Predators put Red Wings on brink

Sergei Kostitsyn

Nashville’s Sergei Kostitsyn battles Detroit’s Ian White along the back boards during Tuesday’s game at Joe Louis Arena.
Dave Reginek, NHLI via Getty Images

In Detroit: The visiting Nashville Predators put the Red Wings one game from first-round elimination Tuesday night with a 3-1 victory at the Joe Louis Arena. With the series returning to Nashville for Game 5 on Friday, has the last octopus been flung?

In Sunrise, Fla.: Both starting goaltenders were yanked – Martin Brodeur for New Jersey, José Theodore for Florida – as the Panthers roared back from a 3-0 deficit to defeat the Devils 4-3 and take a 2-1 series lead.

In Chicago, Coyotes’ repeat offender Raffi Torres was up to his old tricks, sending Chicago’s Marian Hossa to hospital with a high, late hit. Hossa was later released from hospital, to be kept under observation at home, and the Coyotes beat the Blackhawks 4-3 in overtime to pull ahead 2-1 in that series.

Daily suspension roundup (seven now dispensed in a week): Pittsburgh’s Arron Asham is turfed for four games, teammate James Neal is bounced for one, Chicago’s Andrew Shaw is gone for one and Washington’s Nicklas Backstrom is gone for one.

Tonight: Both the Pittsburgh Penguins and Vancouver Canucks face being swept out of the postseason.

301 Comments

  1. frontenac1 says:

    Weaned on Habs vs Broad Street Bullies and Battle of Quebec. Man I Loved those wars! Pens vs Flyers best series so far this year.Get rid of instigator rule.Bring it on baby!

  2. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …I went a few months absent-mindedly without Ad-Block installed on My browser (thought it was installed) …and grousing about all the excessive adds I had to endure on HIO and other sites
    …then the ‘bulb’ pops on in the big ol’ lump on My shoulders, and realize I just maybe have forgotten to reinstall :(
    …these last few dayz have been lightning fast with no obnoxious ads fighting for eyeball recognition on my infrequent, but valuable time online
    …bliss !!!
    …I know this is not Hockey Related …so I will use the inimitable vernacular of Habs Fans’ fav Hockey Guru, Don ‘Grapes’ Cherry, to make it a little more ‘hockey friendly’ …Ad-Block is …A Beauty !!! :)

    _________________________________________________________
    HIS’ Official Habs’ Fan Theme Song; Morrissey ‘There is a light that never goes out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjObvIQtsLk&feature=related
    _________________________________________________________
    What I WANT ! is an aircraft carrier at centre and nuclear destroyers on each wing going to the net like bats out of Hell !, …NO MORE rubber duckies !!!
    _________________________________________________________
    Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
    http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

  3. Mattyleg says:

    Holy Cow, Dick Clark just died.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • Habitant in Surrey says:

      …omg, first Annette Funicello :( …now Dick :(
      …last links to my lost teen years
      …guess I’m next :(
      …no time to wait for Mackinnin …have to win the Cup NOW !!! …before it’s too late :)

      _________________________________________________________
      HIS’ Official Habs’ Fan Theme Song; Morrissey ‘There is a light that never goes out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjObvIQtsLk&feature=related
      _________________________________________________________
      What I WANT ! is an aircraft carrier at centre and nuclear destroyers on each wing going to the net like bats out of Hell !, …NO MORE rubber duckies !!!
      _________________________________________________________
      Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
      http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

      • habstrinifan says:

        I aint goin until I know who the new GM is and who the new coach is? The memories of Gauthier and JM have to be completely erased as I approach the Pearly Gates… cause I still cuss out loud for no reason but to vent against what they did to my team.

  4. Mr_MacDougall says:

    It is simple, the reason for high hits is because ALL players put their hands up when receiving a hit, the hitter then tries to get above the “hitees” hands and goes high on them. I went to a checking clinic (15-20 years ago now) and was taught the proper way to hit, with the shoulder, and was constantly getting a face full of elbow or hands.. so I started putting my hands up and hitting higher.

  5. frontenac1 says:

    Get rid of the “instigator” rule!

  6. CHicoHab says:

    How about this for “Head shots”?? The referee consults video review to see if accidental or not. If it’s a head shot then an automatic penalty shot is awarded. Plus a 5 minute major regardless if penalty shot is scored or not. Automatic ejection from the game. Then the league reviews if more suspension needed. That might take head shots out of the game………………….

    “take your time and hurry up”

    • habsnyc says:

      It is tough for the refereee to have to make that decision. If a team is behind by two goals in the third period, the penalty means little to them.

      I think the attitude towards injuring players has not changed over 50 years. The change is the ease with which players can injure eachother.

      Blue, blanc et rouge. Red and White for Canada. Blue for Smurfs.

    • krob1000 says:

      I would be for video challenges on ALL goals…..the offsides have been brutal and momentum changing goals this year….those are 100 percent preventable mistakes. There is too much that goes into intent/position,etc re head shots for that to happen but video review has to be expanded…at least to include offside calls….they are so easy to view from above.

    • Desi says:

      Great idea, Chico. To bad this league and its owners would never approve it. I’d vote for that in a heartbeat if it weren’t for one thing: referees. I don’t trust them to make the right call in these kinds of situations — or any other for that matter. But still, even with that, it would help clean up the head shots.

  7. Dr.Rex says:

    Any word yet if Josh Gorges or David Desharnais have been extended invitations to play at teh World Hockey Championships?

    I heard Luke Schenn of all people has been invited so if Gorges has not then its a disgrace to Hockey Canada. Its sees Kevin Lowe is inviting those who either play for the oilers or that will possibly be drafted or traded to the oilers this summer. What a mess that is just like the Oilers franchise. Imagine Ryan Murray and Luke Schenn paired together……..Ouch. Malkin and Datsyuk will destroy Canada.

    • Cal says:

      No and no for Gorges and DD. Gorges was not invited and neither was DD.

      This will be a very good learning experience for Subban going up against the likes of Malkin and Datsyuk in a tourney.

    • habsnyc says:

      This is a very important tournament for Team Canada to improve in the world rankings. I think they will take the superstars who bow out in the first round of the playoffs. If Crosby, Neal, Letang are available, they will be invited ahead of Gorges, Desharnais.

      Blue, blanc et rouge. Red and White for Canada. Blue for Smurfs.

  8. Les Canayens says:

    For those who visit reddit.com, Steve Duchesne will be the IAMA (I am a ____ ask me anything, like a live Q&A) tomorrow, April 19 at 1pm.

    We can ask him about the current state of the playoff, and his opinion on Habs’ search for GM/coach.

  9. habsnyc says:

    Given the number of skill players suspended or fined by the league including Ovechkin, Lucic, Neal, Pax, Backstrom, Staal, Doan, Skinner, Tavares and Weber, the issue is not at all about goons or fighting. The issue is the ease with which players can debilitate eachother.

    Fighting seems to be at a manageable level. The fans perceive injuring to be growing at an alarming rate.

    Blue, blanc et rouge. Red and White for Canada. Blue for Smurfs.

    • Mattyleg says:

      You’re right, the fighting isn’t the issue.
      Although I’d like to see staged fights eradicated from the game forever.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

  10. nellis13 says:

    The best part of the Peverly/Backstorm incedent is Ovi putting his stick up Peverly’s ass before Peverly trips him. Go back and look at it. The bend on Ovi’s stick is impressive.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCXZLEOx5uY
    It’s somewhere between 23 and 24 sec

    • Les Canayens says:

      For those who visit reddit.com, Steve Duchesne will be the IAMA (I am a ____ ask me anything, like a live Q&A) tomorrow, April 19 at 1pm.

      We can ask him about the current state of the playoff, and his opinion on Habs’ search for GM/coach.

      Edit: I don’t know why my comment shows up here. I’ll repost as a new thread.

  11. ZepFan2 says:

    Oh boy…
    “This is like people complaining about the rain at Woodstock,” Burke told USA Today. “Yes, there was lots of mud, but it was the greatest music gathering in history.”

    Is this Burke’s way of making up with Cherry?

    ———————————————————————-
    “I got a feeling, a feeling deep inside” – Lennon/McCartney

    I’ve got a feeling

  12. twilighthours says:

    I am not advocating for more (or less) violence, nor making any grand statements on the state of the game today, but I have to wonder if current NHL players – were they to read these message boards – would laugh at us for trying to find creative ways to improve a game we actually know, in relation to those who have played in the NHL, very little about.

    • DorvalTony says:

      Nonsense.

      Chara got off. We should shut up and forget because we never played in the NHL? Torres’s hit was atrocious. “Don’t say anything, you never played in the NHL.” LOL

      tony-mclean.blogspot.com

    • Phil C says:

      I think your comment is a bit of a cop-out, twilight. The NHL does not own the game of hockey, it belongs to everyone. Anyone who has played contact hockey can make intelligent insights on how it should be played, it’s not rocket science. Anyone that can read can figure out that the NHL does not enforce the interference and charging rules as they are written. Any relatively well-blanced normal human being can watch Hossa being carried to the hospital on a stretcher and deduce that whatever happened to him should not be acceptable within the rules of a sport without having ever watched hockey.

      The NHL sets the example for the sport in many ways. As a hockey player and a parent of hockey players, that makes me a stake-holder in how the NHL conducts business. It will take more than ridicule to stop stake-holders from expressing their concerns.

      Comments on this board mean nothing by themselves, but I truly believe that public and media out-cry played a role in establishing rule 48, which was a HUGE change for the NHL and has made the game safer, IMO. I saw an interview with Blunden where he was sayig that he now tries to target the chest when hitting. Eventually the league will consist of players who are used to rule 48 and hits like Torres on Hossa will become less frequent.

  13. Mattyleg says:

    This is the dominant view of hockey.

    Only usually less funny.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  14. H.Upmann says:

    Not to mention that running the goalie is acceptable now and deemed a “hockey play”, thanks to Looch running Miller

    • twilighthours says:

      Disagree. The Lucic hit actually swung the pendulum. There have been at least 2 high-profile suspensions for running the goalie since Shanny dropped the ball on Lucic. Plus, referees were told to crack down on goaler interference after that. So the message was the exact opposite.

    • RGM says:

      No no no no no. After Lucic did it, it was deemed unacceptable. Hence 3 games for Andrew Shaw. But back then it was fine to completely derail an 11-5 team by knocking out their All-World goalie. Not anymore, slugger!

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

      • Mattyleg says:

        Honestly, we should really be thanking the Bruins for making the game safer.
        After making it much, much more dangerous.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

  15. H.Upmann says:

    Have to say that watching the three other PHI PIT games, I had the impression I was watching UFC inspired hockey what with guys punching guys when down, and all of those flying elbows to the head! By far the most violent playoffs I’ve seen in a while

  16. TomNickle says:

    I see only three ways that the issue of player safety begins to be corrected.

