose, let the kids play, make mistakes, learn from them and play some more.

    By the way, Esposito was cut for the third year in a row from the Canadian junior team. Hab prospect Ryan White was cut. PK Subban sticks around apparently as the 7th defenceman.

  60. 24 Cups says:

    Every once in a while the elder statesmen on this site have to set things right!

    The Original 24 Cups

  61. ccs says:

    I guess Ryder is this years Samsonov

  62. P St. Pierre says:

    Nice…I’m happy to see Koivu and Higgins finally put with a player with some offensive prowess. I’m also happy to see Kostitsyn not get shoved on the third line. Let’s just hope that Carbonneau doesn’t split them up and that he gets the team to play aggressively and not play defense the whole game. I also want to see more ice time for the first two lines. Any idea if Higgins moves over to RW or not?

  63. Mike says:

    sitting ryder is the wrong move! again horrible coaching by Carbo.

  64. Habsrule1 says:

    Give me a break!

    Carbo just can’t win with you people. for all his mistakes, he’s 100 times better than all of you.

    Great moves in both cases.

    It’s up to Ryder to prove his worth when he gets on the ice, and don’t say he hasn’t had the chance! He took 6 shots on Saturday because of Koivu’s effort, and missed the net 6 times!

    Go Habs Go!!

    Habsrule

  65. abhishek says:

    I couldn’t agree more. He’s still a young player on a young team. This will not help his confidence, or anyone else’s.
    Having the first line constantly change doesn’t do much for Koivu or Higgins either. It might work tonight, but might now work later.
    Still, I’m happy to see so many younger players cracking the lineup. Even if it doesn’t say much about our sinking ship.

  66. Matt. says:

    Oh, you heard O’byrne? I would of thought the equipment manager was going to get the chance… he is under contract after all.

  67. BigHabsFan says:

    talk about being thrown into the fire…at least he’s not stuck on the 4th line

    i also heard a rumour that if a.kostitsyn doesnt work out on the first line they are going to put o’byrne up there to see what he can do

  68. abhishek says:

    Habsrule1, Carbo won’t win any fans as long as he continues to juggles his lines with every shift.
    We’re also talking about the habs, so every fan will feel like they can coach the team, b/c the team just means that much to us.

    I don’t doubt for a second that doing Guy’s job is easy (Can you imagine every move you make being interpreted by the press?).

    Take it easy, we’re all just venting out our frustration at the current fall. And yes, it is up to Ryder to pick up the pace, but how much more of a confidence boost would it be if the coach came out and backed him?

    As much as I despise the leafs, the one thing my friend pointed out is that while they were in their free fall not once did the coach throw a player under the bus, and Mats Sundin pointed the finger at the team, not the coach. That’s what this team (especially Guy) needs to learn.

  69. krob1000 says:

    Shucks folks I’m speechless……

    IF there is not a trade pending I will be very upset even if Sergei gets a damn hat trick. I thought we were now going to be able to boast having a thirty goal guy on our third line or have three threatening lines and instead we now have a less dangerous lineup than we did before the call up. Unbelievable.

    I just had all of the hope of Sergei’s call up sucked from me.

    So how does that mean our third and fourth lines look??

    This either makes a trade official or I am officially “distancing” myself from Carbo as done by another loyal poster and Carbo supporter recently.

  70. Habsrule1 says:

    abhishek,

    What you say is fine, and not crazy at all, but I also tend to disagree with all this “you can’t call out players” crap. Guy is not the first coach to do it, and it has worked before. I don’t think saying our goalies need to be better is throwing them under the bus. These are adults, not pee-wees. If you can take critisism from your coach, you need to toughen up! And as far as ruining careers, that is a total joke. These guys are getting plenty of chances, and causing the Habs to lose. If Carbo leaves Ryder there, and we keep losing, half of the posters on here will be calling for his head because he’s not doing anything to get the team going. I know a lot of what is said is out of frustration….so are my posts. I’m so tired of it always being the coaches fault cause none of you want to blame the precious millionaire players who are not working!

    Go Habs Go!!

    Habsrule

  71. krob1000 says:

    29 other NHL teams are!!

  72. HabsInBlood says:

    Good one Krob1000.

