How (and when) will the P.K. Subban Saga end?

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As the P.K. Subban Saga drags on, Canadiens fans are wondering when – or if – the restricted free-agent defenceman will ever put on a Habs jersey again.

Here’s what Subban told The Gazette’s Dave Stubbs about playing in Montreal:

“It doesn’t matter how many times I step on the ice at the Bell Centre, I have the same feeling every time: my head’s ready to explode, I want to kill somebody cutting across the blue line and I want to score the goal and celebrate. And I’ll do it by any means possible to win a hockey game. That’s how I feel playing there. I’m not sure I’d have that feeling anywhere else.”

Subban’s agent, Don Meehan, told Stubbs on Wednesday that he expects to have talks with Habs general manager Marc Bergevin before week’s end in a bid to move the file along.

“Subject to that meeting,” Meehan said cryptically, “we’d be in a position of being more defined than we are now.”

You can read Stubbs’s column on Subban by clicking here.

Canadiens coach Michel Therrien was asked about Subban’s comments at the team’s morning skate Thursday in Washington.

“Honestly, I don’t want to make any comments about it,” Therrien said. “I’m trying to concentrate on the guys that I got here. That’s my main focus.”

Stubbs’s column is the main feature in The Gazette’s Hockey Inside/Out section this week. Here are some other stories to get you ready for Thursday’s game in Washington against the Capitals (7 p.m., TSN-HABS, RDS, TSN 690 Radio).

Habs add toughness, by Brenda Branswell

Habs learn secret to power-play success, by Pat Hickey

Habs’ travel plans in overdrive after lockout, by Pat Hickey

Caps goalie Neuvirth ready to face Canadiens, by The Washington Post

In new system, Caps must stick to basics, by The Washington Post

Capitals game preview

Two more floors for Habs condo tower, by The Canadian Press

Meanwhile, San Jose signed former Hab Scott Gomez to a one-year deal on Wednesday and he could make his debut in the Sharks’ home opener Thursday night against Phoenix. Read more by clicking here.

And get this, Gomez will be wearing Bob Gainey’s old No. 23 with the Sharks. Read more by clicking here.

(Photo by Dave Sidaway/The Gazette)

783 Comments

  1. Hammer says:

    Anyone have a needle to pop that giant ego? I really like Pk, but what did anyone actually accomplish in Montreal last year. On a stats level, icetime, points etc he was the best they had, but it is a team game and he should remember that. This is akin to someone hitting 300 on a last place team then holding out. This is not going to end well for PK. Everyday that goes by and the Habs improve on last years results, his leverage decreases. If you look in the minors there are three, 3rd round or higher picks learning day after day on the Dogs. Strategically, two of these guys will be ready next year, and with a emphasis on team do you want PK schooling them? PK time to smarten uo, sign a bridge contract and play. I am sure the Habs and maybe even the coach will welcome you back.

    • peterparker196 says:

      Just remember this;PK was the best young defenseman not in Montreal but in the NHL.His upside is huge.Most likeley a point a game in the future.He is the first rushing defenseman we have had since Robinson!To trade him would be a mammoth mistake that would again insure the habs many more years of missing the playoffs and being a joke.
      I am not inpressed so far.2 wins 1 loss mean nothing.Talk to me at 20 games.I will say that Carey Price does look quicker and better so far than at any time in the past.But 3 games means very little.
      To be honest I have no faith in Canadiens management.20 years of horrible management cant be erased in 1 week!

  2. doug19 says:

    It seems simple Subban says he wants to play for the Canadiens and MB wants to sign him. So do the deal!

  3. wall2bay says:

    Brad Marchand got 4 yrs at $4.5mill….if the Habs are not in this ballpark then PK has every right to be pissed.

    And please don’t tell me he won a cup cuz we all know that Tim Thomas won them the cup!

  4. CCL says:

    This PK thing is BS. I’m on MB’s side. don’t sell the farm for one guy. we’ve seen that movie before. does Gomez come to mind. another year or two with him holding the team back in regards to money and he’s not even on the team anymore. like paying for a vehicle you don’t have. no more mistakes. MB do it your way and put a good team in Montreal.

    • Danno says:

      I hear you, but the fact remains the numbers have not been revealed to anybody yet so it is extremely hard (impossible) to pass judgment on either party until we know exactly what is being proposed.

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

    • Loonie says:

      A Subban contract and selling the farm have no correlation. Gomez was an import and on the downside of his career, if he’s holding the team back financially in two years it will be due to other moves Bergevin makes, not his contract.

      Where’s the BS again?

      • The Jackal says:

        I feel like you and I, along with a few other posters are the voices of reason on the Subban issue.
        For some reason most commenters don’t think he is worth that much, and they conveniently abandoned the notion that PK is a star player.. just doesn’t make sense to me how you have a situation where your most talented guy wants to be here for the long haul and likes the pressure but we can’t come to an agreement. Half the time, people are whining that the pressure in Montreal turns top players off from coming here…. well look now, a top player wants to be here for good and there is a big split opinion?

        Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

    • The Jackal says:

      Dude, no one is “selling the farm” for Subban, what the hell are you talking about? 6M is just right for Subban. A big contract for him would not hold the team back in any respect, rather it would secure one of their best players, if not their best players, for years to come. Big difference.

      Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

  5. Danno says:

    Pay the man what he is worth.

    He has a definable value.

    That video scares me. He likes Toronto too much….

    ________________________________________

    “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  6. bleedhabs81 says:

    Don’t you hate pants?

  7. Strummer says:

    Re: Subban jersey sales

    1. How is this relevant in the debate about what his contract value should be?

    2. What is the revenue split between player, team, league, NHLPA?

    Edit- Inquiring minds want to know!
    ______________________________________________________
    “It’s just an opinion – I could be wrong”

  8. secretdragonfly says:

    So what’s the over/under on the number of posts on this thread before Mike posts his live blog ?