    1. A large group of former and current players file lawsuit against the NHL much like the NFL players did.

    2. A coach, GM or owner has the stones to keep his team from taking the ice during a scheduled road game in a big market.

    3. The league hires an independent body to oversee supplemental discipline.

    • ABHabsfan says:

      If the players really want to eliminate head-shots then then discipline should be doled out by the NHLPA. It is clear that the league cannot do it, conflicting interests. The livelihood and long-term quality of life is at stake not because of the league but because of their fellow members. A small group of recently retired players who are paid by the players should decidwhat suspensions should be. If these guys want to do something about it , they (the players) have to solve it.

      “man, I love winnin'; you know, it’s like better than losin’?”-
      Ebby Calvin “Nuke” Laloosh

      • Ali says:

        Except Shanny IS a former player. The article i linked above points out (although unproven) that he started off very well and strong, but the league itself (along with agents, gms, players, owners, etc) reigned him in. Like Eliotte Friedman always says, teams are always asking for justice until its their own player getting suspended.

        • ABHabsfan says:

          Shanny can be on the committee, no problem. I just think the committee should be paid by and accountable to the Players. Player safety is a player issue (clearly), if they want it to change they have to be able to accept their own punishments. If guys start losing $100Ks or even $1M in salary, this crap will stop.

          “man, I love winnin'; you know, it’s like better than losin’?”-
          Ebby Calvin “Nuke” Laloosh

          • Ali says:

            PA has to stop acting more on behalf of offending player as well. That’s a big part of it. There’s an inherent bias, since there is no representation on behalf of the injured party, only the PA defending the offending player.

          • issie74 says:

            There may be some merit to that,but I would say you have to be a player recovering from a concussion to have a say in the matter.

            NorthTOHab

          • Ali says:

            why not a player suffering from a broken neck?

          • issie74 says:

            The player suffering with a broken neck also suffered a concussion. My point is when you can relate to the problem you should have more understanding of the problem.

            NorthTOHab

      • DorvalTony says:

        NHLPA soft-pedaled the Chara attack(s) on Pacioretty saying it/they were just a “hockey play.” NHLPA is part of the problem.

        tony-mclean.blogspot.com

  17. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …well it SUCKS My Habs ain’t in the hunt this Spring :( …hate lookin’ at other teams havin’ all the fun
    …so what’s the tag for next season ? …’No Winnin’ for MacKinnin’ ???

    _________________________________________________________
    HIS’ Official Habs’ Fan Theme Song; Morrissey ‘There is a light that never goes out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjObvIQtsLk&feature=related
    _________________________________________________________
    What I WANT ! is an aircraft carrier at centre and nuclear destroyers on each wing going to the net like bats out of Hell !, …NO MORE rubber duckies !!!
    _________________________________________________________
    Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
    http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

    • 24moreCups says:

      ‘Give in for MacKinnin’

      • mark_ID says:

        We will trade our next 29 years worth of first round draft picks to every team, for their first round picks next year.

        MacMinnin will be ours ;P

        Toronto will get our first from 29 years from now of course…….

        “Step off George”

      • Stormin says:

        Losin is like winnin for MacKinnon

        Although i prefer to make A run in the playoffs, ,,, over any unsuccessful year for a high draft pick

        2013 draft year is stacked with Talent

        Nathan MacKinnon wll still be heads up above even in an amazing draft year with stud prospects like
        Seth Jones
        Aaron Ekblad
        Sean Monahan
        Jonathon Drouin
        Anthony Duclair, ,,,,,, just to name a few

        Habs need to try and get some extra 1st dradt picks to go along with their 3 second round picks for 2013

        ______________________________________________
        “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
        Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

    • Chuck says:

      Doesn’t matter, since the Oilers will find a way to pick first AGAIN.

      ___________________________________________________
      Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

      • naweed235 says:

        I really think they will make the playoffs next season but if somehow they end up in a lotto position again they instantly become a force to reckon with for the next 5 yrs or so… they got some scary skilled players

    • Ozmodiar says:

      Sounds good to me!

  18. Rob says:

    Forget the fans for a minute. I think one of the biggest indications that the league has gotten it’s handle on the game wrong is who’s supporting it. Who are the hockey people who support the way the game is being played right now? Don Cherry. Brian Burke, Mike Millbury. Nick Kypreos. PJ Stock. What do these people all have in common? They either weren’t very good NHL hockey players, or never made it. When the people who are considered great PLAYERS in hockey start telling me that this is hockey as it’s supposed to be played, I will concede to being wrong about the problems with the league. But until Wayne Gretzky, Mario Lemieux, Bobby Orr, et al do so?…….

    I’m sorry, and i’m not trying to be insulting (okay, maybe I am), but if the basis of my argument for the fact that my opinion is “correct” was that people like Mike Millbury and Don Cherry agree with me?…… well I probably would not want to make that public information.

    The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

    • TomNickle says:

      Exactly right. I read that Mario Lemieux is enraged and ashamed of the way his team has been going about their business.

      I think it’s quite possible that the biggest perpetrator here is Mathieu Schneider. How can he not point to the injuries suffered, show these players medical data and not get their attention?

      It’s his responsibility to show the players that they need to treat each other like human beings, he’s failed.

      I don’t ever remember it being this bad. The old time hockey comparisons are garbage. There was always respect and care for the most part.

      • Mattyleg says:

        The same infractions are pointed out over and over again as examples of how ‘this kind of thing has been around for ages.’
        The only reason that people remember those things is because they were so out of character with the way in which the game was played for 99% of the time.

        I can’t remember all of last week’s suspensions and brutal plays, much less last season’s! The one I remember the most is the one that didn’t result in any kind of punishment whatsoever. Patches.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

        • TomNickle says:

          Yes exactly. A collection of a dozen or so incidents in 65 years of televised hockey has lead to the label of old time hockey and a dozen incidents each week in the last five years being justified because of it.

          • Habitant in Surrey says:

            …Tom, I believe the INTENT to seriously injure was not that much different back in da good ol’ dayz …the ‘difference’ is the capability is a lot greater today to do serious damage, because of said greater acceleration and mass flyin’ about the ice these days
            …there were as many ‘crazies’ back in My days as there are today, but had not the relative speed and mass to make as serious damage

            _________________________________________________________
            HIS’ Official Habs’ Fan Theme Song; Morrissey ‘There is a light that never goes out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjObvIQtsLk&feature=related
            _________________________________________________________
            What I WANT ! is an aircraft carrier at centre and nuclear destroyers on each wing going to the net like bats out of Hell !, …NO MORE rubber duckies !!!
            _________________________________________________________
            Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
            http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

    • punkster says:

      Good one Rob.

      ***Subbang Baby!!!***

    • Ozmodiar says:

      >What do these people all have in common?

      I’ll tell ya what else this group has in common. They have a place in the pulpit where they’re able to preach their opinion on how the game should be played.

    • Les Canayens says:

      This is due to the Dunning–Kruger effect, which “is a cognitive bias in which unskilled individuals suffer from illusory superiority, mistakenly rating their ability much higher than average.”

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

      And the effect is opposite on skilled individuals.

      So all the former goons over-confidently think they’re so right, while all the former great players think their own opinions does not matter that much.

      • Rob says:

        Thank you for that! I have been looking for some research based backing exactly like this.

        The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

  19. The Jackal says:

    Of course Grapes loves this kind of hockey, he’s stuck in time. Its the NHLs fault players are taking these liberties with each other. If they were actually consistent on their policies this would be less of a problem but they are eunuchs and thus have no balls to suspend or punish players on an equal basis – specially in the playoffs.

  20. Ian Cobb says:

    Nice comments Robert!
    Quality Leadership is missing in our sport today my friend. IAN

    Robert Ng Thow Hing
    Don Cherry speaks to the vocal minority. As I mentioned on HIO today, the top sports leagues have all taken massive steps to protect their stars and to ensure that the skill elements of their game are not compromised. Violence will always sell. MMA is hugely popular. NASCAR is hugely popular. But if you want to be REALLY BIG…..like NFL big and NBA big, then you need to stop catering to the vocal minority and put a respectable product on the ice. There can be violent elements. But it can’t come at the expense of star players or the beautiful skill that makes hockey such an amazing sport.
    Robert Ng Thow Hing

  21. habs-fan-84 says:

    Cherry is right. Playoffs have been great. I love the intensity, and seemingly so does everyone else…except Habs fans.

    • TomNickle says:

      So intensity is akin to sucker punches, head’s being targeted more than ever and displeasure with slaps of the wrist?

      That’s what people have been taking issue with. Nobody complained about Kronwall’s hit on Sergei Kostitsyn last night. Know why? It was clean. No malice, didn’t target the head, didn’t skate through two zones to get to him, didn’t run him from behind. Shoulder to chest(Kronwall is MUCH bigger than Kostitsyn by the way).

      Most people appreciated the hit, they don’t appreciate Raffi Torres trying to remove every Blackhawk he sees from consciousness.

    • Mattyleg says:

      Once again, proving our moral and intellectual superiority over all other fans, and small-minded posters.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • Ian Cobb says:

      Except for hockey fans that know how the game should be played!!!
      Just talk for yourself–84

  22. Donnie Murdo says:

    To me, the above suspensions once again cry out for the removal fo the instigator rule.

    I have been a big fan of the Flyers/Pens series. There has been high skill, high intensity and lots of scoring. There’s been some foul play and some good play and, with the exception of Asham’s cross check on Schenn some close-to-the-edge play.

    This is still a physical game played by young men who’s testosterone levels are sky high and no-one likes to lose.

    How many times have Habs fans cheered in recent years as Begin, Pleks, Gionta and even Max have driven Boston crazy by making them look foolish and then cried foul when they lose their minds and do something stupid.

    Newsflash: That’s exactly what we hoped they would do. Not to injure – but to do something daft and unfocused.

    I’m not condoning the actions of Torres (repeat, repeat offender) or Asham or the single incident guys – but there is always a context.

    Eliminate the instigator rule and let them account for their actions on the ice, let supplementary discipline take it’s course for the action (not the events) and let ex-referees manage the job of discipline. Get Kerry Fraser to look at it objectively, where he has no old-boy ties…

    • Habitant in Surrey says:

      …agree on Fraser for the job …I suggested that here when Shanahan was hired …Shanahan was and still is one of the good ol’ boyz …with way too many conflict of interest potentials

      _________________________________________________________
      HIS’ Official Habs’ Fan Theme Song; Morrissey ‘There is a light that never goes out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gjObvIQtsLk&feature=related
      _________________________________________________________
      What I WANT ! is an aircraft carrier at centre and nuclear destroyers on each wing going to the net like bats out of Hell !, …NO MORE rubber duckies !!!
      _________________________________________________________
      Habitant means PASSIONATE HOCKEY
      http://www.nationalpost.com/news/story.html?id=423049

      • Ozmodiar says:

        Shanahan’s a puppet and the league is pulling the strings. If he’s replaced, he’ll be replaced by another puppet.