  73. Matt. says:

    I know Ryder is supposed to be a goal scorer and he isn’t scoring. But he is working his butt off out there in other aspects. For one, He’s hitting and grinding and skating. Dandenault and Streit are -7 and -8 while Ryder is only a -3. Imagine that, Ryder is only a -3 and he isn’t even scoring!

    Benching a top player should come as a result of that player not giving his best effort. Ryder has given all he possibly can, he just can’t find the net. Benching him just means he gets less time to break the curse and steps on his confidence some more. He may not deserve a spot on the top line, but some fourth line action would give him the chance to score a goal or two.

    I just don’t see why Streit deserves to play over Ryder, especially not in Ryders position.

  74. Habs Suck says:

    Interesting note of the +/- stats, but consider also that Dandy and Streit get more overall ice time than Ryder.

  75. ccs says:

    I dont think anyone is having fun playing in montreal these days.

  76. krob1000 says:

    If you remember how you played when you were relaxed imagine how you’s have played if you were being singled out night in night out in the sports most difficult city by your coach.

    I think Ryder needs to be traded and we need to get something. This has to look really bad for any potential free agents out there uless a trade is in the works (which it may very well be in which case I apologize in advance).

  77. Corio says:

    Regarding Beliveau’s comments on the team, there was something that struck me about what he said that made total sense. Often times teams get so caught up in working a ‘system’ that perhaps in many cases goes against the grain with many types of players. Not to say that players should not be versatile but when Beliveau said that he used to tell players to play the style they played that got them into the NHL it occurred to me that getting back to basics and allowing players’ more freedom in that way could be the trick that reignites a team who is going through a slump like this..

    I remember when I was playing hockey that if I relaxed and was having fun playing my game that I would make the best plays and score the most goals…

    Back to basics!

  78. Matt. says:

    and yet you are saying it isn’t Carbo’s fault? See below.

  79. krob1000 says:

    Hey TradeRyder if you are out there I now agree ……..Trade Ryder because noone deserves this (except Samsonov). He is clearly not a part of our plans so lets move on and not have it affect the rest of the team. We can see him score 30,40 or dare I say it maybe even fifty if he goes and plays with Thornton in San Jose. Joe will set him up for forty and bank ten off his legs.

  80. Habs Suck says:

    Ryder, if given the space, can beat any goalie with his quick release shot. But, a 50 goal scorer??? I highly doubt it. You’re potentially putting him up there with the big boys, the purists, the stars like LeCavalier, Kovalchuk, Heatley, Ovechkin, Crosby, Thornton, etc…

    Sorry, but Ryder will never sit on that throne! He is a sharp shooter with limited other skills. He has poor vision on the ice, makes weak plays, without great speed, and carries only a few tricks in his bag which teams have taken note of and can solve him.

    Does he grind? yes. Does he work hard? yes. Does he instill a sense of danger or fear in the opposition when he steps on the ice? no. Do you think teams are trying to figure out ways to contain Michael Ryder? no (not even when he was scoring).

    The Habs should do both themselves and Ryder a favor by dealing him.

  81. arcosenate says:

    this team needs to crash the net and get some garbage goals. i don’t think ryder has been within 20 feet of the net all year. not every goal is beautiful, lemieux scored some crappy goals in his career too. man, i just don’t see kostitsyn the younger as the solution, let me be wrong though if at all possible. this isanother one of those games where our lack of size will be apparent, i hope we decide to skate tonight.

  82. krob1000 says:

    Remember the days where palyers defected to play in the NHL….I am concerned that Ryder may just go AWOL and end up with Perezhogin and a Russian bride. If it happens I will send him a wedding gift.

  83. saku11 says:

    I hope Perezhogin decides to come back to the Habs sometime in the next couple of years.

  84. Sulemaan says:

    I think it’s good that Kostitsyn junior is playing but I question why we are benching Ryder. I realize he hasn’t scored but he has been working hard from the games I saw. He’s just not getting any breaks.

    You can switch up Kostitsyn Jr. with Ryder on the first line. I just think we are not going to do anything better for the guy’s confidence or his trade value as Habsrule1 correctly noted.

  85. Habs_008 says:

    People listen up! Why put Ryder on the 3rd or 4th line? whats the point, he is a TOP 6 forward! He cant play on line 3 cause its the shut-down line, and line 4 would be the energy line. He isnt that either. If we put him on line 3 or 4 it will just be a defensive liability. Either put him on the top two lines, or sit him. Trade him and he will score 40 or more the next year. Hopefully he is not in our conference next year. He will turn out to be the next LeClair.