  9. Mattyleg says:

    I’d just like to take a moment to point out to those of you who haven’t ‘got it’, all of my controversial posts since I joined HI/O were jokes.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  10. Propwash says:

    I got one to stir the pot…
    Mike Therrien or Guy Boucher…
    Who is the betterer coach???

    ____________________
    DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

  11. HabsWinn-ipeg says:

    What’s ironic about this whole PK thing, is that IF he is traded (I’ve never believed it would happen, but after reading PK’s interview I’m not as sure), MB will most certainly value him at the same level that PK/Meehan value him, i.e. MB will be looking for incredible return for him. I’d still like to see him signed, but the Habs are most likely a couple years away from being a serious contender – by that time they will have other defensive prospects in the lineup who, while likely not as good as Subban still have lots of upside. MB doesn’t trade Subban unless the return is huge, and he doesn’t trade him in the East – can you imagine the nightmare of having to face him 4-6 times this year? If he gets an offer sheet, MB will likely match as picks in return are not the value that they need for PK at the moment, but trading him could net a return that would set up the Habs for quicker and greater success. (Still hope he signs though)

  12. Mavid says:

    I am telling you all its because of the doll, I should have never bought it, its all my fault..wonder if I burn it what will happen

  13. 44har48 says:

    Let’s bring it tonight boys…come with energy and let’s forecheck the heck out of these guys. They will be lookng to get up early as they haven’t won yet and are pressing. Might be a good time to turn a mistake into an early lead for us!

    Ok, thats my best shot at getting this off the PK topic with my time constraints. :)

  14. shiram says:

    So how about them slumping Caps?
    Ribeiro is top scorer I think, Neurvith in goal tonight.
    They are still looking for their first win and should come out hungry, should be a good game.
    Kinda bummed Eller is still sitting, but you can’t argue with the results from last game.

  15. HabinBurlington says:

    Seems the mention of a former Capitals player will get ya modded around these parts.

    Anyways, heavy forecheck on Ribiero tonight, don’t want to see him given any open ice.

    As others have said, this will be our toughest test yet.

    No surprise the Caps are struggling out of the gate like the Flames and Habs, all with new coaching staff.

    • Habfan10912 says:

      I think you mentioned this earlier but it’s worth repeating,
      We need to stay out of the box. The Caps have a dangerous powerplay. No more dumb dumb penalties.
      ———————————–

  16. canuckbot says:

    Isn’t this a game day? There were more posts when there was no hockey. How about a game day post?

  17. habfan53 says:

    My 2 cents worth
    Option 1 – PK signs for 2 years Does’nt look it
    Option 2 – PK signs long term Does’nt look it
    Option 3- They trade him both deny this is what they want
    Option 4 – Bergevin says enough Fine let him sit out the year we still hold his rights.
    Option 5 – Another team extends an offer Canadiens match it
    Option 6 – Another team extends an offer Canadiens get a TON of prospects and lose millions in ancillery revenue.

    Things to think about PK: You have not won an individual NHL award, You have not won a Stanley Cup, you have not even been named to an All-Star team.
    Yes you logged top minutes last year but that was with Markov out it won’t happen again this year.

    Like the DODGERS “Wait till next year”

  18. HabFarmer says:

    Sooo…. just checking in to see how things are goin’. Haven’t been here for a while…….. lemme see…….. .

    Carry on.

    *******************

    Bring on zee Fembaahhts!!

    • Blondie says:

      Thanks for that. They seem to be a lot closer to agreeing than we are here. If Benn signs first it will be very interesting to see what the terms are and how it affects the PK negotiations.

    • Cardiac says:

      For the article… Did you read the comments section? $9 hockey tickets on game day! Wow, they are desperate…

      “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
      - Jerry Maguire

  19. Habfun says:

    Todays poll is a loaded question, you can’t side with either of them because we don’t know what has been offered by each side. I would like to see him signed but not at any cost.

    It\\\’s all about the CH

    • von says:

      Agreed!

      _________________________________

      “Obviously it would be great, but they don’t really hang conference titles in this rink. They raise Stanley Cup banners.” – Carey Price

  20. Habfan10912 says:

    I wonder what time the Timo/Habsolutely golf game is and if it will be streamed live?

    ———————————–

  21. Habs Fan in TO says:

    Enough is enough!

    Put the three of them in a room with no water or food and only feed them once they have reached an agreement.

    A trade is out of the question!

  22. Propwash says:

    Gotta eat more celery then…

    ____________________
    DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

  23. Mustang says:

    Almost 700 comments (on this thread alone) about P.K.’s unsigned contract and the funny part is that no one here has any idea what is really going on. No one knows what terms and conditions have been offered by the team and no one knows what is being demanded by the player and his agent.

    • Steeltown Hab says:

      You expect any less? lol.

      Seriously though people putting trade proposals out there just got off the site, that’s a joke. You’re not a habs fan if you’re interested in moving him.

      ———————————

      Lars, PK, Galchenyuk, Pac, Emelin – @J_Perez22

    • Blondie says:

      That’s why there are so many. If we knew the details we could only argue about the relative merits of each position and suggest a meeting in the middle. This way we can speculate on what those positions are and then argue the relative merits.

      More debates, more comments, more ad revenue for HIO. Everybody wins!

      Well, except for maybe PK and the Habs. :)

  24. ed lopaz says:

    how many Diaz jerseys have the Habs sold?

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Does the one I have on order from China count? It is costing me $45.

      • ed lopaz says:

        No. it doesn’t. because it’s a freakin “knock off” Ha! Ha!

        Subban is worth a lot of money in merchandise sales to the Habs over the next 10 years.