        Ratings are at an all time high, and the NHL isn’t going to let some independent, objective bloke like Fraser come in and mess with their product.

        • Donnie Murdo says:

          I’m not suggesting that we remove fighting – half the fun of watching this game is in sharing with the one-ice tension knowing that it will get close to the line. And I challenge anyone who thinks otherwise.

          What needs to happen is a mechanism to identify the line between what is fair and what goes too far and to eliminate THAT, instantly and supplementarily.

          It’s also very empowering for the refs on the ice and allows them to make a very clear and distict call in most situations. No grey.

          • Ozmodiar says:

            I agree. I just think that whatever mechanism is brought in will be tightly controlled by the league. Independence ain’t happenin’.

  23. Dr.Rex says:

    Wednesday’s random thoughts:
    – How bout a GM team that consists of both Brisebois and Bergevin. Both have their very strong areas that would combine nicely.
    – ANyone really surprised PM is not a legitimate candidate? HE is a too risky for the habs. HE could be a hidden gem but more likely a disaster. A franchise as important as MOntreal cannot put themselves in that kind of risk.
    – Milan Lucic will have a movie career ahead of him playing a villian. HE would definetely play a good mutated swamp monster.
    – Brad Marchand is driving down the some raod as Sean Avery. ONly difference is nobody wants his sloppy secs.
    – ANyone ever wonder what a 25 year old who is just realizing he cant have everything go his way forever looks like. Crosby
    – BEtcha Gomer has caught more fish already then goals from teh last couple seasons.
    – WOuld now be a good time to ask Goats about the Bourque trade? OR should we wait a couple more weeks.
    – SOmeone should tell Brain Burke he cant make chicken salad outta bologna.

  24. Chuck says:

    Serious question: what jurisdiction does law enforcement have over an NHL game?

    I can’t punch someone in the face on the street without the threat of the being arrested. I couldn’t do the same thing in the stands, either. So if fighting should go the way of the dodo, couldn’t some forward-thinking jurisdiction simply say that the laws of the land will be enforced on the ice as they would be on the street out front of the arena?

    ___________________________________________________
    Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

    • RGM says:

      Typical Habs fan, always wanting to get the police involved. I kid, I kid. LOL

      Only in the event of something truly horrific (Bertuzzi, McSorley, rioting in the stands, etc.) should the cops get involved in professional sports. Yes, the NHL has been truly derelict in “policing itself” but the idea of throwing a professional athlete in jail on assault charges…seems a bridge too far at this point.

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

      • Mattyleg says:

        Also, sports like Boxing and MMA and others (fencing?) would have to fall under the same umbrella.
        I don’t think getting outsiders involved is the right way. Other sports don’t need to.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • Ian Cobb says:

      Chuck! Law enforcement and governments just need to grow a few balls is all!!!

    • Dr.Rex says:

      IF Lucic was a regular dude with a regular job with regular pay I cant see any chick ever touching him.

    • TomNickle says:

      Voluntary Assumption of Risk is the threshold by which law enforcement is forced to act in the professional sports arena in Canada. If an action is considered to be well outside of the ordinary in hockey and egregious enough that it caused serious harm and the victim ought not to have expected such an action, there would be cause for legal proceedings.

      McSorley is probably the best example. Alexander Perezhogin would be in the conversation. Bertuzzi’s probably shouldn’t have been.

    • HardHabits says:

      No. As much as I deplore the direction the NHL is heading it has to be dealt with internally. Unfortunately that wont happen under Bettman.

      The only way this would be addressed if the fans turned away in droves, which by all accounts seems to be the opposite of what is happening.

      In that case and in the mean time it is up to the press to report the inconsistencies with officiating and the meting out of penalties and punishment for borderline and explicitly dangerous on ice behaviour since the league’s little dictator is enforcing a gag order against dissension within ranks.

  25. Habitant in Surrey says:

    …I love physical but skilled hockey …fights if it is part of the release and safety valve of the physicality, is part of the adrenalin rush I call North American, or NHL hockey …and I love it …if there are 2 equal and willing competitors

    …what I hate is intent to injure hockey

    …We have discussed it many times, there is a speed and SIZE in Our Game that has never been as overwhelming …and I have been playing and watching hockey for 60+ years

    …the will and competitiveness to win is no different today than when I was young …the number of idiots and psychopaths playing the game is no less, maybe even less than when I played while young …but the meaningful difference between ‘then and now’ is relative size and speed

    …’things’ We did way back when would leave broken or lost teeth, a broken bone, varied aches and pain, rivulets of blood …but the same actions today are a Damocles Sword of impending death, if not controlled more responsibly by the NHL and other levels of hockey

    …consistent appropriate suspensions and punishment must be allocated to all players whether they are the cement heads on the ice or the super stars

    …the Fear Of God has to be put upon those trying to impose the Fear Of God on the ice …that is Shanahan’s responsibility …either he has been completely pathetic in his skills as a decision maker or his hands are being tied by his employer, the NHL

    The recent spike in superfluous violence and intent to injure in the first round is the chickens coming’ home to roost for Shanahan’s complete fail as the NHL’s executive responsible for player safety this past season

    …the belated heftier suspensions will likely diminish the headhunting in the subsequent games …but I hope Shanahan (NHL) have learned the lesson this is a life or death situation …because someday soon, there certainly will be a death on the ice

    …I call these playoffs, so far, the Sick Playoffs

    …the level of intent to injure is spoiling what otherwise is great exciting hockey

    • Chuck says:

      “…I love physical but skilled hockey …fights if it is part of the release and safety valve of the physicality, is part of the adrenalin rush I call North American, or NHL hockey …and I love it …if there are 2 equal and willing competitors

      …what I hate is intent to injure hockey”

      By its very nature, a fight is an intent to injure. You can’t have it both ways.

      ___________________________________________________
      Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

  26. sane hockey fan says:

    How about this as a serious suggestion:

    NHL adopts IIHF women’s hockey rules. No hitting. No fighting. Problem solved.

  27. Mattyleg says:

    How about this as a serious suggestion:

    If a player injures an opponent on a play that mertits a penalty, that player is suspended until the injured player returns, or, in the case of long-term injury a maximum of 20 games.

    Plus, the team is not allowed to replace that player (they lose a roster space).

    Do you think this would actually work?

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • ZepFan2 says:

      I like it. It would make players hopefully think twice about head hunting.

      ———————————————————————-
      “I got a feeling, a feeling deep inside” – Lennon/McCartney

      I’ve got a feeling

    • FanCritic says:

      Matty – Perfect suggestion

    • mark_ID says:

      Problem with that suggestion is that it could be abused by the teams. For example……..Sidney Crosby goes and hits a fourth liner during a playoff series……fourth liner could easily fake a injury so that Crosby misses the rest of the series.
      I just get the feeling this rule would be abused.

      “Step off George”

      • Mattyleg says:

        Hmm, I don’t think that ‘faking’ injuries would be worth it, or commonly applied.
        If that would be a worry (which I doubt), the NHL has a doctor to assess injuries.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

        • mark_ID says:

          Except you can’t really assess a concussion to say that someone conclusively has one or not….it goes on the basis of how the person feels, ya know….

          So if Crosby gets his arms up, the 4th line rookie leaves the game not feeling “right”, do you honestly not think the team might tell him to sit out for a bit……knowing that Crosby wouldn’t play the rest of the series, but their excuse would be that they are just being cautious for the players health. All the injured player has to say is he is getting headaches….or doesn’t feel like himself.

          Sure it has a complete lack of sportsmanship…..but hell look at this league today.

          “Step off George”

          • Mattyleg says:

            I suppose, but the problem in hockey today is not feigning injury, it’s actually being injured.

            The step I propose might take some of the current dangerous mentality out of the minds of the players, then if it seems to be subject to abuse, make an alteration then.

            I don’t think the worry that people will take advantage of the rule is a reason to not apply it. We could say that about any law.

            —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • habs-hampton says:

      Why suspend Torres? Suspend Ray Whitney or Mike Smith. That’s how you send a message that’ll be heard!

      • Mattyleg says:

        I think that’s too arbitrary.

        The offending player should be answerable for his actions, not someone else.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

        • habs-hampton says:

          He would be. He would have to answer to his own team. who wouldn’t put up with it too long.

          • Mattyleg says:

            In that case, the league is co-opting punishment to a second party.
            Dangerous precedent.
            The team whose superstar is out would do the exact same thing back to the other team through diving or feigned injury to level the field.

            —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • RGM says:

      The “eye for an eye” (in terms of man-games lost) approach is one that has been bandied about for some time now, by a lot of well-reasoned folks. To me, it seems going a bit too far and as others have stated, it would be open to abuse. Instead of incompetent team doctors rushing concussed people back onto the ice without the 15 minutes in the quiet room, you’d have a ward room filled with pluggers that got a love bump from a superstar and the doctors would be screaming that he’s unfit to play. You would like to think that the “gamesmanship” wouldn’t go that far, but if they go to the opposite extreme….
      Sure they could have independent physicians and stuff come in to overrule the team doctors, but then you’d have NHL personnel jobs on the line due to ongoing incompetence finally being challenged.

      I think that going in this direction also focuses too heavily on the outcome, and minimizes the intent factor. Not all blows to the head are equal. How many “incidental contact” plays (here’s looking at you, Steckel on Crosby) leave a player injured for weeks or months, but no penalty is called? We’ve seen how grossly incompetent NHL referees are…as recently as last night. If the play doesn’t have a penalty called, does the “eye for an eye” rule apply? Under what circumstances are players exempted (and you know they will do all they can to negotiate a grey area) from the rule? You selected the 20 game maximum; what if the guy’s career is actually ended? There’s just so many variables. I think that there should be a standard, but as to what those numbers should be, I just don’t know.

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

      • Mattyleg says:

        I suggested only plays in which a penalty is called, but I know that it’s not a perfect art.

        As I say above, we can’t prevent ourselves from instigating a rule for fear that people might take advantage of it. If there are instances of questions being raised about the honesty of teams, that can be dealt with then.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

  28. sane hockey fan says:

    Can’t believe I get to watch some of the most intense physical and competitive playoff hockey in years and the Canadiens aren’t even in it. Sucks.

  29. Newf_Habster says:

    Hard plastic in shoulder and elbow pads are the main culprit that many players in NHL get concussed.