  86. ebk says:

    so he is not good enough to play on the Habs Top 6 but if he is traded, he will score 40 somewhere else?

  87. showey47 says:

    Ryder may someday regain his goal scoring form but he will never be a john leclair cause leclair played where ryder does not go, the front of the net.

  88. saku11 says:

    A more experienced coach would get more out of this team than Carbo. The players deserve their portion of the blame for the recent slump but Carbo needs to accept his as well. For those who place all the blame on the players, you need to ask yourself what role a coach is supposed to play. His ridiculous line combos, crappy system that doesn’t fit the team we have, and constant calling out of players all point to him being a bad coach. It’s fine to call out a veteran player who’s playing way below his potential, like Mike Keenan did to Kipper, but to call out your rookie goaltender when the whole team played a crappy game is just wrong. It’s also normal to switch up lines once in a while but I think he’s the only coach that would put Tom Kostopoulos or Mark Streit on the top line.

    That being said, looking forward to seeing Sergei in action alongside Koivu and Higgins. Hopefully Carbo doesn’t juggle the lines after one shift.

  89. HabsInBlood says:

    saku11, I’m sure Carbo will wait at least 4 shifts before making any changes. What I mean by that of course is 1 shift each for lines 1,2,3,4 ;-)

  90. ccs says:

    I know lots of people were expecting more from Ryder myself included. What I find more troublesome is that Koivu only has 2 more goals and 8 more assists than Ryder. That just is not good enough from our #1 center. On top of that Koivu has had more ice time on the top line pretty much for all 30 games. We need to get more from captain K.

  91. saku11 says:

    Both Higgins and Koivu would have more points if they had a decent right winger. Streit, Kostopoulos, Dandenault will never be mistaken for goal scorers in the NHL. Hopefully Sergei is the answer.

  92. sidhu says:

    Completely agree – Mr Beliveau said that our veteran leaders are the ones responsible for turning the ship around, not youngsters like Lapierre, O’Byrne, or S.Kostitsyn. Koivu hasn’t done his fair share of bringing us out of this funk – he bears his responsibility regardless of who plays on his right side. He still has a very capable player on his left.

  93. ebk says:

    They are all responsible, not just the players, not just Carbo and not just Gainey. All of them.

  94. AdamG says:

    why is it that every year we have players who struggle so mightily? ryder and koivu this year, kovalev and samsonov last year, zednik and ribeiro the year before. always seems like a few of the guys we count on most end up having career-worst seasons.

  95. krob1000 says:

    Maybe this is the Bizarro world ….you know with Feldman instead of Kramer. Yes that is it…..this is just the bizarro world….I am going back to sleep now.

  96. T-roy West says:

    Obviously a trade is in the works because this will definately not motivate Ryder but will do the opposite. The Canadiens must know this. My ultimate third line Higgins, Chipchura, S. Kostitsyn. Speed, grit, heart!!! At one point these guy’s have to play together!!!

  97. Will Longlade says:

    I like the idea of giving Sergei K. a shot on the 1st line, but benching Ryder is a poor decision, unless the Habs have a trade involving Ryder pending. One of Carbo’s biggest mistakes all season has been his overutilization of Streit. If Carbo was on the ball, he would give Streit a needed rest and play Ryder on the road until he emerges from his funk. This would shield Ryder from the boo birds at the Bell Centre.

    Streit’s play of late clearly demonstrates that he is not an everyday player at this level. As soon as Carbo recognizes this, Streit will make a larger contribution to the team’s success. With Streit, less is more. I guess I’ve mentioned this all before, but it may be worth repeating.

  98. saku11 says:

    Higgins might get tired if he’s double-shifting the whole game

  99. krob1000 says:

    I am hoping there is a trade pending too. It only amkes sense but the way things have gone lately in the Bizarro world…I am still venting like crazy so I can go home happy enough to watch the game.

    TradeRyder where have you been??? Your wish is coming true I beleive.