        Subban and Price will lead those sales – and we’re talking millions of dollars.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          I agree Ed, I hope they sign him. I am starting to believe, however, more and more that this is Fehr versus Bettman part II.

          Pressure from owners and Union to each side.

          • ed lopaz says:

            well Bergevin should not be listening to the other owners because its the Habs that stand to lose and that’s all that should matter to him, Molson, and us.

        • Whatever says:

          And if they don’t buy a Subban jersey, they are not going to buy a Galchenyuk jersey or a Pacioretty or whomever would come from a Subban trade? More letters in Galchenyuk than Subban.

          Montreal isn’t Nashville where they have to have marketable players to sell seats or merchandise.

          • K-hab25 says:

            +1000000000000000

          • ed lopaz says:

            the volume of merchandise sales is not “constant”.

            it actually can be significantly higher when the right type of player is involved.

            Subban is that kind of player. he raises the sales much higher.

            him and Price are seen as Superstars in the merchandise world.

          • The Jackal says:

            Even so, having franchise players like Subban only helps, so that’s a terrible point.

            Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

  25. Ozmodiar says:

    Trade proposal:

    PK Subban for Logan Couture and a pick.

    …then hope like hell they don’t send us the wrong centerman!

    • krob1000 says:

      I would trade Subban and one of our second picks for Couture. The problem is San Jose has no organziational depth and I am prety sure they wouldn’t mess with Couture who is really their cornerstone moving forward.

    • The Jackal says:

      Trading Subban is out of the question, man.

      Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

  26. J.J. of Turku says:

    Off-topic from Subban, but I saw Jesse Winchester in a few games here in Turku (Finland). Had to wonder his work ethics. His status here was a NHL-star from Canada, but there he was killing 3 vs. 5 penalties, blockings shots at “minors”.

    I think he would be a perfect fit for 3rd line.

    http://www.rotoworld.com/player/nhl/2484/jesse-winchester

    Bazinga!

    • bwoar says:

      Hi JJ,
      It’s a little exaggerated to call Jesse Winchester an NHL-star no matter where he is playing. He never really found a place in Ottawa, and I think our depth in Montreal is better than what he would bring. Glad he’s doing well in Turku!

      “thoroughbred”

  27. Habsrule1 says:

    I love PK, but to be fair, if MB decides he has to trade him, and he manages to get very good value, I’m sure I’ll get over it. I dread the thought of getting a player with “potential” and a couple draft picks.

    I don’t want to see another Chelios, Roy or McDonagh trade.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  28. otisfxu says:

    yes the sad part about this is all the negative back and forth, the assumptions and basically the tension that it is generating.

    So if PK signs, comes out flat for a couple of weeks, MT starts benching him, and away we go – the circus starts. L’antichambre Yeehaw!!Is it PK or is it MT, yada yada.

    Tonight could be an important game in more ways than one.

  29. habsnyc says:

    If the diffiuclty in coming to terms with PK is due to pressure from the NHL and NHLPA then a trade is not the solution.

    Blue, blanc et rouge. Red and White for Canada. Blue for Smurfs.

    • Captain aHab says:

      Neither is signing him for anything he wants…..maybe our boy will be sitting for a while folks, especially if the Habs don’t completely self-destruct while he’s MIA. I agree with whoever said earlier that that increases the pressure to keep Galchenyuk: take the focus away from Subban.

      —————-
      Me skull and crossbones arn’t the only thing I plan on raisin’ tonight.

  30. Steeltown Hab says:

    It’s the first time in a long time this team has had players with superstar potential (Subban, Price) and we hope as well Galchenyuk.

    It’s not the time to be messing around. Lock up the core long term. I have no problem with 6-8 years at 5 – 5.5 per. If you give him a 2 yrd bridge deal he’ll just earn even more money for his long term. There’s no principle when Pac n Price were way less established when they signed their deals.

    Galchenyuk will get a long term after his entry level, believe that. MB please don’t ruin the best core this team has had in a long time with a stupid trade (doubt that will happen though).

    ———————————

    Lars, PK, Galchenyuk, Pac, Emelin – @J_Perez22

  31. Phil C says:

    Mediation helped both sides get through the lockout. I wonder if the Habs and Subban could hire an independent arbitrator, and make it non-binding? Or is this just not done in the NHL?

  32. Yukon B says:

    Several of the EOTP people believe he is equivalent to Shea Weber based on stats and they actually said it with a straight face. Somewhere I can just imagine PK reading this s#*t and going hell yeah, give me another million. You can almost feel that attitude from the interview. My belief is that good players are fairly common and can be found on weak teams, while great players make those around better, put the other team in fear, and are rarely found on weak teams. In my mind that is the difference between Weber and Subban.

  33. HabsFanInTampa says:

    Concerning the Subban contract fiasco, which I haven’t been following. Has the Canadiens organization made public the amount of money and term they offered Subban? Also, has Subban mentioned what dollar amount he is seeking?

    • secretdragonfly says:

      No to both questions but that isn’t stopping the wild speculation and baseless rumours flying around today.

    • Blondie says:

      Nope, this is being done behind closed doors…as it should.

    • Phil C says:

      Nothing has been offically disclosed, but we do know the following:

      - Meehan is on the record saying that comparables for Subban are Eberle, Hall, Seguin, Kane, and Skinner, all who signed for at least 6 years at $5.2M-$6M per year.
      - The Habs have a history of offering two-year bridge contracts like what Del Zotto just signed (Pacioretty, Price).
      -Bob Mckenzie says the Habs want short term, Subban wants long term. Mckenzie says that they are $2.5M-$3M apart PER YEAR in dollars. I find McKenzie to be very reliable in the information he shares.