    OHL barred their players to wear shoulder and elbow pads with hard plastic last fall. The number of concussions in the league have been noticeably reduced.

  30. RGM says:

    The NHL reminds me an awful lot of Jack Sparrow…sorry, Captain Jack Sparrow.

    Elizabeth Swann: There will come a time when you have a chance to do the right thing.
    Jack Sparrow: I love those moments. I like to wave at them as they pass by.

    How many such moments have Colin Campbell and Brendan Shanahan simply waved at as they passed by? Richards-on-Booth, Cooke-on-Savard, Chara-on-Pacioretty, Thornton-on-Perron, Steckle-on-Crosby….that’s five which immediately spring to mind. How many more will there be?

    ———————–
    GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
    “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

    Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • RiverviewCanadien says:

      Lucic on Miller. That one really had me confused.

      • RGM says:

        That one baffled everybody and I think it was really the tipping point when a lot of people turned against Shanahan as being no better than his predecessor. Yeah a lot of folks raised eyebrows over Malone-on-Campoli and a couple others…but this was blatant and it involved a Bruins player. When Lucic got away with it, and the League vowed to get tough “next time” it destroyed a lot of his credibility.

        It would have been a very different story had that play not occurred because of a disciplinary policy with teeth that applied equally to all 30 teams. The Sabres were 11-5 when Miller got drilled. He missed 9 games during which the team went 3-5-1 and it took him a while to get his game back. Who knows where they would have ended their season with a healthy Miller all the way through?

        ———————–
        GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
        “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

        Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • jedimyrmidon says:

      I would add Lucic-on-Miller, Malone-on-Campoli, Keith-on-Sedin (didn’t get suspended nearly long enough for a clear retaliatory, late hit to the head; it met every criteria AND the intent was clear) and Boychuk-on-Raymond.

      I also thought Weber would get at least one game. That probably would have sent a message (although I believe Weber knows that he got away with one and has restrained himself accordingly – which is exactly how players should respond, but many don’t).

      I would also add that when the NHL decided to send an unprecedentedly strong “message” by suspending Rome the remainder of the Stanley Cup Finals, well, it was a bit suspect. Yes, the hit was a bit late, but Horton was moving on open ice admiring the puck. The goal was probably to deplete the Canucks’ defense even further, having already lost Hamhuis at that point.

      Steckel-on-Crosby wasn’t as obvious since it appeared to be a glancing blow (but I’m sure Steckel knew what he was doing).

  31. jedimyrmidon says:

    Before the Bruins “won” the Cup last year, it was as if there existed an accepted code of conduct during the playoffs among most NHL players that compensated for Campbell’s failings as head disciplinarian: don’t run the goaltenders, don’t get into such violent after-the-whistle scrums, play hard, but not dirty (for the most part).

    Of course, there were players like Torres who would violate this code (another word for respect, I suppose), but in general most players abided by it. That seems to have changed between this year and last year after the Bruins inched their way to the Cup one sucker punch, one after-the-whistle cheap shot and one unsuspended act at a time (Ference giving the finger, hit from behind on Halpern, Horton spraying water into the stands, etc.). Now we see many players who would normally not get so involved lose their minds and act rashly, resulting in many suspensions – and we’re only in the 1st round!

    Why? Because they saw what was permitted last year, and so if it helped the Bruins win then they should adopt that strategy too.

    • habs-hampton says:

      Don’t forget about Lucic’s favorite move… the sucker punch after the officals move in. I’ve seen that move by him at least a dozen times.

  32. dhenry1234 says:

    It’s a shame what is happening with the playoffs this year. It’s like all the teams saw how the Bruins played last year and thought “oh they won the cup so it’s alright”.

    • habs-hampton says:

      I’ve suggested this before, but the NHL cooses to ignore me. If you want to fix it, do this: Make it a team suspension. When Asham gets suspended the Flyers get to choose who on the Pens serves it.
      How long do you think the Ashams, Torres, the (last years) Cookes, etc would be in the NHL if there actions resulted in Crosby, Malkin, etc. getting suspended?

      Critics will say the NHL wouldn’t want star players suspended, but isn’t that better than having the Crosby’s, Sedin’s, Toewses on IR for weeks and months?

      • Strummer says:

        Take it a step further if it happens twice the team is disqualified and eliminated from further competetion.

        ______________________________________________________
        “It’s just an opinion – I could be wrong”

  33. The Dude says:

    Olympic sized rinks would be a hand in hand move to give the new bigger faster athlete more reaction time….or Nerf Ice!

  34. Rob says:

    Can you imagine if other leagues were run like the NHL? Michael Jordan would have been considered “too soft”, while Anthony Mason and Charles Oakley would have led the Knicks to a run of NBA titles. The contacting the head penalty would not exist in the NFL and QB’s would be told it’s their responsibility to not get killed. Teams would employ 2-3 pitchers who would start a game just to intentionally throw at the opposing teams top players in an attempt to knock them out of the game. Why is the NHL the bottom feeder of the big 4 sports in North America again?

    The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

    • Mattyleg says:

      Great one, Rob.
      That’s a very good comparison.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • Hobie Hansen says:

      A little far off on your comparison for a couple reasons. The NHL has always been at or near the bottom of the four big sports in North America.

      Only now, with the increase in action, which includes violence, is it gaining popularity. When was it most popular, In the 70s when the Bruins and Flyers were brawling their way to cups.

      Guess what, the Bruins and Flyers are brawling their way to cups again and the ratings are going through the roof.

      Comparing basketball to hockey is just silly.

      And in the NFL, the players tacking other players are trying to injure them and take them out on almost every play.

      Look, I hate Torres and Asham, the second I saw Asham do that I wanted him tossed for 30 games.

      But the fights and clean hits ( whatever that is considered these days?), fans go crazy absolutely crazy for them. Bettman is loving ever minute of what is going on right now, all the way to the bank.

      If you want to get rid of head shots the only thing that can be done is to eliminate open ice hits or anything beyond pushing along the boards.

      • Chuck says:

        Ratings are up in the States because the largest markets in the country are represented in the playoffs. If the Rangers, Devils, Philly, Kings and Blackhawks don’t make the playoffs, ratings would be way down regardless of the number of fights or amount of violence.

        ___________________________________________________
        Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

        • Hobie Hansen says:

          Well the Rangers, Devils, Blackhawks and Philly make it almost every year. So that leaves the Kings? I guess the Kings have single-highhandedly saved hockey, I would have never guessed it.

          My mistake.

          • Mattyleg says:

            Read Hackel’s piece.
            It has more to do with NBC covering more of the series.
            Not about the violence.

            —Hope Springs Eternal—

      • Rob says:

        i don’t think that is entirely true. If you want to talk about sports that were at or near the bottom, that would be the NBA. Back in the 70’s when things like fights and dirty play was running rampant in the league. The NBA cleaned up it’s act and, buoyed by SKILL players like Magic Johnson, Larry Bird, and Michael Jordan, they became a powerhouse league in the 80’s and 90’s.

        As for the NHL; hockey competed very well with the other big four sports, with the peak of it’s popularity coming right around the time the Rangers won the Cup in 1994. Then work stoppages, and a boring and diluted product hurt them and they quickly descended down the ranks of sport popularity, being surpassed by a new wave of sports like Nascar and MMA. The sad thing is, now that the NHL is competing with those lower tiered sports for ratings, they seem to be following their lead in terms of what grabs viewers attention. Unfortunately, that type of thinking has led them astray.

        Violence will always sell to a certain percentage of the population. but if you look at the sports that have made it in a BIG way, each and every one of them has made a concerted effort to protect it’s star players and to allow the skill in its sport shine. People who don’t see that are the ones that are “silly”.

        The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

      • Mattyleg says:

        Did you read Stu Hackel’s article?
        He makes the excellent point that there is no indication that it is the violence that is causing viewers to tune in. Check it out.

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

        • Hobie Hansen says:

          I definitely support Cherry in this one far beyond Stu Hackel.

          Cherry was the coach of the year, who is Stew Hackel again?

          • RGM says:

            Cherry was also fired after forgetting how to count to five, how many jobs has Stu Hackel lost because he knows how many players are allowed on the ice?

            ———————–
            GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
            “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

            Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

          • Hobie Hansen says:

            Again, I really haven’t followed Stu Hackel’s career very closely. I tend to take the opinion of players or coaches over any journalist trying to gain readership or create controversy the majority of the time.

            And i guess every coach who was called for too many men on the ice in the playoffs should be fired.

            Wasn’t there a record amount of those calls last year?

          • Propwash says:

            So, basically, you refuse to keep an open mind about things?

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          • Chuck says:

            “I tend to take the opinion of players or coaches over any journalist trying to gain readership or create controversy the majority of the time.”

            And Don Cherry doesn’t try to get more viewers for Coach’s Corner by creating controversy most of the time?

            ___________________________________________________
            Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

          • Mattyleg says:

            So I take it you didn’t read his article.
            I understand, it was a bit long.
            Hackel used to be the director of broadcasting for the NHL.
            That’s what gives him more credentials to discuss matters of viewership and audience than a failed coach who only likes the sound of his own voice.

            —Hope Springs Eternal—

          • Hobie Hansen says:

            Cherry says what is what and speaks the truth. I don’t necessarily like when he goes on about the military, I don’t mind either.

            But when it comes to hockey he’s right 95% of the time.

          • RGM says:

            And yet you seem to take the word of Cherry over much more intelligent and well-reasoned people such as Ken Dryden.

            You have the choice between someone that was a borderline player and an overrated coach that deployed the thugs to intimidate and lead hockey into its darkest era, and one of its most intelligent and forward-thinking people–a man so committed to learning that he took a year off hockey to pursue his law degree and then returned to man the pipes for one of hockey’s greatest dynasties, who would later go on to be an NHL executive and a Member of Parliament.

            And you choose Cherry.

            ———————–
            GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
            “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

            Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

          • Rob says:

            Hobie: I noticed you did not address my response to your post above. I’m curious as to your take on those facts

            The Montreal Canadiens: sporting the best AND worst fans since 1909!

  35. Propwash says:

    I don’t want fighting (a fight that is warranted, not a meaningless goon vs. goon scrap) to be taken away from hockey, and I love good hard clean hits a la Subban or Emelin, even though some have been called as interference, which was warranted, but hockey should be played like Olympic hockey or the WJHC, fast, exciting end to end stuff, getting rid of the trap could very well help this out. The other side effect is it might help in curbing the cheapshots and head hunting.

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    • boing007 says:

      Most open ice hits are not the result of fighting for the puck. Usually one player is either stationary, preoccupied, or unaware that he has been identified by the opposing player as a too good to be true, can’t miss target.

