Flyers make big move

Weber
Oh yeah, National Hockey League owners need contract concessions from the Players Association … for the good of the game, and all that.
The Philadelphia Flyers have signed Nashville Predators defenceman Shea Weber (Josh Gorges’ D partner with the Kelowna Rockets) to a $100 million offer sheet.
Weber would fill the vacancy on the Philadelphia blueline created by Chris Pronger’s injury and Matt Carle’s departure to Tampa Bay.

The story from Philadelphia.

The contract would cover 14 years … this while the NHL is seeking a five-year limit on contracts.

According to (Darren) Dreger, the deal may be structured in a way that would prevent a small-market club like Nashville from matching the offer, by way of $26 million in signing bonuses between now and July 1, 2013. That may be tough for Nashville to match, since they would be forking over nearly 16 percent of their entire franchise’s net worth ($163 million in 2011 according to Forbes magazine) in one calendar year.

Terry Jones of the Edmonton Sun on Twitter: I’ve seen coaches lose the dressing room. But I think we’re watching Gary Bettman lose the board room.

And Kevin Paul Dupont of the Boston Globe: First Suter. Now Weber. That ‘Predators’ tag is looking, well, a little bit ironic?

944 Comments

  1. ZepFan2 says:

    @habstrinifan

    “Heck we couldn’t even be bold and imaginative enough to land Robinson behind the bench”

    It takes two to tango and Robinson didn’t want to tango.

    ———————————————————————-
    “Them summer days, those summer days” – Sly Stone

    Hot fun in the Summertime

  2. HabsRepresente says:

    Everyone that has Twitter on this website needs to check out @HabsHockey91 He has gotten 100 followers in 2 days on twitter and has had shout outs from some of the top hockey insiders in the business. Everyone should give him a follow if you like reading about the Habs, you wont regret.

    • Kfourn says:

      I’ll pass

      _______________________________________________________
      Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

      “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

  3. This Guy says:

    Flyers are going to have fun trying to hold onto Hartnell, Giroux, B. Schenn, Couturier, Simmonds and Voracek in the next little while, not to mention finding better goaltending. Perhaps they’ll be able to reacquire some 1st round picks.

    • Kfourn says:

      I would love the habs to send an offer sheet to Giroux.

      _______________________________________________________
      Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

      “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

  4. HabFan in Edmonton says:

    The good news is, if Nashville doesn’t match, Montreal 2nd round pick from Nashville should be much higher next year.

  5. 123456 says:

    So is PK’s agent calling MB now and saying guess who gets the next offer sheet ? ? ? ?

    • ProHabs says:

      Probably, and it is likely coming from the Bruins.

    • habs03 says:

      He would say go ahead, lol

      Habs up there with the Flyers, Rangers Leafs in terms of making money. So they can match any contract. The Preds are a budget team.

      The only issue with matching Weber’s contract for the Preds, is the 27M that is paid to him in less than a year.

    • Cal says:

      PK was issued a qualifying offer precisely to avoid this mess.

      • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

        He can still sign an offer sheet. All a qualifying offer does is prevent the player from becoming a UFA past July 1. We retain his rights as an RFA. He can still sign with any other team, and we would have 7 days to match, just like Nashville.

        • Cal says:

          That’s the thing, though. PK would still have to sign the offer sheet. I don’t see that happening, unless some team like Nashville decides to replace Weber by offering him something BIG.

          • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

            I agree. I don’t see it happening. I’m just pointing out that it is still POSSIBLE, regardless of the qualifying offer being made or not.

      • habs03 says:

        QO offer doesn’t stop teams from making offer sheets. Its if the team decides to take a play to arbitration, the Habs did that with Price this year, it stops teams more making offersheets, and Nashville did that to Weber last year, and can’t do it agian.

      • PG_doesnt_stand_for_Pierre_Gauthier says:

        But he didn’t sign it… Does that still counts anyway?

        Markov to Subban, he scores!

  6. plum says:

    In the first round matchup between Detroit and Nashville, Shea Weber grabbed Henrik Zetterberg’s head and drove his face into the glass. It was at this moment that Paul Holmgren decided that Weber would be a perfect fit for the Philadelphia Flyers.