  34. Habsrule1 says:

    I don’t care who’s right. Just sign him FFS!

    But if he’s asking for 5M or less, PK’s right. If he’s asking for more, MB is right….regardless of term.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  35. bwoar says:

    Also, what does finishing 15th really have to do with PK Subban? Even if he didn’t have a lousy first half, I doubt we’d have finished that much higher.

    “thoroughbred”

    • bleedhabs81 says:

      Right or wrong, it is just an arguement which attempts to normalize his actual worth across all NHL teams.

      Although he was our number 1 D, does it mean he would be every teams number 1 d? Would he play just shy of 30 minutes on other teams or would he be in a lesser role?

      Is he going to surplant Chara or S.Weber if he showed up on their teams tomorrow? Or how about Del Zotto or Girardi for the Rangers? Keith and Seabrook?

      Would he have logged that many minutes if Markov was back and healthy last year?

  36. HardHabits says:

    The real question we should all be asking ourselves is how in the world has Francois Gagnon managed to bite his tongue in all this?

  37. ed lopaz says:

    now people are blaming Subban for not disclosing publicly what his salary demands are, and then suggesting he get booed “like never before” (the Hard Habits guy below)??

    seriously??

    what a joke.

    • HardHabits says:

      You need to learn the difference between when I am making a joke and being serious.

      What do you think would happen if Subban gets traded because he was trying to high ball the Habs?

      • ed lopaz says:

        you said below you think Subban should go public with his demands, and you said he will get booed if he doesn’t take the offer.

        so you explain to me – where is the joke?

        • bleedhabs81 says:

          BWHAHAHAHAHAHA

          I just got the joke.

        • Loonie says:

          The joke fallback is the HH tool for when his comments are called for what they are.

          • HabinBurlington says:

            Hey, that is kind of where I was going, back off my porch Nickle or Loonie! :)

          • HardHabits says:

            What would that be? The Napoleanic ramblings of a small man syndromed persecution complexed Internet bully!!!

            He said “what a joke”. So I retorted that he should learn to tell the difference between when I am serious and when I am joking. Most of the intelligent people here can tell the difference.

            Maybe you can ask some of them for help the next time you aren’t sure.

          • Loonie says:

            Thanks Dave. I’ll be sure to ask everyone.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          It is all dependant on how his post is received by the masses. Once that is determined then the “joke” card gets played if necessary. ;-)

  38. junyab says:

    A lot of “trade him” comments here, but what no one realizes is what we would get back if a deal was to be made. If Bergevin thinks PK is worth 2-3mill a year then how could he expect anything more than that in return for him. How would you all feel if Bergevin announced a trade for Nikolai Kulemin. If he would want more than that, then he needs to realize PK IS WORTH MORE than that.

  39. otisfxu says:

    As Hal Gill was quoted as saying below- PK is PK – unless he starts gouging eyes out or stabbing guys in the corner – just let him play. if he makes mistakes then the coach has to do his job.

    Now if that is where the problem is, PK and the coach, then MB has a real issue to deal with. (and I will never understand why MT is back behind the bench. No way in living He!! do he and Gallant look like a winning pair back there)

  40. junyab says:

    To me, this is a complete failure by Bergevin. He said his #1 priority was to sign PK. He has not. And the media says they aren’t even close to being on the same page. If he is worth less than what PK wants, then it’s up to Bergevin to make him see that, and negotiate him down. If he can’t then he has failed.

  41. mark-ID says:

    I really hope Ribeiro doesn’t burn us tonight…..that type of thing always seems to happen to us eh haha

    Hopefully he is as effective as Kovalev was on Tuesday.

    “I think I may have found a way for us to get Griffey and Bonds, and we really won’t have to give up much” -Costanza

  42. HardHabits says:

    Let’s take a look at Subban’s own words:

    I want to be paid what I’m worth,” Subban told Gazette columnist Dave Stubbs. “I don’t even know what to think any more,” he said. “At this point, you have to remain optimistic (and realize) it is a business, and a lot of things can happen.

    He wants what he is worth but wont say what he thinks that is.
    He doesn’t know what to think? Nobody cares what you think PK. We care what you do and what you’re not doing is signing a contract.

    “… for my style of game and for what I do for the team, the amount of minutes I play and for what I bring to the table, I have to be fairly compensated.”

    What is fair compensation? I am waiting. You’re a RFA with no arbitration rights. To me fair is 4 million per year for two years. Take it or leave it.

    “I didn’t expect this to be an all P.K. parade. I didn’t expect everyone to jump on my bandwagon to give me whatever I want,” Subban said. “It’s business and I understand that. But I’ve accomplished a lot in two years.

    You have accomplished squat. You were a #1 defence man on a last place team.

    Subban was asked by the Gazette if he could see himself playing for another team.

    “From a business standpoint, I’m sure there are other teams where I could fit in and be a big part of things moving forward, give them a chance to win,” explained Subban. “But ultimately, deep down inside, I want to play for the Montreal Canadiens.

    So all I hear from Subban is he thinks he is worth more than the Habs think he is worth but nobody seems to want to go public in concrete terms with that value.

    4 million a year for two years… (4.25 million max) or kiss the CH good-bye and prepared to get booed like never before when you return.

    • Ozmodiar says:

      > and prepared to get booed like never before when you return.

      I wonder if MB has used this threat as a strong-arm tactic to get him to sign. Probably not yet. I think he’s saving it.
      :)

    • commandant says:

      That’s all well and good, and I agree, 8-8.5 million over two years is fair.

      However the rumored numbers offered by Bergevin are 2.5-3 million per season.

      In that way…. while PK might be asking for too much… our GM is lowballing him too, and both sides share the blame in this and there should be a poll option to suggest both need to be more reasonable.