      Richard R
      Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

    • issie74 says:

      If the Coyotes are moved to Quebec City,and they play in the East,can you just imagine having to face Torres four times during the season.
      The Globe and Mail has a great picture of Torres just after hitting Hossa.

      NorthTOHab

  36. Mattyleg says:

    Bodychecking was originally supposed to be like shoulder-tackling in soccer. Skating alongside a player and grinding them into the boards, or shoving your way between them and the puck.

    It was also designed so that if a player with the puck was skating towards you, you could stand up to him without getting an interference penalty.

    The objective of hockey was always to get the puck and put it in the net. Not to hit the player. That was supposed to be incidental to efforts aimed at getting the puck, to put in the net. The moment that the puck is no longer on the stick of an opposing player, there should be no contact with him. That’s the way the rules were designed, as was the game.

    In earlier days, when a player had the puck and an opponent was bearing down on him, the thought was “I’d better get rid of the puck, or he’ll take it from me.” Now it’s “I’d better get rid of the puck and brace myself because he’s going to hammer me.” There are now two things the player in possession must do, added to which are considerations of a) where the boards are in respect to where you are b) what level your head is at. Is it up? High enough? c) where you and your opponent’s knees are, d) where your stick is, and where your opponent’s stick is. Then, as McGuire would say: “WHAMMO.” (Or, if he became Habs’ GM: “Oie-maux.”)

    I’m not a fan of taking physicality out of hockey. I lived just over the border from Czech during the lockout and went down to see a bunch of games. The lack of checking was noticable and made the game a bit boring, but there’s a happy medium.

    One last thought for the “It’s ALWAYS been in the game!”ers:
    One of the most punishing, physical defencemen to play the game was Larry Robinson.
    How many career-ending hits did he dish out?
    How many head-shots did he land?
    How many suspensions did he receive?
    The classic hit on Dornhoefer didn’t have Larry skating toward the Flyer, it was a lateral move, the punishing aspect being that Dornhoefer didn’t slow down, and Larry didn’t give an inch.

    Food for thought.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • ZepFan2 says:

      +100

      ———————————————————————-
      “I got a feeling, a feeling deep inside” – Lennon/McCartney

      I’ve got a feeling

    • Chuck says:

      Problem is, hockey players can be like a room of 5 year-olds: give them an inch, and they’ll try to take a mile. The real problem is that the league refuses to enforce the rules.

      ___________________________________________________
      Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

  37. slim wallet says:

    I’m with the old bald bird. Even Bobby Clark has said that body-checking in hockey was devised for one reason – to separate the man from the puck. The reason you kept your head up carrying the puck was to see someone coming. What many call “finishing the check” is what I call a cheap shot when an opponent is unwary or relaxed. The point is the rules should protect a player when he doesn’t have the puck. Yeah, the game moves fast and things happen but if you truly want to protect the players then get some refs with the cojones to call a charge or a late hit. What Torres did was a true cheap shot, a player vulnerable and looking to get the puck back being obliterated by a cement head looking to make the rock em sock em highlight reel.

  38. DorvalTony says:

    Heartwarming to see dirty Detroit (particularly Holmstrom) on the way out. Again.

    Thanks for listening, Geoff Molson.

    • TomNickle says:

      Couldn’t agree more. And if they think they’ll be okay when Lidstrom hangs them up they’re in for a real wake up call.

      So too are those pundits who tout Jim Nill as an elite GM in waiting.

  39. Hi folks, it’s been a while since I chimed in on here — not much Habs stuff to talk about lately.

    I just watched the Torres hit, and while I wholeheartedly agree that late hits should be removed from the game, under the current rules this hit is clean. It’s a lousy thing to do, but it isn’t a headshot and it isn’t illegal, even though it should be.

    Re: the other disciplinary action doled out lately, it’s a joke. If you want to get Hagelin’s flying elbow and Shea Weber’s face-bashing out of the sport, then you’ve got to treat them both seriously, and not handle your stars with white gloves — I’d bet that if Shea Weber were a Swedish rookie no one had ever heard of, he’d be suspended right now. But Nashville’s playoff hopes rest on his shoulders as much as anyone’s so he gets an insignificant fine.

    Speaking of that $2500 fine, the man earns $7.5M per year, or $91,000 per game. For a guy who’s on the ice half the game, that translates to about $3,000 per minute of ice time. So he takes one shift and his fine is paid — maybe two, depending on what Tennessee taxes are like. Given that, what exactly is the purpose of this punishment?

  40. Propwash says:

    It’s getting to the point that someone is gonna die on the ice and some knuckleheads saying “well he probably deserved it, it was a clean check.”

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    • issie74 says:

      Or just finishing his check.

      NorthTOHab

      • Mattyleg says:

        What does ‘finishing a check’ entail, anyway?
        That they are so out of control that they can’t stop themselves from hitting a player when they no longer have the puck?
        At what point does a player ‘start’ his check? Two strides before the man? Three? One? Does the check start as soon as their bodies touch, or is it before?

        I’d better look into the rules to get clarification as to when a check starts. It’s such a common comment that it must be part of the rules. Mustn’t it?

        —Hope Springs Eternal—

  41. BJ says:

    I anyone is up to a small survey regarding what might be of interest to Habs fans until it starts up again in 6 months for us. I don’t know if this has been done as I was away for the last days.
    1) Choice of GM
    2) Choice of coach
    3) Who is our first pick

    1) Marc Bergevin
    2) Bob Hartley
    3) Alex Galchenyuk

    • TomNickle says:

      1) Dale Tallon
      2) Marc Crawford
      3) Alex Galchenyuk

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Agree on all your choices Tom, have a good day.

        Edit: I still have concerns with Crawford, but think his time away from coaching has probably helped him.

        • TomNickle says:

          You too pal.

        • Stormin says:

          1) (Not Patrick Roy) Bergevin/Mackasey, Florida would want compensation for Tallon in the form of 2013 draft picks, if they would even give us permission to talk with him, no way should we give up any 2013 picks to get him as our GM
          2) (Not Patrick Roy) Marc Crawford
          3) (Not Grigorenko) Alex Galchenyuk with Local prospect Mike Matheson as our Second pick at #33

          ______________________________________________
          “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
          Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

          • TomNickle says:

            No compensation for executives or coaches.

          • Stormin says:

            The Exec yes/no compensation issue is supposed to be discussed this off season, but you know their are always ways to get compensation, Teams are getting tired of losing their assistant and or current GM and Coaches to other Organizations

            ______________________________________________
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            Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

      • ABHabsfan says:

        I like your 1 and 3 and while I would like to see Crawford as the coach, he has a legal dark-cloud hanging over him in the form of the lawsuit by the Moore family that I believe is scheduled for court in September. I think this would pre-clude him from coacjing until that is resolved. So for #2 I will take Hartley.

        “man, I love winnin'; you know, it’s like better than losin’?”-
        Ebby Calvin “Nuke” Laloosh

      • myron.selby says:

        This is pretty odd since earlier in this thread you argued (convincingly) that Grigorenko has totally out-performed Forsberg, and I quote:

        “In short, I’ll take a lazy Grigorenko over a hard working Filip Forsberg any day.”

        So are we just feeling a little schizo today or was this supposed to be some weird form of humor?

        • TomNickle says:

          In what way is that odd? Galchenyuk wasn’t a part of the opinion and if you’d like something stamped and on the record my order of preference would be.

          1. Yakupov
          2. Galchenyuk
          3. Grigorenko
          4. Murray
          5. Faksa

          • myron.selby says:

            Now I’m even more confused – if you don’t even rank Forsberg in the top 5, why would you suggest we should take him with the 3rd pick? And why wouldn’t Galchenyuk be part of the opinion (especially considering he was the choice suggested by the guy you were responding to)?

          • TomNickle says:

            I think you’re failing to read properly(no offence).

            I don’t believe Forsberg should be in consideration for the top 5.

            And I believe Galchenyuk is head and shoulders a better choice than both of Forsberg and Grigorenko.

            I don’t know that I spell it out any clearer than that. You’re complicating this.

      • habstrinifan says:

        WOW! Amazing choices!

        Dale Tallon would be hands down an unequivocal outstanding pick.
        Mark Crawford’s lack of French would be offset by his exceptional credentials and Tallon’s hire.
        Haven’t heard one negative re Forsberg. And he is out of the new Sweedish hockey culture… no more trapping in their DNA.

        Man you have me salivating for a scenario like this. Fingers crossed. It’s not impossible.

        • TomNickle says:

          Crawford is fluent in French.

        • myron.selby says:

          Maybe I am failing to read it properly, but I don’t see how. BJ asked 3 questions, the third being:

          “3) Who is our first pick”

          He then answered his own questions, giving his last answer as:

          “3) Alex Galchenyuk”

          You then responded and your last answer was:

          “3) Filip Forsberg”

          To me, this means you want the Habs to choose Forsberg (who you earlier dismissed in a different thread) with their 3rd overall pick. Then you give your top 5 list and it doesn’t include Forsberg.

          I can only assume that you haven’t re-read what you posted as your pick or this discussion wouldn’t be so confusing. I’m not trying to give you a hard time here, I just don’t understand how you can contradict yourself like that and not see it.

          • TomNickle says:

            Missed my typo. Corrected it. My apologies.

          • Stormin says:

            That was hilarious

            ______________________________________________
            “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
            Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

          • Stormin says:

            I guess no FF or Grigo for you TN after all your argumentative support for Grigo, anyways Galchenyuk is the best pick if he is available/

            ______________________________________________
            “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
            Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

    • Cal says:

      1) Gandalf
      2) Gollum
      3) Frodo

    • gK_HabsFan says:

      1) Marc Bergevin
      2) Roy
      3) Grigorenko or Galchenyuk…

    • HFX-HabFan says:

      1- Brisebois
      2- Crawford
      3- Galchenyuk

    • Hobie Hansen says:

      1) Pierre McGuire
      2) Pat Roy
      3) Alex Galchenyuk

  42. Phil C says:

    One of the big problems is the NHL’s tolerance for “finishing your check”. The rules of hockey clearing state that you cannot hit some one who is not in possession of the puck. Unless it is physically impossible to stop, ALL late hits should be considered charging or interference. Based on how quickly NHL players can change direction or stop, the tolerable delay should be a fraction of a second, not the almost full second for theTorres hit on Hossa.

    The problem for the NHL is that enforcing this rule would dramatically reduce the number of hits because it is takes much more skill and timing to hit someone in possession of the puck, while any semi-pro hack can run at guys late. If the NHL truly believed in the game of hockey, they would not be afraid to return the game to it’s intended form. Greed corrupts in this case. The game needs more leaders like Mario Lemieux to step up again. IMO, it’s a much better game when both sides play within the rules. Instead, the playoffs continue without Alfredsson, Hossa, Sedin, Pronger, Horton, how is this good for the NHL? Or for real hockey fans?