    • ProHabs says:

      LOL. Bergevin should have been thinking he would be a great Hab to. I would have loved to see Weber grab any Bruin by the back of the head and do the same thing.

      What a big statement Bergevin could have made by signing Weber. The days of pushing the Habs around are over. But he passed.

      • Kfourn says:

        How do you know he passed? for all we know Webber could have refused to sign the offer sheet.

        _______________________________________________________
        Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

        “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

  7. ProHabs says:

    The difference between Holmgren and Gauthier:

    -Holmgren:Our best defenceman Pronger is hurt and out for the year, possible career ending, lets go get the best defenceman out there in Weber to replace him.
    – Gauthier: Our best defenceman Markov is hurt and out for essentially the whole year, lets go get Kaberle to replace him.

    I wonder if Bergevin considered signing Weber. How excited would everyone have been this morning if they woke up to the headline:
    Shea Weber signs with the Canadiens.

    • Chorske says:

      Except that this is saddling Philly with a 14 year contract, a colossal cap hit, and basically no draft picks for the forseeable future. I don’t think ANY player is worth that, not even Weber. Also, I don’t think Philly really expects to get him, now that I think about it.

      I wouldnt have been excited. I would have thought: wow, the ignoramus section of HIO will LOVE this one. And apparently I wouldve been right.

      The FLyers are arseholes.

      • The Chicoutimi Cucumber says:

        We can all agree that the Flyers are arseholes. But they are able to do this because they have one of the very best records for drafting, and one of the very best stables of young talent in the game. Losing those 1st round picks will not hurt them. Montreal, on the other hand, is not in this position; we need those picks if we ever want to contend.

        The only thing that will stop Philly from doing this is having their own RFAs poached. In fact, I would LOVE to see two or three teams make a quiet pact among themselves to go out and tender big offers to different Pbhilly RFAs, ensuring that, even if Philly matched those offers, they’d then be crippled by cap problems. That would put a stop to this garbage.

        Finally: this deal will not hurt Philly in any way. Look at Pronger, that contract was supposed to be a millstone around their necks. All it did was get them to the Finals and then free them up to sign Weber.

        • Kfourn says:

          That would be called tampering and wouldn’t be allowed.

          _______________________________________________________
          Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

          “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

    • Cal says:

      Gauthier: no Stanley Cups as NHL executive.
      Holmgren: ditto.

  8. Captain aHab says:

    The Preds could promise the Flyers not to match in return for a sub sequent trade for players, i.e.:

    Flyers acquire Weber and send 4 1st rounders to Preds. In a second transaction, the Preds send the four picks back to Philly for roster players.

    —————-
    Me skull and crossbones arn’t the only thing I plan on raisin’ tonight.

    • Cardiac says:

      If you were the Flyers, what would you do? I just checked their roster and the oldest of their core players is Danny Briere at 34. Sacrificing their first round picks for the next four years is not really a significant issue.

      “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
      – Jerry Maguire

  9. Maksimir says:

    I just think it sucks Weber will be in Eastern Conf… I was hoping he’d go to San Jose or Detroit if traded.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Just be thankful they still have Bryzgalov! :)

      • Kfourn says:

        Pronger made Leighton into a playoff hero…Imagine what Webber will do for Bryzgalov (who IS a starting goaltender not and AHLer)

        _______________________________________________________
        Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

        “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

        • HabinBurlington says:

          I hear you, I am just holding out hope Bryz is still in another galaxy come playoff time.

          • Kfourn says:

            LOL hoping his five hole is “hummmangous big”

            _______________________________________________________
            Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

            “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

        • Cal says:

          Do you find it funny that the Flyers signed Leighton again, probably as an insurance policy?

  10. ProHabs says:

    I wish I was a Flyer fan. Holmgrin has put together a nice team there.