      Go Habs Go!
      Check out Top Shelf Prospects, my Team by Team prospect reports
      http://lastwordonsports.com/

    • ZepFan2 says:

      “You have accomplished squat. You were a #1 defence man on a last place team.”

      Exactly! That’s why I feel like he’s acting as if he’s better than the team.

      ———————————————————————-
      Ka is a wheel.

      For Your Life

    • sdopus says:

      so gally makes 3+ million per year and PK should make 4 mil? you guys are on drugs.

      • HardHabits says:

        Gally makes 0.925 million per year for the 3 next years after this one. He was given a 2.3 million signing bonus which only counts against this year’s cap. Do some research. Either that or do some drugs.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        I’m guessing you are not aware of the bonuses in the Entry Level Contracts which most top picks receive.

    • Mattyleg says:

      You’re creating false conjectures based on your own imagination here.

      You have no idea what Bergevin is offering him.

      And as for him saying what he thinks he’s worth, do you really think he should start giving numbers to a journalist while his agent is negotiating with his boss?

      He’s accomplished squat?? No, Eller has accomplished squat. PK played himself into the #1 defenceman role on the team.

      You call him a #1 defenceman on a last place team. That means nothing. That’s like saying that Kovalchuck isn’t any good because the Thrashers kept missing the playoffs. You seem to think we should renegotiate salaries every season based on where the team finishes.

      And when you say that you hear that Subban thinks he’s worth more than the Habs think he’s worth, the only place you’re hearing that is in your head, because he never said that.

      But then again, you also want him to negotiate figures thorugh the media, so…

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

      • HardHabits says:

        I am a Habs fan not a PK SUbban fan. I am on the side of Bergevin in this.

        You’re right about one thing. Nobody knows what the offer is or what PK wants. I think it is about time that both sides go public.

    • munch17 says:

      Del Zotto and Kulikov both signed 2 year deals at 2.5 per year.
      I PK worth twice that?
      I don’t think so.
      What has he accomplihed?
      He’s an exciting player.
      But we finished 15TH in the east last year.
      Our power play was pathetic.
      It didn’t take too long to see what a difference Markov makes.
      PK should get what he’s worth – and we will know that in 2015!!

      • Mats Naslund says:

        And Tyler Myers makes 5.5. and Hedman makes 4. And Jon Carlson makes 3.9. And Doughty makes 7. You can see why this is tough because he fits with all of those comparators.

    • bwoar says:

      It’s not outrageous to give the guy 5m for a single year to get him on the ice. How much money did he make for the Habs during the playoffs already, on his rookie contract? I’d be looking for some compensation for that, in his shoes.

      “thoroughbred”

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      You seem angry.

  43. NCRhabsfan says:

    There seems to be a lot of discussion about whether PK is elite or not. The Oxford Dictionnary defines elite as “the best of a group”. I think when we talk about it in hockey terms, there is also a sense that you have to be the best of a group over a period of time. I don’t think, for example, that anyone would maintain that Ryan Nuggent-Hopkins is “elite” yet. He might be someday, but he isn’t yet.

    So how can anyone maintain PK is elite. He hasn’t made the All-star team, he hasn’t won the Norris trophy, he wasn’t Rookie of the Year. So far he has never been placed in that group of the “best” for even a brief period of time, let alone shown an ability to play at an elite level over time. Don’t get me wrong, I love PK, but he simply hasn’t played long enough, been dominant enough, or acheived enough yet to be called elite. I don’t know that I would call Eric Karlsson elite yet and he’s won a Norris and made the AS team. PK is no Eric Karlsson or at least not so far. Playing a lot fo minutes at a young age does not make you “elite”.

    I hope PK signs for an amount that will allow the Habs to build a good team around him. If he commands too much, he effectively sabotages the team’s ability to build a contender. We’ve already had a sample from the Glen Sather/Scott Gomez Book of Hockey Business Management, let’s hope MB avoids giving us another lesson.

  44. Captain aHab says:

    I think the Subban and Benn cases are test cases for the NHLPA. They will set a baseline for the new CBA and as such, it would not surprise me one bit that there is pressure to hold out for as much as possible from outside sources.

    I don’t think Subban would take 2 years @ $4M per as some suggest. I think that would have been done already. And I don’t think he’s looking at 5 years at that level either. I think he’s looking for a golden bridge or a golden long term deal. But then any and all speculation on our part is just that: speculation. And I think Bergevin knows what he’s doing and what he has in PK better than any of us do.

    —————-
    Me skull and crossbones arn’t the only thing I plan on raisin’ tonight.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      My intelligent Leaf Buddy (insert joke here) just texted me 10 minutes saying the same thing. Thinks the League is putting huge pressure on MB/Habs to keep this deal down in price and term.

      Gotta wonder, the owners just finished spending a crapload of time together afterall.

    • krob1000 says:

      That was exactly my thought right out of the lockout….and I still believe that too. Second contracts were not addressed in the lockout…but we all know they are the biggest driving force behind the crazy salaries

      • B says:

        The league wanted significant restrictions on 2nd contracts and it was included in several of their earlier offers. They ended up capitulating on getting it enshrined in the CBA, but clearly 2nd contracts were (and still remain) a big concern.

        –Go Habs Go!–

  45. Rudy says:

    I can’t wait to see the Habs play tonight in DC. Especially Gally 1.0 and Gally 2.0 and to see Markov again. I do kind of wish I had picked a Price T-shirt instead of a PK one last year to wear. I still love PK, but all this crap is definitely an issue.

  46. Ozmodiar says:

    I don’t see how someone can side with PK or MB without knowing exactly what each side is asking for.

    I don’t understand how someone can be pro or anti trade without knowing exactly what the return could be.

    I shake my head at those who bitch about PK’s cockiness, yet rise from their seats when he demonstrates that cockiness on the ice.