  100. ccs says:

    Mabey 2 or 3 veteren players get hurt tonight ( very possible ) and we call up a few more rookies for the game against the laffs. Or mabey Guy catches a puck between the eyes is out for 10 days and we go on a massive winning streak……

  101. T-roy West says:

    Saku11 – You do realize I mean Higgins not on the first line anymore. Assume we make a trade and the trade invovles Ryder and Huet and a draft pick and we were able to pick up a scoring forward for the first line (i.e. Hedjuk, Selanne whoever). These would be my lines:

    Latendresse Koivu Trade(Hedjuk)
    A. Kostitsyn Pleks Kovalev
    Higgins Chipchura S. Kostitsyn
    Lapierre Begin Dandenault

    Which line does the other team focus on. The last line can also put the puck in the net!!!!

  102. HAB-PROFESSOR says:

    WHAT THE BLOODY HELL IS GOING ON!

    you don’t sit your best hitting, highest scoring forward
    when your going up against a tough team….and insert into
    the lineup your smallest 165lb defenseman.

    STRIET should move back to D…thereby opening spots for Ryder and Kostyjr.

    and I don’t want to hear that Ryder is unproductive this year, he’s been tossed around like some cheap baggage, thats not how you bring productivity to a 2 year 30 goal scorer…meanwhile they’ve been patient with Higgs who for the longest spell couldn’t buy a goal…and still consistently coughs up the puck with his million stickhandling that only ends up fooling himself.

    I was positive in the other thread that this was our BIG TURNAROUND game.

    now…everythings changed

    ———
    until the problem in my picture is solved…we will not be Champions.

  103. jew4jah says:

    Why not unite the Kostitsyn brothers and move Kovalev to Koivu’s wing.
    or is that the 1st line for saturday’s game…. we wouldn’t want to use the same line combination 2 games in a row. Gotta keep mixing em up.
    How many more losses (and other BS coaching decisions) do we have to endure before carbo gets the axe?
    6 guys whose name starts with KO in the lineup tonight… be nice to add a couple more, ie kovalchuk? kopitar? just pipe dreaming
    to my fellow habs fans… it could always be worse, we could be leafs fans.

  104. Wops says:

    How young is this line-up !! Wow. RDS poll said 90% of fan wanted youth movement. they got it!

    Higgins (24) – Koivu – S. Kostitsyn (20)
    A. Kostitsyn (22) – Plekanec (25) – Kovalev
    Latendresse (20) – Chipchura (21) – Dandenault
    Streit – Lapierre (22) – Kostopoulos

    Defence
    Markov – Komisarek (25)
    Hamrlik – O’Byrne (23)
    Bouillon – Gorges (23)

    Price (20), Halak (22)
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  105. showey47 says:

    PK subban has made team canada as a 7th dman

  106. downeast hab says:

    Would someone give carbo a steroid test, because if there was ever a fellow so screwed up, he might have being a good player, but he is clueless on coaching choices. How can he expect players including Ryder to play good when they cant play. This is like the fox leading the sheep, to their doom. And this is a repeat of last year, the excuse last year was he is learning. He is ruining players because he has no system. Gainey had better get the fox clear of the sheep.

  107. sidhu says:

    Carbo’s lines are perfectly cromulent. He’s coaching style embigguns us all.

  108. showey47 says:

    Any wagers on when gainey steps back behind the bench? Cause this can’t go on much longer. I would like to see it before saturdays game against the laffs

  109. Habs-Fan-In-KY says:

    As much as trading Ryder sounds like a possible reason for his benching, I have to ask WHO WANTS A STRUGGLING WINGER MAKIN 3 MILLION??

    Also consider what do you hope we would get back for him? You lose one of the bigger bodies in our line-up and nobody in Hamilton quite measures up to his size.

    I don’t agree with him being benched for tonight’s game. I guess I’d sit Lapierre or Streit. Nothing personal, just need to see whT the new Kost. has to offer.

    I do support Carbo for moving Ryder off of the first line. That line has not been productive (espescially lately) much of the year and putting him in Begin’s old spot on the 4th line would best suit his skills and allow him to work on his goal scoring jinx.

  110. saku11 says:

    sweet!!! So we have PK Subban on team Canada and Max Pacioretty and Ryan McDonaugh on team USA.

  111. showey47 says:

    i thought ryan didn’t make the us team. We also have yannick weber playing for the swiss but i’m not sure about nicholas torp playing for sweden.

  112. showey47 says:

    This has got too make us one of the youngest teams in the league.