  11. KevinT says:

    After a little research, I can pretty much confirm that it will indeed be 4 first round picks…. the calculation is the total compensation divided by the LESSER of either the total # of years of the contract OR 5. So in this case, his average annual cap hit will be well over the $7.8 Million needed to make it to the 4 1st round picks…(see below – got it from thehockeywriters.com)

    http://thehockeywriters.com/2011-12-nhl-rfa-compensation-rules/

    Extract:
    After a player has signed an offer sheet and submits the necessary paperwork, his prior club has seven days to exercise its Right to First Refusal and match the terms of the offer sheet. There can be no conditions or contingencies in the offer sheet and a player cannot be traded once an offer sheet has been signed.

    If the prior club declines its Right to First Refusal, it will be entitled to draft pick compensation based on the annual annual value of the new deal. This is determined by dividing total compensation by the less of the number of years of the offer sheet, or five (this discourages long-term offer sheets in some cases).

    The criteria for RFA draft pick compensation in 2011-12 is as follows:

    $1,034,249 annual cap hit or less: No compensation
    $1,034,249 — $1,567,043: Third-round pick
    $1,567,043 — $3,134,088: Second-round pick
    $3,134,088 — $4,701,131: First and third-round pick
    $4,701,131 — $6,268,175: First, second and third-round pick
    $6,268,175 — $7,835,219: Two first-round picks, a second and third
    $7,835,219 and higher: Four first-round picks

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      So Nashville can’t even trade him!

      They really get screwed.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

      • Cal says:

        All they can do is insist to the league that this particular contract offer contravenes the inent and spirit of the CBA, which runs until the 15th of September.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          This is where I think Poile already used up his get out of jail free card. The league made the decision to allow Nashville to add a player to their roster after the trade deadline, and were allowed to have Radulov back. I know there was technicalities involved (Radulov bolted before the NHL/KHL had their agreement in place) but end of day the NHL gave Nashville a favourable decision which did not sit well with other owners.

          I think Bettman has a sleazy way of dealing with different owners and essentially it becomes a you scratch my back (Jacobs giving Bettman new contract) and I will scratch yours (Chara gets away with attempted murder, no suspension, cup granted to Boston).

          I am being somewhat tongue in cheek, but I do think Poile no longer has a favour coming his way, and Snider has more power and the contract is accepted.

  12. Cardiac says:

    I tired looking it up but I want to be sure… What are the penalties for operating under the salary cap floor? Fines? Loss of draft picks? Forfeiting of games?

    If Nashville loses Weber, they will be up a creek without a paddle.

    “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
    – Jerry Maguire

    • GrimJim says:

      I think what you are looking for is sec 26.14 (c). Operating under the cap floor is a Circumvention and circumventions are punishable by any or all of (a) Club fined between $1 mil and $5 mil (b) forfeit draft picks (c) forfeit games affected by the Circumvention (d) void a player contract (e) suspend any employee, player or agent involved (f) fines players between $250,000 and either the lesser of $1 mil or 25% of their salary plus ‘disgorging’ “any additional amounts by which the player has been unjustly enriched…”

  13. wjc says:

    Clay, I am a Montreal Canadiens fan. The Montreal Canadiens have players. I cheer for All players, because they are part of the MONTREAL CANADIENS.

    Now trashing two members of the team, Gomez, and Kabrele, in particular seems like a strange thing to do. I can see not being fond of a particular player, but to continually attack members of your favorite team just out of some kind of spite, seems wrong to me.

    These players are part of the team and giving them away is not an answer, dumping them for nothing is not an answer, buying them out is not an answer.

    You seem to think that Gomez in particular does not deserve another chance with a new coach, style and system. You do not seem to believe that Gomez was a consistent 60 70 point per year center.

    Some do not wish to acknowledge that he got 58 points his last year in New York and 59 points in his first year with Montreal.

    Some do not wish to acknowledge that he is a playmaker, NOT A GOAL SCORER normally. Although I think he got 32 goals one year.

    Some do not wish to acknowledge that he and Gionta created magic in New Jersey until they got seperated. The main reason Gionta signed with Montreal was to play again with Gomez. The main reason Gainey made the deal was to put those two back together.

    Many players have ran into pro longed slumps, injuries etc. that derailed them….hall of famers have hit walls….Beliveau, and Rocket Richard come to mind…believe it or not. There are many more.

    Some believe that Gomez and Kabrele can rectify their games. If they cannot under new coaching, new management then certainly something drastic will have to be done. Why not wait and see if the new coach and philosphy can rekindle Gomez.