  47. HabinBurlington says:

    Wow, can’t believe it took me this long to notice, or the rest of you for that matter. There is a link above us to an article regarding new Condo Towers adding two more floors! Obviously this has been done to help pay PK. Once the architects and engineers hand in the final estimates, MB will know exactly how much more money he has to pay PK.

    Praise be to the Condo Towers, they have saved the day and PK will be signed.

    Go Engineers Go!!!!

  48. punkster says:

    Amazing…we wait for years for a guy with his talent and work ethic to come along, go batshit crazy for his end to end rushes, chant “PK, PK, PK” when he levels a rat like Marchand, yet…yet…there are fans who want him traded.

    Don’t it always seem to go
    That you don’t know what you’ve got
    ‘Til it’s gone

    ***FREE PK!!!***

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      Punks, thanks for bringing up the Marchand hit.

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_BStkVC_zQ

      NEVER a bad time to watch it.

      (And can help relieve pain associated with recalling the Chelios trade, see below).

      Hey Jack Edwards! Click the link!

    • twilighthours says:

      I think PK is greedy because I heard somewhere that he wants to be payed like the best at his position. Therefore, I hate him because I’m jealous of him. I also heard somewhere that he’s bad in the room. So I’m going to ignore the fact that he is the best player on my favourite team and instead call for him to be traded so that he can learn his lesson. If it makes my favourite team worse, oh well, at least he learned his lesson.

  49. danedmunds says:

    “And I’ll do it by any means possible to win a hockey game. ” but only if you give me 5 mil per season

    go habs go

    • Mattyleg says:

      Yeah! Yeah!
      What a selfish jerk!
      I heard that he wants $9m per season!!!
      And a private jet so that he doesn’t have to fly with the rest of the team!

      Trade him for someone better!

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

  50. Loonie says:

    Somebody floated the idea this morning of packaging PK and Eller in a trade.

    If Galchenyuk sticks I don’t see it as an unrealistic option under one condition. The player coming back has to be elite right now. No potential, no ifs or cans. Must be elite today. The player must also be coming from a Western Conference team if I’m Bergevin because I have no interest in Subban and Eller making me look silly for the next ten years.

    With that in mind here are my acceptable returns…..

    Chicago – Patrick Kane or Duncan Keith
    St. Louis – Alex Pietrangelo
    Nasvhille – Shea Weber(not happening this season)
    Los Angeles – Drew Doughty(not happening ever)

    That’s all I can think of right now.

    It appears to me that any trade Bergevin can make involving Subban will make him a sucker because I don’t see any of the teams out West giving fair value.

    Chances are pretty good that Don Meehan knows this too.

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      How about the Yak? Him and Gally could cause lots of damage for a long time.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • Sakus Evil Twin says:

      Meanwhile, out of bizarro world… None of those trades made sense ever.

      No answers, just opinions. Bite me. Och.

    • bwoar says:

      “There are no honorable bargains involving exchange of qualitative merchandise like souls.”

      Same goes for elite hockey skills. I agree with your premise & conclusion.

      I’m struggling to think of the last time quality for quality worked out for both teams…. Lindros / Forsberg maybe?

      “thoroughbred”

    • nek25plus says:

      Look at the names you suggest…they are or will make more money than PK. The problem is we don’t have the cap space until we unload some big contracts…

      Oh and none of them would willing come to Montreal!

    • Whatever says:

      Why don’t you see any western team not giving fair value?

      I’d be shocked if there wasn’t a bidding war. Plus there is no hurry to make a trade. Advantage, Bergevin. Mind you my return value is not nearly as narrow. Hell, Pietrangelo and we are right back in the same position this coming summer.

    • twilighthours says:

      There are few players I would trade PK straight up for. I could probably count them on two hands. So when you throw in Eller…. that list might be down to Crosby, Malkin, or Stamkos.

      • Loonie says:

        Fair enough. I’m of a similar mindset but if talks continue to sour then the possibility becomes stronger he’s moved.

        But again, the players I mentioned are probably the only guys in the West I would accept in return.

  51. I’ve got a bad feeling tonight. The Jets worked hard for their win vs the Caps, but the Caps had little to no effort in the loss. The Habs better not take tonight off or we’ll be reading a not so friendly headline tomorrow.

    IT’S GAME DAY, LET’S GO FANS
    oleee ole ole ole…ole ….ole….oleee

    They Call Me Shane
    “They never asked to be Canadiens, they were Chosen.”
    Shane Oliver
    Twitter @Sholi2000
    http://www.Sholi2000.com
    Custom Sports Figures

    • Sakus Evil Twin says:

      I’m hoping they’re still pumped after Tuesday and filled with self belief. So long as Backstrom and Ovi are tied up in knots they’ll be fine.

      Habs need to stay out of the penalty box.

      No answers, just opinions. Bite me. Och.

  52. habs-hampton says:

    Man, this makes you wish we were just re-signing RFA’s who were under-achievers, over the hill, or have already maxed out their potential.

    We’ve waited years for someone like him, and now he’s going to walk away! Do you really think we can improve the team long-term by trading him? I don’t. If we trade him, we’ll regret it for a long time (ala Chelios and Roy).

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      I STILL need to take a seat and compose myself when I think about the Chelios trade.

    • Whatever says:

      This wouldn’t be a rushed trade. Huge difference. Every team would know Subban was available and there would be a very good bidding war. Plus, no hurry to trade him. We’re not a contending team. We’re a building team, no allusions there. Our GM isn’t trying to save his present job. Depending on the trade, losing Subban could create a hole now and in the future, but it could also fill other holes. Be kinda cool to get another Galchenyuk plus something else wouldn’t it? Certainly worked out for Boston.