  113. Habs-Fan-In-KY says:

    I would just hope that the lines Carbo picks for tonight stay intact for the remainder of the game. The over-kill of line changing that goes on through the game really hasn’t helped the team. Now, if we’re getting killed by the third period, OK try something new at that point.

    All things considered folks, despite the recent slide, we’re in the playoffs at this point. So, let’s not be so hasty at the “Off with his head” remarks. This time will find it’s stride WITH Carbo at the helm!

  114. saku11 says:

    yeah sorry it was a bad joke. I actually like tonight’s line up, I just don’t agree with how Carbo distributes ice time. Let the first two lines play 20+ min each and then the remainder can be split between the 3rd and 4th line. Guaranteed we would score more goals. Hejduk would be a good pickup though, he’s got a wicked shot.

  115. LTHF says:

    My question to the Habs and Carbo why pick on Ryder all the time when the whole damn team is playing poorly, Higgins isnt tearing up the league with something like 2 goals in last 18 games, and a few others whose production is pathetic. Guess if his name was Latendresse or Laryder, he wouldnt be sitting.

  116. Wops says:

    Yep

    and it can explain why we are having troubles, and why we are line shuffling.
    We have to be patient with the team and with the coach who has 12 out 20 players that are under 25
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  117. saku11 says:

    my bad, McDonagh didn’t make it. They did call Pacioretty a standout though. I hope this kid’s the real deal.

  118. NightRyder says:

    koivu, ryder and dandy for marleau and bernier.

    gainey behind the bench.

  119. NightRyder says:

    angelo esposito cut again from junior team.

    mcdonagh not listed on u.s. roster. pacioretty is.

  120. ebk says:

    I agree with the sentiment that he seems to be the one being single out when most of the team is playing poorly. If I was going to mention names, Higgins and Lats wouldn’t be the ones I was complaining about.

  121. Habs-Fan-In-KY says:

    As much as trading Ryder sounds like a possible reason for his benching, I have to ask WHO WANTS A STRUGGLING WINGER MAKIN 3 MILLION??

    Also consider what do you hope we would get back for him? You lose one of the bigger bodies in our line-up and nobody in Hamilton quite measures up to his size.

    I don’t agree with him being benched for tonight’s game. I guess I’d sit Lapierre or Streit. Nothing personal, just need to see whT the new Kost. has to offer.

    I do support Carbo for moving Ryder off of the first line. That line has not been productive (espescially lately) much of the year and putting him in Begin’s old spot on the 4th line would best suit his skills and allow him to work on his goal scoring jinx.

  122. ebk says:

    be patient and constant line shuffling are kinda contradictory, are they not?

  123. Geoff F says:

    I’m not expecting too much from the Kostitsyn callup but i do wonder if there might be an incremental benefit to hime being called up. A Kost might decide that he doesn’t want to be overshadowed by his younger brother and step it up. S Kost might decide he needs to make a big impact if he wants to stay as this is a good opportunity for him. So potentially the callup of one could have a positive effect on 2 players at the same time. Nothing like a little pride to motivate you.

    Like i said i’m not sure what the outcome will be but maybe the slick skating and puck movement of S Kostitsyn might invigorate Koivu and give the line a punch in the arm.

    We’ll see what happens but i like to think that this might give the offense a little more spark.

    P.S. I would not play the two of them on the same line for that same reason. They might think it’s the Kosty show and we’d never see them in the defensive zone again. they need to play with some defensively responsible players.

    I think this might be an interesting experiment. We’ll see how it goes.

    Good luck tonight boys! GO HABS GO

  124. Wops says:

    touché…
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  125. KerryPrice says:

    Carbo`s back on le pipe.

  126. Steiner says:

    I cant tell you all how disappointed I am that I have my final marketing exam tonight from 7-10.
    I am devastated…..
    Kostitsyn on the first line.
    This *could* be a good thing.
    I look forward to the highlights
    *sigh*

  127. Habs_008 says:

    I wouldnt worry about missing the game, they way they are playing right now, it wont be a good one. Goodluck on your exam.

  128. HAB-PROFESSOR says:

    buy a DVD recorder…you’ll never miss another game.

    ———
    until the problem in my picture is solved…we will not be Champions.

  129. Corio says:

    @Steiner

    That’s why they have “RDS Express” at 11:30PM I think it is. They play the compressed version of the game, it’s awesome!