  43. issie74 says:

    Another cheap shot last night(TORRES)repeat offender.

    Is it in the best interest of the NHL to have the Coyotes win the series.

    NorthTOHab

  44. Old Bald Bird says:

    I am not a fan of the “finishing the check” movement. There is the bang-bang almost immediate finishing the check that is fine. But too many of these “finishing” checks are strides away and could easily be avoided. I think if they re-examine this whole premise and really tighten up, a number of incidents could be avoided. The Torres-Hossa incident is but one example. Charra-Pacs is another. I don’t know how this “finishing the check” crept into the game to the degree that it has, but I don’t like it at all. I can hardly believe that more people aren’t onto this as a real problem.

    • deggy24 says:

      You have hit the nail on the head. A player who doesn’t not have the puck should not be hit. If an opposing player has too much momentum to avoid contact, he must make every effort to reduce the level of contact.

      Habs Win!

      • BeachHabFan says:

        exactly. If torres stays upright and on his feet, it’s still a solid hit that takes hossa out of the play and has him looking over his shoulder next time, but no concussion, and no suspension. 2 min for interference, move on…

        Finishing the check used to mean making contact on a good checking opportunity instead of stopping, avoiding the hit, and letting the opponent make the play. Finishing dd not mean launching yourself, or riding someone out and trying to put them over the boards, or landing on them elbow-first afterward.

    • RiverviewCanadien says:

      Completely agree. For years I have tried to understand what “finishing” a check means. To me, they are just a check, and more often than not, late. People use the argument of speed and momentum, but we have all seen how quickly these players can stop on a dime and change direction.

      Another one is charging, you hardly ever see this one called anymore.

    • Phil C says:

      I guess I type too slowly as a made the same point as you above after your post. At least two of us agree!

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Completely agree BIrd, and have been saying the same thing since I joined this site.

      If you go back and watch 70’s flyers they didn’t do this finishing the check thing like it is done today.

      Sadly I think Canadian Hockey invented this form of interference and as I recall it may have started at World Juniors when Canada took on the Russians many years ago. It was our way of slowing them down.

      Checking is to remove the player from the puck, it know longer is used for such reason it seems.

  45. twilighthours says:

    I haven’t really decided if I’m disgusted by the violence and number of injuries this year, but I do know that I’m just as in to the playoffs this year as I always am. I’m loving the intense games.

    I guess this means that I’m OK with the violence and injuries.

    And I’m surprised at what I’m about to write: Don Cherry is right, the game has been this rough and violent many times in the past.

  46. Habitall says:

    Can someone explain something to me? Shawinigan, home to 2 good Hab prospects, Bournival & Ellis, just got eliminated. But because the Memorial Cup is hosted in their town this year, are they actually going to be one of the finalists for the Cup — despite being eliminated?

    How does that work?

    • smiler2729 says:

      Host team gets in no matter their record… goofy.

      _______________________________________________
      Jack Edwards is a clam, Bruins are gutless weasel pukes.
      The Halakian Jaroslaves’ constant BS make me anti-Halak

    • Stormin says:

      The Hosting city of the memorial cup always gets an automatic bid with the Champions of each the OHL, WHL and QMJHL,,, sort of a way of boosting appeal to the fans in the hosting vicinity,

      ______________________________________________
      “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
      Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

      • Habitall says:

        Thanks for confirming. Never heard of this kind of thing anywhere else.

        • olematelot says:

          It happens all over, provincial championship tournaments in minor hockey have a host city/town who in a lot of cases haven’t won their way in. The Telus Cup tournament has a host team who in most cases isn’t a regional winner, same for the Royal Bank cup. These are just a few examples

  47. Ian Cobb says:

    Every time I hear Don Cherry telling people that the hard hitting is just part of the game and to love it, I will put up this post.

    We all love a great clean body check, but the head should never be a target.!! PLEASE READ!

    After concussion, severe depression and it kills.!

    What is a concussion?, as comprehended and explained by myself.
    I have been involved as a lay person with research pertaining to neurology at a major medical university. I have picked up a lot of information working first with veterinarian pathologists when I was doing research on my fox and mink ranch with calcium. And I have been involved lately with the neurology research dept. from a major medical university. Only as the handler of the research birds involved in the study and offering some of my former findings from my own autopsy’s So I do not profess to be an expert on the subject pertaining to concussion, but I will try to explain, the best that I can, what happens to the brain cells that have been concussed inside the skull. And why one must stay completely resting after a concussion.

    The very soft brain cells, when violently thrown against the skull, are damaged and the neuron releases a potassium chemical out of the brain cell. Leaving a void. Calcium that is already present around the outside of the cells, seeps into the cells replacing the potassium. This calcium is what gives the chemical imbalance to the brain and is what causes the damage. Until all of this calcium leaves the brain cells completely, and it can take a long time, depending on how much calcium was taken on each cell. The patient is left extremely vulnerable to instant death upon a second bump, or at least permanent brain damage as the calcium solidifies upon second impact. Even a hard coughing spell or light exercise can cause severe pain and damage. Complete rest is needed.
    These damaged cells have to be cleared completely of this calcium before one can resume activity to avoid more serious consequences including death. This is very acute in young people under the age of 24 as the brain is still growing and developing. Please, coaches and parents know this, every severe contact to the head can cause some cells to expel potassium and take on calcium. A second, even slight bump, with the cells still containing calcium, can be even more deadly.
    Ian Cobb

    • smiler2729 says:

      Hard hitting has always been in the game, it’s the headshots that are out of control.

      _______________________________________________
      Jack Edwards is a clam, Bruins are gutless weasel pukes.
      The Halakian Jaroslaves’ constant BS make me anti-Halak

      • Phil C says:

        I don’t think it has always been a part of the game. When players didn’t wear helmets, the did not run at each other like they do now.

        It has also never been permitted within the rules. Here is the charging rule from the NHL website:

        “42.1 Charging – A minor or major penalty shall be imposed on a player who skates or jumps into, or charges an opponent in any manner.

        Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner. A “charge” may be the result of a check into the boards, into the goal frame or in open ice.”

        The rules clearly state that violent checks as a result of distance travelled are not permitted, but clearly the NHL has been tolerating them for decades.

        Given what we now know about head injuries, it is beyond irresponsible to allow violent hits, it’s downright stupid. Why anyone would allow their children to play contact hockey in its current form is beyond me.

        • LafleurGuy says:

          Right on. Butch Goring’s helmet prevented cuts and nothing else. Gretzky’s original helmet was flimsy, flimsy! My favorite, Lafleur would have had a shorter career if all coaches were like Lemaire…..um, sorry!, concussed thinking!, if the hitting was like it is now back in his era.

          “May you live in interesting times.”

    • LafleurGuy says:

      Ian, I thought it was you who gave out this neat info since I’ve been reading on habsinsideout circa 2008. Thanks.

      “May you live in interesting times.”

    • issie74 says:

      Ian,google Peterborough Petes Head Concussion,they have quite the program going there.

      NorthTOHab

  48. habstrinifan says:

    Maybe I am being overly critical because the HABS are out of the playoffs, but I find the ‘violence’ (and I call it violence) and the inconsistent rulings and unconvincing dispatches from Shanahan to be totally robbing this year’s playoffs of real sporting excitement. Hopefully it will settle down.

    • Mattyleg says:

      I agree.
      Nash/Det has been a great series, as has StL/SJ, tho.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

      • RGM says:

        Outside of the Weber/Zetterberg head smash and the Burns/Nichol head shot, these two series have been remarkably clean and well-played.

        ———————–
        GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
        “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

        Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

      • RiverviewCanadien says:

        Yup, NSH and DET is exciting hockey. Intense, but for the most part clean and the way I expect playoffs to be.

        Rinne is unreal right now, what a goalie he has been.

  49. TomNickle says:

    Re: Forsberg/Grigrenko

    I just love this debate. I’ve really enjoyed watching TSN and listening to Bob McKenzie and Craig Button gush over Filip Forsberg and put Grigorenko down for allegedly taking some nights off.

    The Forsberg argument has been that he has played with professionals and didn’t look out of place. Well, I suppose you could say he played with professionals, all of six games in the actual SEL where he registered one point. I don’t hear much mention of his true team, the junior Leksands(or SEL-1) squad for which he played 43 games this season and only registered 17 points which left him an underwhelming ninth in team scoring. He draws consistent comparisons to Gabriel Landeskog, yet Landeskog played three games in the Swedish elite league registering a point and registered 21 points in 32 games at the junior level(SEL-1) in Sweeden. Or by comparison, .39 ppg for Forsberg at the junior level in Sweeden and .65 ppg for Landeskog at the same level. And oh yeah, that Landeskog guy came and played two seasons of OHL hockey to learn the North American game. If the worldwide stage means anything, Forsberg had one point in six games at the WJHC on the Gold medal winning team while Landeskog a year earlier and playing largely with the same group registered two points in the only game he played.

    Landeskog and Forsberg are night and day yet I consistently see the comparison.

    Now on to Grigorenko. He came to North America this year to learn the game. Registered 85 points in 59 games for the Ramparts and was immediately inserted as their #1 centreman(unlike Forsberg who’s held a complimentary role for three years). At the Russian Junior level(also against men) he registered 35 points in 43 games last season for a ppg of .81. At the WJHC he registered five points in six games.

    So to recap. Grigorenko has been more productive offensively at every level than Forsberg by a significant margin and has had to compete in more hockey games than Forsberg in each season. Grigorenko has played second fiddle to nobody in terms of reliance for offense while Forsberg has been a role player.

    In short, I’ll take a lazy Grigorenko over a hard working Filip Forsberg any day.

    • Cal says:

      But Grigsy (that would be his nick-name, like it or not) did SFA in the playoffs, when his team needed him most. Against 16 to 20 year olds. that’s not good.
      The playoffs are where the stars come to shine and, thus far, Yakky was yukky, Gavy was goney and Griggsy was a pigsy. Not boding well for the upcoming Draft, wouldn’t you say?

      • TomNickle says:

        He played in 76 games this year not counting the exhibition season for the Ramparts.

        And food for thought, Filip Forsberg has 3 points in 10 playoff games.

      • Stormin says:

        After watching Grigorenko crap the bed in playoffs, i would not take him with a top 20 pick. I watched the Halifax Quebec series in it’s entirety and Grigorenko was awful ( although maybe he was playing hurt)

        ______________________________________________
        “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
        Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

      • veryhabby says:

        Cal…it is believed that Grigsy (don’t like it lol) has been playing injured. He has gone into his dressing room on many occassions during the playoffs. Something is up with him.