      I don’t want to trade a $4 million/year Subban, but I’d be interested in trading a $6 million/year Subban.

  53. twilighthours says:

    More “PK is awesome” vs “PK sucks.”

    I guess I’ll just go back to work.

  54. Propwash says:

    PK made something to the tune of 850k last season. He played way above that payscale, so he is somewhat right in asking whatever figure he’s asking for. I doubt it’s for an an astronomical 6mil figure some here are saying, but to me, somewhere around the 3-4 mil mark is reasonable, so long as he maintains his competitive level.

    ____________________
    DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

  55. Dunboyne Mike says:

    Subban — This keep him/trade him discussion has brought up plenty of valid points from both points of view.

    But there’s also a lot of dross, people posting — and I’ve done it myself — as though they imagine they’ve had a quiet beer with the man and gained access to his innermost thoughts on the situation.

    I want to suggest we be a little more guarded, chiefly by remembering that 99% of what we know about the Subban negotiations is a) filtered through the media; and b) intricately bound up with the efforts of a highly effective player agent and a not inexperienced GM.

    So while we all have our individual impressions of Subban from watching him play, the rest of what we consider to be The Truth about him and about these negotiations is anything but. It’s easy for any of us to be duped, but let’s try not to be.

    Stuff like cancer in the room, prematurely considering himself elite, considering himself more worthy of a sexier contract than Price or Pacioretty — all may be true! But equally, all or some may not be.

    For me, I agree with those who say he’s a massive talent that hasn’t blossomed yet. I would not like to see talent like that slip away to another team. There’s a bit of Deion Sanders about him — it seems to be part of his personality and part of the way he plays. I can take or leave that and only care about how he executes and what he contributes to the team. I want Subban to remain a Hab, but won’t hold it against Bergevin if it doesn’t work out that way.

  56. Maksimir says:

    PK Saga – my take.. its a win-win.. if he signs – great. If it comes to a trade, I believe MB will get good value for him and not just quietly bundle him off without testing the market a la Gauthier.

  57. Mattyleg says:

    Okay, is he signed yet?

    I’ll be back in 10 minutes.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  58. mark-ID says:

    Big game for the boys tonight. Washington is 0-2 to start the season, you know they will be hungry. Montreal has to go in there, play smart….and stop it with the stupid penalties.

    I’m very curious to see how the Gally’s both play, as I believe this should be their toughest test to date.

    “I think I may have found a way for us to get Griffey and Bonds, and we really won’t have to give up much” -Costanza

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Penalties have really been the most glaring problem so far. I am hopeful the team is much more disciplined tonight. Agree that Washington will be extremely hungry tonight.

      Looking forward to watching. Assuming lineup will be same as Florida game.

      Edit: Just noticed Stubbs tweet, lineup will be same as last game.

      • jmsheehy19 says:

        I wouldn’t count the FLA game as us being undisciplined. The refs were all over the place (for both teams) the other night.

        Though definitely agree the caps will be hungry. Weird to see them so slow out of the gate.

        I mean I know they have a new coach and everything, but I thought with a healthy backstrom and a disappointing 11-12 season, they’d come out flying.

  59. HABZ24 says:

    Subban : i dont get it,why must subban follow prices and patchs case, subban has allready proved himself, he plays 25 to 30 mins a game! Hes a stud. Why wait until hes two yrs older,stupid stupid. Habs must give up this short term stupid idea before we lose pk.we cant play chicken here.markov is made of glass even if markov is healthy hes older. Each case should be seen on its own merite not a cookie cutter in stone thing. Sign pk sign pk sign pk

    GO HABS GO

    • Cal says:

      And if his play regresses what do you do? Wade Redden signed a big contract, too, and look at what the Rangers ended up doing.

      • The Jackal says:

        Different cases man. Subban is the real deal.

        Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

      • Loonie says:

        You’re counting on a young 20 something with an elite skill set who has never had a regression in play for any noteworthy period of time getting worse before he gets better.

        That opinion couldn’t be more flawed.

        • HardHabits says:

          Never had a regression? You mean like the 10 times he coughed up the puck in his own zone that led to goals against and subsequent losses? His 1st half last season stunk. His second half was a marked improvement. Which Subban will the Habs get?

          I don’t see his big ego trip. Ok I do see it. If he takes 2 years at 3.5-4 million per what stops him from cashing in big time after that.

          I agree that if the Habs are offering him 2.5 million that is tawdry. However he hasn’t done anything in my mind that warrants 6-6.5 million either. The Happy medium is 4.4.25 million, which is where they will settle, or Subban gets traded.

          It could very well be that Subban has already sealed his fate. Sign him then trade him.

          Nice knowin’ ya.

          • The Jackal says:

            Sure… being one of the top D in the league at 23 is nothing. Improving steadily is nothing. He is consistent and always brings it.
            That comment that his first half was bad last season? You may as well talk about the entire team.
            The arguments against PK are suspect at best.

            Not all oysters produce pearls, thankfully, Price is a pearl producing oyster.

    • habsnyc says:

      Once you set the precedent of no bridge contracts then you are going to have pressure to sign everyone to longer term deals and salaries escalate. The team needs salary flexibility ahead of the cap drop next season and would be hampered by a long term deal for PK. PK has not proved himself.

      You have it backwards. The chant should be: PK sign, PK sign. Not sign PK, sign PK. PK need to accept a contract and resume his
      career.

      Besides, PK’s ego does not mesh with being part of a team. He is not the kind of player around whom one rebuilds a franchise.

      Blue, blanc et rouge. Red and White for Canada. Blue for Smurfs.

  60. Habsrule1 says:

    I think most teams in the league would easily throw 5M or more at PK, if they have the cap space.