  130. RiverviewCanadien says:

    Jarvis should take over, since it is practically his entire crew

  131. MatttheHabsFan says:

    Good luck! I wrote my last Dec. exam this morning so I can enjoy tonight’s game:) I hope we’ll see a good effort from the boys…Richards new contract, S. Kost getting his chance…should be a good game

  132. HockeyMan says:

    Put all the players you want in the PB, it won’t change the fact that GUY can’t COACH.

  133. Wops says:

    I know the feeling…goddamn!
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  134. Wops says:

    Who would you put as a coach? Whatever coach we have, we are going to complain.
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  135. HAB-PROFESSOR says:

    WATCH THIS GAINEY AND CARB – FIRE WAGON HAB HOCKEY…
    AND YOUR IN IT…..BRING IT BACK>

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bvKCb76o8hc

    ———
    until the problem in my picture is solved…we will not be Champions.

  136. HabsProf says:

    ????? “Higgins isn’t tearing up the league with something like 2 goals in the last 18 games…” Where did that come from?

    Here are the facts. Higgins last 10 games: 5 goals, 3 assists, +2. 6 of those 8 points were at even strength. He had 28 shots for a shooting percentage of 17.8%. He did this over about 18 1/2 minutes of ice time per game.

    On the contrary, Higgins has been one of the top producing Habs during the recent nosedive. He has been carrying his linemates. If you are to slam anyone on the top line, it has to be (gulp – I hate to say this) Koivu.

    Koivu over that same 10 game stretch has only 3 assists and is -3. One assist was on the power play, the other two even strength. He has 22 shots on net with no goals. Koivu averages about 18 minutes of ice time per game. The third member of the top line has varied, but your message mentioned Latendresse, so let’s look at him. He also has 3 points over the last 10, though they are all goals. He is also only -1. All were even strength, and accomplished with 15 shots for a shooting percentage of 20%. And unlike Koivu, he has accomplished this while averaging only 12 1/2 minutes of ice time. A lot of that time was spent on the third or fourth line. Shockingly, at least in the raw (and limited) calculus of gaols and assists, Latendresse has been a more effective player than Koivu over the last 10 games.

  137. Scotty90 says:

    Steiner… you need to get your priorities straight! You can always re-write your exam… i am sure they would understand. Just kidding! good luck to you and the Habs tonight.

  138. vic says:

    Ryder was shown C anadiens didnt want him when didnt want to him a raise
    and he started arbitration.
    Price is being put into to many pressure situations too fast and he may just burn out.
    This team will not go far as I think they have lost there heart because of the lack of confidence shown them by the coach who puts it all on the players and can not accept his own short commings

  139. saku11 says:

    that’s not true

  140. HockeyMan says:

    Dave King

  141. TommyB says:

    How about the fact that Angelo Esposito (you know, the guy many on here felt we should have drafted instead of McDonaugh) got cut again! That’s three years in a row if I am not mistaken.

    Any Esposito supporters out there? C’mon, you were there in the summer…

  142. Steiner says:

    Thank you!
    I tried to get excused for “religious conflicts”
    Alas, they wouldnt accept! ;)

    CH Express it will be!

  143. Steiner says:

    How could I have forgotten!!!
    This is wonderful news!

  144. Scotty90 says:

    What I do when my son has a game (his games have priority over any Habs game!) I tape it and watch it when I get home (skip through commercials). Trick is not to hear the score on the radio before then!

  145. showey47 says:

    i was so glad that we didn’t draft esposito, he reminds me of a poor mans mike ribiero.

  146. Naila Jinnah says:

    That’s what Canadiens Express is for! :D

  147. Naila Jinnah says:

    Spark?

  148. TommyB says:

    Judging by the number of Ryder supporters in here, I would think there has to be at least one GM who would be as bright as Ryder’s supporters and recognize that it is all Carbonneau’s fault that Michael is not scoring.

    Anyway, [taking tongue out of cheek], seriously, I think there are GMs out there who would take a chance on Ryder, but maybe closer to the deadline. Most players of that type rediscover their scoring touch after a trade. Sometimes a change is what is needed. Change of coach, change of teammates, and a change of style.

  149. leafs67_andcounting says:

    How bout we get a coach with PREVIOUS NHL head coaching experience.