    • veryhabby says:

      I have not heard what the boys in TSN have said….but your arguement is well written, you should send it to them! I am also surprised they are comparing the two. I do see Forsberg as a solid pick up, but not in the same level as Grig at this time.

      What i do find comparable though is the 2 “G”. I keep hearing that Gal would have possibly challenged for 1st overall if not injured all season. That of course would place him in direct competition with Greg. Unfortunately we will never know cause he was injured. Some players drop ranks in their draft years, others climb like crazy. If scouts still believe that he would have been either #1 or #2 ranked player, then naturally I hope MTL gets to draft him. But right now, I don’t see Forsberg ahead of Greg with them both playing this past season.

      I would also assume that Forsberg is further away from making the NHL, and not closer, then Greg. Forsberg is like OTT pick last season, the kid with the Z last name (ya I am horrible with names). Forsberg would probably stay overseas as he is not age eligable for AHL.

    • Habitall says:

      Good points. At the very least, whoever takes Forsberg will be looking at a learning curve of at least 1-2 years, just because he needs to get accustomed to the N. American game. Grigorenko is far more likely to make an impact, starting in year 1. Maybe not a total game changer, but an impact.

      • Max says:

        Ever hear of patience. I’d prefer a pick like Forsberg who will probably have a big impact on the team 3 or 4 years down the road, over a guy like Grigorenko who may play next year but will probably never excel in the years to come

        • TomNickle says:

          Probably based on what exactly? A player who can’t compete at an elite level in a substandard league by professional standards should be considered likely to become elite in three to four years in the best league in the World because he works hard?

          Sorry to burst your bubble Max but players with skill win out in this argument. Hundreds of thousands of players work really hard and never make it let alone become elite.

          If hard work determined who would become a great NHL player Tanner Glass would be a fifty goal scorer.

    • Mike D says:

      Nice post and summary, Tom.

      – Honestly yours
      Twitter: @de_benny

    • gK_HabsFan says:

      I tend to agree…

      Also, all the stuff about Grigorenko being lazy surfaced right after the WJHC. People tend to forget that he sustained a leg injury during that tournament and missed a few games (and wasn’t 100%). So the notion that he might be playing injured is valid.

      Also, I too don’t see what is so special about Forsberg. Ideally, with the 3rd pick, I wouldn’t mind the Habs picking up either Grigorenko or Galchenyuk.

    • Max says:

      Tom,you are aptly named. Your thoughts are worth about a nickle.

  50. ABHabsfan says:

    It seems to me that the supposed crack-down on head shots in the NHL should be abandoned. Clearly the players don’t want to stop doing it, the league refuses to properly penalise it, the owners love the revenue from MMA style entertainment. Just let ‘em go, just put it in their contracts every year that playing NHL hockey could leave you a vegetable but that’s entertainment. Here’s your $50M guaranteed contract.

    “man, I love winnin'; you know, it’s like better than losin’?”-
    Ebby Calvin “Nuke” Laloosh

    • LafleurGuy says:

      Seems like ages ago that CTE (chronic traumatic encephalopathy) was a very topical news item, and how guys were going to donate their brains for research to that same institute that is housing Ted Williams cryogenically frozen head. Keith Primeau was often an on-air spokesperson which strikes a personal note ’cause I met Primeau when he played for the Hamilton Kilty Bees. The news reports brought up a name from the far past, Reggie Fleming, who seemed to have suffered a similar fate to that of boxer Jerry Quarry in having lost most cognitive functions by the time they were in their fifties. Sorry that I forget the poster’s name who several times shared the technical info of the destructive leaching of calcium into damaged neurons. Really enjoyed those posts. Incorrigible (NHL violence).

      “May you live in interesting times.”

  51. Mattyleg says:

    Hi there everyone,
    I just got back from the kitchen where I was making tea, and I’m just about to take up my knitting and do some other things that blinkered, anachronistic men sadly trapped in a stultifyingly masculo-centric past imagine that men today would consider embarrassing to do.

    There is a dangerous misapprehension taking place in which certain people are equating the sort of play we’ve been seeing with ‘tough hard hockey.’ This is patently untrue.

    These same people are saying that the game has always been like this, and to remove the type of play that we’ve been seeing would kill the game, and that we ‘men’ (who are actually women of the 1950s, only without the inherent skill to bake delicious cakes) should change sports, or stop complaining.

    The sort of thing that we’ve been seeing, my hairy-knuckled, all-male, certainly non-evolutionarily-challenged friends, is against the rules of the game. Have a look at them: it’s all here. I recommend looking at sections 4 through 9. We’re not seeing hockey being played here. We’re seeing on-ice thuggery that is destroying the things that make the game great, and could end up in long-term (if not career-ending) injuries for players who are the real faces of the game.

    So the NHL loses its Sidney Crosbys, it’s Marian Hossas, its D (H?) Sedins…. who are they going to put on the cover of EA’s NHL13? Aaron Asham? Raffi Torres? That’ll be the day.

    But then again, it might get some club-wielders out of their caves to buy the game…

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • LafleurGuy says:

      You have stumbled onto a great video game idea, “Call of NHL Duty 2013.” Brilliant Mattyjambe!

      “May you live in interesting times.”

    • Gerry H says:

      Amen.

      I don’t understand why people can’t see that, no matter what your stance is on the entertainment value of thuggery, this kind of play diminishes the contribution of the skilled players. It makes them more wary and less creative. It takes roster spots away from the skill guys to make room for “enforcers.”

      At the end of the day, Matt nailed it. If this is “the way the game was meant to be played,” why do the rules say otherwise?

    • habstrinifan says:

      “There is a dangerous misapprehension taking place in which certain people are equating the sort of play we’ve been seeing with ‘tough hard hockey.’ This is patently untrue.”

      May I say that I absolutely agree. This is pretty close to purposeless violence.

    • RGM says:

      Well said, and humourous at the same time.
      As I’ve said on a number of occasions, professional contact sports inherently contain an acceptable level of violence. Huge bodychecks, delivered cleanly, can rouse a capacity crowd AND both teams much more effectively than thuggery. And to boot, no lasting injurious consequences that will have an effect on a person’s (a real person, not a player) quality of life in the years after they have retired from playing pro hockey. Contrary to the reductio ad absurdum arguments proferred by some, the majority of hockey fans do not want to turn this into a non-contact game that resembles pee-wee ringette. We just have limits on what we deem to be acceptable violence. But it’s easier for those who are unwilling or unable to think of long-term consequences for dangerous/reckless/exceedingly violent hits to say that forward-thinking people should stick to their knitting and curling.

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • Cal says:

      So, Matty, how’s the macramé coming along?

    • boing007 says:

      Roller Derby.

      Richard R
      Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

  52. ed lopaz says:

    wow! Patrick Roy’s Remparts completely collapsed under the pressure of a very young and inexperienced Halifax team.

    Gave up a 3-0 lead in the series and a 2-0 lead in game 7 in front of almost 12,000 fans at the Colissee.

    Disaster!!

    And worse, Grigorenko was a no show for much of the series.

    I think this has to make a lot of Roy fans shake their head a few times and this would be a very weird way for Roy to make the jump to the NHL as coach of the Habs.

    Grigorenko??

    The kid has talent out the wazoo, but is he a leader, is he a guy who can produce when his team is desperate and when the chips are down??

    Halifax’s Johnathan Drouin, who started the season playing for the Lac St Louis Midget AAA Lions here in Montreal (think Louis Leblanc and Mike Matheson) is not eligible for the NHL draft until 2013.

    Drouin is looking like a really hot prospect; he is lighting fast and is a natural point producer (think Claude Giroux??)

    Mackinnon?? well, what needs to be said??

    Mackinnon will be playing in the NHL and producing as an 18 year old, its just a question of how high he can climb??

    He reminds me of a young Steve Yzerman.

    • RGM says:

      2-0, 3-1, and 4-3 leads in Game 7. Just needed to add that in there since I’m still incredibly proud of the young Mooseheads team.
      They are going to be ridiculously good next year and a lot of scouts are going to be eating up the prime tickets. LOL

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • LafleurGuy says:

      Thanks for the great info. So if the “big three,” Yakupov, Galchenyuk, and Grigorenko are not going to be in the Memorial Cup, Dumba was at the under 18’s, Forsberg is in Europe, Faksa’s Kitchener Rangers alive?, who among the top junior prospects is still playing for the Memorial Cup?

      “May you live in interesting times.”

      • Stormin says:

        Grigorenko 11playoff games 3 goals 7 assists and a minus 1

        MacKinnon 11 playoff games 11 goals 21 points and a plus 11

        Jonathon Drouin former Lac Sr Louis Lion 8 goals 9 assists and A plus 5 and scored the game winner in overtime in Game 7 at the colisee.

        The Lac st louis lion team that won bronze at the telus cup last year was stacked with local talent.

        Mike Matheson Dubuque Fighting Saints projected late first round or early second this years NHL draft

        Ryan Culkin Quebec Remparts projected late second or early third this years NHL draft

        Jonathon Drouin Halifax Mooseheads first rounder 2013

        Anthony Duclair Quebec Remparts first rounder 2013

        Just a sidebar on Ryan Culkin, he got cut from MidgettAAA Lions, went down to AA got called up on multiple occasions, then played all playoff games with Lac st Louis culminating in last years bronze medal at Nationals. He then makes the Remparts as an 8th dman and keeps working and now is a projected third round pick in this years NHL draft, good on ya KID

        ______________________________________________
        “Hockey Night in Canada, The Forum, New Years Eve
        Topps or O pee chee Hockey Cards & stick of gum”

      • TomNickle says:

        If the Edmonton Oil Kings make it to the Memorial Cup we’ll be getting a good look at Griffin Reinhart. London has Olli Matta and a handful of others. Kitchener is up against London now so that’s where Faksa will be for the next week.

      • LafleurGuy says:

        Brilliant Stormin and TN!
        Too bad Habs GM__________ can’t bend the rules like Red Auerbach did in drafting Larry Bird one year ahead of his draft eligibility year! At the draft podium, announce, “With our 2012 first round pick, and our 2013 first round pick, the Montreal Canadiens proudly select Nathan McKinnon!”

        “May you live in interesting times.”

    • Newf_Habster says:

      That is why we should think TWICE and THRICE about Grigorenko and Roy.

  53. RGM says:

    Cross-checking a guy in the face and then punching him when he’s down is only 2x as bad as telling Sean Avery to suck it, which in turn is only 2/3 as bad as a deliberate headshot delivered to an opposing team’s captain…sometimes, and that’s equal to running a goalie…sometimes.

    This is the NHL today, folks.

    ———————–
    GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
    “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

    Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • Habfan10912 says:

      Yes Richard. I guess the only hope we have is if the NHLPA finally says enough. Somebody is going to get killed. The Jacobs factor.