    If he’s not elite in Montreal, he sure as hell would be in many other cities. Most teams and fans CRAVE a player like PK and can only dream about ever getting one. If he’s traded, which I just can’t picture, the Habs will regret it MUCH MORE than the McDonagh trade.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  61. HabinBurlington says:

    I have to hope and believe that when MB and Meehan have had their talks that the conversations haven’t sounded like they do here.

    PK is at the very worst our 2nd best defenceman, but until Markov plays a full season, he is our best defenceman. He is worth a very good contract and MB must know this.

    It appears that it is philosophical difference, wherein MB is trying keep term short and money on par with what a higher end player typically gets on a 2year 2nd contract.

    I remain hopeful that MB will show some movement in his position, just as I hope Meehan and PK will show movement in their position.

    I have no idea what the dollars should be, but do hope a contract is signed shortly.

    Quite the hornets nest MB is in already, welcome to the job of GM in Montreal Marc. All the best and hope you make the correct decision.

    • krob1000 says:

      I think you have to project what are PK’s minutes and stats going to look like this year and a year from now, and two years,etc….He is no longer going to se 1st unit PP minutes even if he comes back…I still see Diaz there over him until PK shows a little more savvy in getting his shot off and cuts down the telegraphing of his shot. Markov can get pucks through…I think he likes having the lefty to pass to but he can be a shoot and is not afraid to pull the trigger. So if the righty options are PK, Weber and Diaz..for now it is Diaz.
      With Bouillon a responsible vet able to eat some of the PK minutes…along with Markov. Emelin a year wiser in the NHL and with a mentor in Markov and no fear with a few tougher bodies in the lineup to play his game…he too should be eating more minutes.
      Then project a year or two from now…Bealieu will likely get pp minutes, Tinordi will be a shutdown guy, Gorges still on the books…Markov will likely be signed barring anything unforseen.

      Last year PK played in all situations…he got his points on the pp …moving forward I don’t foresee his numbers being any better. That does not take away from the fact he is a great well rounded dman…but the numbers he put up were out of necessity not necessarily earned and not something he will likely replicate.

      Should he be signed and a part of the Habs moving forward? absolutely but he has to see the other side of the coin here…if he plays every game from here on in…he does not get 1st pp minutes, his pk minutes are likely reduced and his even strength minutes would likely remain equal. He would still be the number 2 dman IMO…but his workload significantly lighter and less taxing and to the benefit of both he and the team. I see it as Meehan trying to cash in on last years situation as he knows that set of circumstances will not repeat in Montreal again with Markov back, Diaz and Emelin now experienced, Bouillon there and Beaulieu likely ready in the next year or two along with Tinordi.

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        I think a lot of posters here will recognise Subban from your analysis. Even those of us who like him know that the weaknesses/areas for development which you identify are correct.

        Does Bergevin get to say these things to Subban? Or does he say them to Meehan who puts his own spin on them before passing them on to Subban?

      • ed lopaz says:

        you see Diaz taking Subban’s spot on the #1 PP because Diaz has played 2 good games there?

        Ok.

        in 2 games Subban has lost about 7 minutes of ice time according to the full text of your post.

        he’s down to a 17 minute per game player, 2nd line power play, because we have Bouillon, Emmelin, and the great Diaz.

        Beaulieu is not likely ready next year; certainly not by the way he has played thus far. He might be ready, but its far from “likely”.

        I really don’t see how Diaz, Bouillon, Emelin, and a rookie beaulieu splitting up Subban’s time adds up to the player Subban is.

        But everyone can have an opinion.

        • Loonie says:

          Subban at worst is the unquestioned #2 until Markov’s departure or retirement and is no worse than #1 after that unless things dramatically change.

          The idea of him being a role player is unbelievable.

          • krob1000 says:

            Maybe you missed the line that clearly states he is still the number 2 dman?? but his stats will not be what they were offensively and his minutes will be reduced.

        • krob1000 says:

          Subban was not great on the PP…. in fact he single handedly killed many. Markov is the one replacing him…and I think Diaz is a better comlment to Markov and more patient and will get more shots through along with Markov. I think PK would anchor the second unit myself. He would be down to a reasonable about 20-22 minutes a game and not always as tough minutes. I am not knocking PK but his stats last year were inflated due to injury and him having to play all those big minutes…he delivered..still managed to be a plus palyer on a crap team …..awesome. But that season will not be the norm…and if he signs based on what the realistic expectations are (him playing behind Markov) then the Habs have a very bright future.
          I am not sure what your knock against Beaulieu is but he is very much a top 2 dman projection still….
          You are not incluiding Markov in your last statement….but I guess everyone can have an opinion right

  62. krob1000 says:

    IF MB were forced into a trade sitaution…I would be calling the Colorado Avalanche up…..they have O’Reilly in a similar situation playing in the KHL, Hishon coming up and Duchene coming off of a bad year and Stastny nearing UFA status after next season. They have Duncan Siemens, Stefan Elliot and Tyson Barrie as top D prospects. Erik Johnson a former 1st overall who had two great seasons and then been very steady but not great since is signed at under 4 million per.
    Colorado would make an interseting trade partner…..

  63. jols101 says:

    Hahaha, now people that want PK to be traded don’t know hockey. I love PK and hope he signs for 6 years 30 million but that is the absolute max. If he is demanding 6 or 6.5 then trade his ass to the western conference. BTW, reading what some of you expect to get in return for PK is crazy. He won’t get you a star player, a 1st round pick and a top prospect. It would be a big name player straight up or a 1st round pick and top prospect but not all 3. The Habs aren’t trading Wayne Gretzky here just a good young dman that can log top minutes, throw heavy hits and help offensively. A real total package as far as young dmen are concerned but he is not a franchise player and just because we may love him it still doesn’t make it so.


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