    How bout we hire someone and not worry about what language he speaks.

    Sorry…just thinking outloud.

    But seriously, until we can do what I’ve listed above we’re screwed, because replacing Carbo with someone who doesn’t fit the above won’t be helping us.

  150. Scotty90 says:

    I know CH Express exists on RDS but apparently it lasts 1 hour. I imagine there would be quite a bit of the game lost, i.e., commentators between whistles, periods, etc.., i just zip through commercials but listen to the rest.

  151. Steiner says:

    Thats what I plan on doing!
    Hey Naila, I dont know if you saw my last message to you, but I think we are in the same program at Concordia!
    I think I saw you a week ago or so in the halls of the CJ.

  152. Wops says:

    Who?
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  153. Wops says:

    We were saying Vigneault can’t coach, won the Jack Adams
    we were saying Julien can’t coach, he found two teams that were interested.

    We are saying Carbonneau can’t coach and we’ll say the next one cannot either.

    If its Don Lever, even if he has 11 years as an assistant coach, we’ll say , damn another rookie.

    if we get Bob Hartley, we’ll say damn, he was fired for a reason in Atlanta…
    _______________________________________
    CH is for Chris Higgins

  154. Smart Dog says:

    Flash?
    _________________________________________________
    My favorite player is Grab-ARF!-ski

  155. krob1000 says:

    He was good enough to score thirty twice in a row here…..name me the last Canadien to that (jeopardy music playing while you do a google search). Yeah I guess he is not good enough to play on our top six…lol.

  156. ebk says:

    maybe try re-reading my post and the post above it before you jump down my throat. (jeopardy music playing while waiting for the light to come on)

  157. krob1000 says:

    The letter just lit up and Vanna turned it for me…sorry.

  158. Matt. says:

    Did we just mix Jeopardy and Wheel of Fortune? Interesting… have we tried these lines before?

  159. krob1000 says:

    No Whammies!!No Whammies!!!

  160. Habs Suck says:

    Perezhogin is too small. The “new” NHL was originally thought to bring out the speed and skills of all players and give the “little” guys a better chance. But, I’d say that is now a myth. It isn’t necessarily how it has worked out. Small players are not what Montreal needs. We need scorers with some size.

  161. krob1000 says:

    Of the top 20 scorers in the game right now 9 are 6’0″ or smaller.

  162. HabsInBlood says:

    Not that I’m glad this happened, but he wasn’t too small to end Keith Primeaus’s career.

  163. saku11 says:

    I agree Montreal needs a big power forward (aka Max Pacioretty) and center (Vinny in 09) but if Perezhogin can light the lamp here like he’s doing in Russia right now (13 goals and 14 assists in 29 games, I’d like to see him in a Habs jersey again. Maybe he can convince Emelin to come over as well.

  164. krob1000 says:

    They only count one assist per goal too!!

  165. showey47 says:

    perezogin is listed at 5’11″ 211 lbs, thats one inch shorter but 11 pounds heavier than kostitsyn.

  166. B says:

    What the team needs is scoring period, regardless of size. Crosby, Zetterberg or Alfredsson (3 of the top 5) could all help Montreal and they are all smaller than Perezhogin. I would take any of them in a heartbeat.

  167. mjames says:

    You do not know you facts. FYI

    Perezhogin 6′ 205
    Lecavalier 6’4″ 223
    St louis 5’9″ 185
    Brier 5’1-” 179
    Drury 5’10″ 200
    Ryan Smyth 6’1″ 190
    Ovechkin 6’2″ 220
    Crosby 5’11″ 200

    A better screen name would be “you suck”

    mjames

  168. HabsInBlood says:

    I don’t think Streit gets any less PP time than Ryder – probably more recently. And when Ryder is playing where he should be, on one of the top 2 lines, I’d imagine he gets just as much 5 on 5 time as Dandy. The presumption of course being that Carbo can stick to his lines for the an entire 60 minutes.

  169. Habs_008 says:

    I know he is no LeClair, i was using him as an example, when guys leave the habs, they are better players then they were when they were with us. And Vice Versa…..

  170. ebk says:

    so why is it that they become better players after leaving the Habs?

  171. showey47 says:

    i guess because they usually end up with better linemates like leclair did. If we had never traded John leclair in him prime, he would of done wonders for saku and his career point totals. It also may of prevented some of saku’s injuries.