    • LafleurGuy says:

      Good name to bring up, and I can’t recall Avery ever being as malicious as some of these guys in this year’s playoffs.

      “May you live in interesting times.”

      • RGM says:

        Avery was (weird to use the past tense on him isn’t it?) an agitator, an exceptionally effective one at that. He played with an attitude that definitely didn’t ingratiate him to opposing teams or their fans. But the most repugnant things the guy ever did involved mocking another man’s girlfriend and waving his stick in the face of the other goalie in an attempt to limit his vision. He was a twit, but he did so in a way that hurt people’s feelings more than their actual brains.

        ———————–
        GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
        “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

        Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • ZepFan2 says:

      All I can say is, the whole World’s goin’ crazy

      ———————————————————————-
      “I got a feeling, a feeling deep inside” – Lennon/McCartney

      I’ve got a feeling

      • smiler2729 says:

        It’s 2012, there’s a weird vibe going on out there everywhere…

        _______________________________________________
        Jack Edwards is a clam, Bruins are gutless weasel pukes.
        The Halakian Jaroslaves’ constant BS make me anti-Halak

  54. mark_ID says:

    I feel like I am going to be the only one….and don’t want to sound insensitive…because I think concussion issues are a real problem, but I don’t really think the hit on Hossa was all that bad?

    He had just lost control of the puck…..Torres didn’t blind side him, he got him with what looked like the shoulder…..and he barely left his feet…..looked more like momentum. Had Hossa gotten straight up, we wouldn’t even be talking about this.

    I guess just comparred to other dirty hits I’ve seen….this one doesn’t really compare to me/

    Am I the only one here??

    “Step off George”

    • RGM says:

      You’re certainly not the only one. A few folks on Twitter last night have that same sentiment as you. It’s such a grey area with the NHL these days that it can sometimes be tough to make the distinction between a dirty hit and a “hockey play.”
      Here’s the thing about the hit – he left his feet and exploded upwards and made contact with Hossa’s head. The timing was .04 seconds less late (0.83s vs. 0.87s) than the hit that Aaron Rome delivered to Nathan Horton in the Finals last year. Rome got 4 games. Torres is also a repeat offender when it comes to delivering dangerous and reckless hits. In addition to the rap sheet that he has, remember too the hit he laid on Seabrook in last year’s playoffs that ultimately forced him on the sidelines for the last couple games of the Hawks-Canucks series. That one didn’t get a suspension.
      Does reputation play a part here? Sure. But the hit was definitely not clean.

      ———————–
      GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
      “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

      Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

      • mark_ID says:

        Yea, agreed….reputation as a repeat offender should definately play a part in his punishment. For me what doesn’t make it seem all that dirty…aside from the fact that a bit late…and questionably high, was that it was his shoulder that hit him. He didn’t put up his elbows or anything like that. And in all the angles I saw of it….it was hard to see direct contact to the head either.

        But hey, if he is a repeat offender…..I have no problems with Torres getting a game or two.

        “Step off George”

        • RGM says:

          The lack of an elbow may end up being his saving grace. That said, Andrew Shaw didn’t throw an elbow either and he got 3 games. It’s all so very difficult to tell these days.

          ———————–
          GO HABS GO! 2011-12 is probably not our year!
          “Scott Gomez is an elite NHL player” – VancouverHab

          Chat with me on Twitter @TheRealRGM81

    • boing007 says:

      It wasn’t a straight shoulder to shoulder hit. He left his feet and raised his shoulder at an upward angle for maximum effect.

      Richard R
      Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

  55. Chuck says:

    Chicago’s Andrew Shaw got three games, not one.

    ___________________________________________________
    Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

  56. secretdragonfly says:

    Mr. Stubbs, what a wonderful, touching tribute to Randy Starkman – well done.

    http://sports.nationalpost.com/2012/04/17/paying-tribute-to-randy-starkman-sports-journalism-loses-a-true-giant/

  57. LafleurGuy says:

    Small chirp from the peanut gallery: Hab buds, remember how Max got 3 games for nailing Letang, but Ryan Malone got nothin’ for hammering Campoli (nail, hammer)? “I’d rather be a hammer than a nail, yes I would…..”

    If we analyzed every team to assign the label of best headshot artist, I guess Max reluctantly holds that title for the Habs. Is this a deficiency that needs to be addressed in the off-season or in the draft?
    “May you live in interesting times.”

  58. Marc10 says:

    Well they can talk to St Pat now… What a comeback!

    • New says:

      That’s right. They should go right out there and scoop up the losing coach, up 3-0, whose team lost 4-3 to a team of youngsters playing on the road. And they should draft the big center who disappeared and was shown up by the same kids because…well it is a long season for him.

  59. frankcasting says:

    Nice to see the National Headshot League has another head-liner in Torres/Hossa to kick around for a day or two, we’ll see that hit on TSN 3298 times this week, listen to feigned indignation from their experts while their ratings continue to soar to unprecedented heights, thanks to every UFC knucklehead who turns off his video games and piles on to the NHL freakshow. Way to go Bettman, this is your wet dream, dude.

    Loving the Habs since 1965

  60. commandant says:

    Today’s Draft Profile is Brendan Gaunce, a big two-way Centre from the Belleville Bulls
    http://lastwordonsports.com/2012/04/18/nhl-draft-prospect-profile-13-brendan-gaunce/

    Go Habs Go!

  61. Chris1138 says:

    The violence in the playoffs so far does not surprise me considering the NHL let the Bruins get away with whatever they wanted last year. Of course teams this year will try to emulate the Bruins play to achieve the success they saw last year. The NHL missed their chance at preventing this when they didn’t chastise Boston last year.

    –| Brad Marchand | Starley Cup Chanpiar 2011 |–

  62. rogieshan says:

    Mike Babcock could actually become the next Habs coach.

  63. Haligonian-Hab says:

    To those who want to see Patrick Roy as head coach of the Canadiens…

    Last night the Halifax Mooseheads just completed a 3-0 series comeback to beat the Quebec Ramparts in game 7 in OT in Quebec City.

    • 24 Cups says:

      Not to mention that Grigorenko failed to lead his team in any way.

      I’m not here to pick on an eighteen year old kid who has only spent one year in Canada, but many junior stars light it up in the playoffs and Memorial Cup. If you can’t do it in the Q how are you going to do it in the NHL? It’s a concern especially seeing the other two choices aren’t really slam dunks.

      I can’t believe that the Habs are finally getting to pick in the top three and there’s no real definitive choice.

      I have totally changed my mind on the topic and now feel that the Habs need to start negotiating with Edmonton for the right to draft Yakupov.

      • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

        For what it’s worth, Yakupov is the consensus number one and didn’t do jack in his playoff series. His team didn’t make it out of the first round. Neither did Galchenyuk (although he had just come back from a major injury). Ryan Murray didn’t do much either in a first-round exit. For all the talk about Grigorenko not showing up, he still put up 10 points in 11 games and was apparently dealing with an ankle injury since March.

        I think the kid’s getting a bum rap and everyone seems to be piling on right now. Bottom line, the kid put up very good numbers in his first year in North America on a team that doesn’t have a ton of talent. He is still a very good prospect.

  64. 24 Cups says:

    I watched the entire Nashville-Detroit game last night and Pekka Rinne (28) put on a fabulous goaltending clinic. It’s a toss up between him and Lundqvist (29) as to who’s the best goalie in the NHL right now.

    If Carey Price (24) can be this good one day the Habs just might be able to win a Cup. The timing would be perfect in terms of the team’s new five year plan.

    • Bob_Sacamano says:

      Rinne is really, really good but for me Lundqvist isn´t better than Quick.

      • 24 Cups says:

        Point well taken although I really don’t watch much west coast hockey. I would put Quick (25) in the same developmental category and/or phase as Price.

        BTW, Weber and Suter played for a combined 62 minutes last night in a 3-1 game that was only decided in the final minute.

        What about the brothers? SK74 had a good game as the coach seems to have a lot of confidence in him. He skated well, took a thunderous hit without missing a shift and killed penalties. AK46 was the same old, same old. I really question this guy’s intelligence level and hockey sense.

    • JF says:

      Steve – In Game 7 two years ago (against Chicago I think), Rinne gave up the tying goal with a few seconds left and then the OT goal to put the Predators out of the playoffs. He and the team have gotten better since then. Maybe a goaltender needs to go through something like that to reach his full potential. Maybe when Price has a good team in front of him, we’ll see that he learned from the OT losses to the Bruins last year.

  65. 24 Cups says:

    This year’s playoffs have been a travesty so far. A real black mark against the game. Thuggery once again rules as illegal and dangerous hits ‘level’ the playing field. Sadly, nothing will be done about it. The Shanahan experiement is already a complete, total failure. Skill and creativity are to be feared and subsequently underminded and sabotaged.

    With that in mind, my Hab related comment would be that the new management team must keep that reality in mind when starting to implement the new five year plan. It totally goes against my grain to state that sad certainty but the neanderthals continue to rule the roost in the NHL. Montreal needs to build a new team that can cope with that sickening truth.

    • Cal says:

      Hey, Hobie loves it and thinks we should all take up knitting and drink tea.
      70s Flyers hockey rules thanks to Butthead, Jacobs, and Snyder (owner of Comcast and NBC, the broadcaster of NHL games).
      The Habs have to counteract this by bringing in players like Bouchard, Nilan, Robinson, and Chartraw. Oh, and Todd Ewen and John Kordic. There. All fixed.

  66. LafleurGuy says:

    But Krejci, I think it was, wasn’t hurt so reading the mind of the Sham, maybe at game time it may be reduced to 1/2 a game.

    “May you live in interesting times.”

  67. LafleurGuy says:

    Hard to fathom pocket change for Shea Weber, and suspension for Backstrom.

    “May you live in interesting times.”

  68. Habfan10912 says:

    Shiloh its the Jacobs factor at work. I do think the est of the league is beginning to see what us Montreal fans have known for awhile.

  69. Old Bald Bird says:

    I was just thinking about this last night. Along with eliminating the late “finishing the checks” and those ridiculous scrums, this could be an important change.

    Something has to give. Those high speed hits on almost stationary players are really bad.

  70. Chuck says:

    Shiloh, I agree. If your team is assessed a penalty, the rules shouldn’t make it easier to kill off the penalty. That’s ass-backward.

    ___________________________________________________
    Being a Hab fan is like buying real estate: only over the long-haul will you appreciate the true value of your investment.

  71. Mattyleg says:

    Sadly, that rule actually made sense back in the day where penalties weren’t so regularly pre-mediated as they are now.

    In the New Environment, it does seem a much more cynical situation.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—


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