  172. krob1000 says:

    I said forty theother ten were if Joe decides to bank them off him. I do beleive he could score forty with Thornton and remember Cheechoo scored fifty with him.

    You are right that teams do not adjust their plans for him…until this year. Now it is obvious to the entire world that if he gets the puck he has been publicly told to jsut shoot so he has had more shots blocked in the last month than probably in a normal season.

    He does not ahve poor vision. Higgins has poor vision Ryder actually is an underrated passer and once elsewhere that will reveal itself in time.

    Sadly I agree that Ryders days as a Hab are likely over but I hope they just hurry up and get on with it.

  173. A. Berke says:

    Ryder (I believe) had scored 17 of his 30 goals last year on PP.
    My opinion is that then, we had Souray (and Kovy and Saku as well) on the PP and the opposition was trying to cover them because of especially Shelly’s boomer shot, thus leaving Ryder in the open very often. That’s when he scored his PP goals.

    And when the opposition turned to Ryder or the others, then Shelly was able to shoot and score. That situation no longer exists and that’s why Ryder can not score on 5 on 5 or on PP, because he is too slow i.e., taking an extra second to position himself to shoot and by then the defence and the goalie are ready for his shot.

    If he tries to shoot one timers on the fly, as he has tried a lot lately, he can’t find the ocean or aims at the goalie’s chest.

    If you take out 17 from 30, you’re left with 13 goals. As I said before, Ryder may end up scoring 10-13 goals this year with Habs or another team. But the point then becomes: Does any team want a 10-13 goal scorer who tries hard but can not skate fast, win one on one’s, doesn’t go in front of the goal for scraps and at best an average passer and looses the puck more often than not and who’s paid 3 mil a year?

    He’s a nice kid, who tries hard but IMO, his playing abilities are falling short in MTL where, now, there seems to be more pressure and demand on the players to perform better. He may be successful with some other teams.

    Last but not least, he’s not the only one to blame. Most of the team is not playing to their full potential and that’s the reason for failure. Carbo can show them how to win face-offs, one-on-one’s etc but if the players don’t execute, it’s not his fault.

    A bunch of posters are blaming his “system” or lack of it thereof. That’s total BS and nonsense. It was the same coach during the first 20 games when the team was doing fine. It was the same coach when the team plays fine for 50 minutes and then loses. When the team is winning we are fine and then we turn around and pile on the coach when the team loses.

    Furthermore, fans, media et al., have run so many coaches out of town for similar reasons, and where are they now? They are coaching winning teams and winning themselves coaching honours (Julien, Vignault etc).

    I also admit that Carbo’s criticising Price was not right. It’s OK to call on the veterans but any goalie, including Luongo or Brodeur couldn’t have done any better than Price when the team in front of them plays lousy like that.

    Let’s look into the mirror collectively first, if we want to know who’s to blame.

    This is my 2 minute rant.

    Ali B.

  174. showey47 says:

    | really don’t agree on sitting ryder though, its hard to raise someones trade value from the pressbox. What they should do is give him alot of minutes on the powerplay since 35 of his last 60 goals have come on the powerplay.

  175. Smart Dog says:

    It should be an exciting game anyway. A lot of hungry young players. I hope the flyers don’t bash their heads in.

    And on the bright side:

    1. No slowinski
    2. No breeze-by
    3. One of our goalies is old enough to vote! Of course he can’t vote cause he’s not from here.. but he could if he was!

    Woof! Woof!

    _________________________________________________
    My favorite player is Grab-ARF!-ski

  176. 24 Cups says:

    O’Byrne made a bad play – do they not think that guys like Robinson didn’t do the same thing when they first came up? (sitting O’Byrne down was apparently Jarvis’ call not Carbo’s). One thing I know for sure is that we will need the scrapiness of guys like O’Byrne, Lapierre, and Tommy K. tonight against the Flyers. If they start gooning our smaller players then Briere should be made to pay the price. It’s not my style but it’s the only alternative when you’re playing the Flyers this year. If I could make one request tonight it would be for Kovalev to get an over abundance of ice time. He’s our best forward and he’s making $4.5 mil. You’ve got to play your ace card.

    The Original 24 Cups

  177. saku11 says:

    Seriously, Kovalev should get 22-24 minutes per game.


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