    They would be nuts to throw to possibly useful players under the bus. If Bergevin did that I would be shocked and apalled.

    He was certainly asked during interview process as well as Therien how they would handle the Gomez situation. If he had of said…I’m going to dump them both…..they would have said…thanks for coming in…good luck in Chicago…… and good luck getting a coaching job.

    You guys/gals talk sometime about thinking outside the box and then come up emotional answers that aren’t answers.

    wjc

    • Timo says:

      Personally, I admire Gomez. If someone who sucks so bad can land a contract like he did… well… hats off for that guy.

    • Cardiac says:

      Gomez is a fraction of the player he used to be… face it.

      The “magic” he and Gionta was many, many moons ago. Their “magic” playoff runs were a decade ago.

      His production has declined since 2005-06. He had a career year that season (33g 51a 84pts) and has never and will never match that again.

      Sure he was a 60-70 point guy… five or six years ago. Unless he drinks from the Fountain of Selanne, I’m not interested.

      “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
      – Jerry Maguire

      • wjc says:

        Cardiac, 58 points 4 years ago….59 points 3 years ago. Okay not technically 60 points, but close.

        Okay you are not interested. Then don’t be interested, it is not your decision anyways.

        There’s genius everywhere, but until they declare their opinins as posters. it is like popcorn in the pan. Some pop…some don’t.

        wjc

  14. TomNickle says:

    Weber Signing…..

    For those who think that it’s too much money, too many draft picks and too much term. You’re only correct about the draft picks in my view. Shea Weber is the most well balanced defenseman in the NHL. He is an elite physical presence, powerplay presence, penalty killer and leader. He is elite in more areas than any other defenseman in the game.

    For those who are upset that Bergevin didn’t make such a move. First of all the player has to agree to an offer sheet so we don’t know if Bergevin offered one. Second, the Habs aren’t currently in a position to make such an offer from both a competitive standpoint and financial standpoint.

    This kind of offer is out of this World and if I were in Holmgren’s shoes I don’t know that I would have made the same offer. But having said that, in my mind he is unquestionably the best defenseman in the NHL and if any defenseman in the league deserves a ludicrous contract, it’s him.

    Side note: Pekka Rinne will be brought to Earth in the fall if the Predators don’t match.

    • arcosenate says:

      Tough day for the Preds, they’re having an Expos moment, watching their stars disappear. No way they can match and actually pay out that money in the first year. They should match and trade him.

      Get the 2 first rounders and a couple of players.

      They have to walk away with more than draft picks don’t they?

      • HabFanSince72 says:

        If they match and trade they still have to pay out the $12M bonus.


        Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • mksness says:

      i think rinne will be brought back down to earth with just suter leaving; weber as well will be tough. however, nashville has always played a strong defensive system, so maybe they’ll just adjust but hard to see them being in the mix for the playoffs next year.

  15. bwoar says:

    Remember that draft where Philly shelled out big-time, in a win-now move to get Chris Pronger? That worked out great for them, eh?

    Now they’re going all-in to replace him. This move guarantees them the Cup. Right?

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      I’d swap their roster for ours.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • mksness says:

      didn’t they make the finals with him one year and lost because they had an ahl goalie who let in one of the worst stanely cup winning goals ever?

      i would love to see montreal make a balls out move. But here, especially in HIO land, all of our D prospects are going to be better than weber:-)

      but hey we have sand paper on the 3rd and 4th lines now, so we’ll make the playoffs no problem…

  16. PrimeTime says:

    Fanatical Hab Bits always get upset when a big headline isn’t about their team! “Holmgren Rules”…….not.

    Once a Flyer ass, always a Flyer ass.

  17. BeeGee says:

    Interesting… this from Nick Kypreos (@RealKryper):
    If #Preds match Flyers offer, they must keep him 1 calendar yr before trying to trade him. Oh and pay him 27M in meantime.

    So if they match, they’re not trading him anytime soon.

    • mdp2011 says:

      Also, there will probably be a no-trade or no movement clause in his contract too. So if they do match, they are pretty much stuck with him for a while.

      • BeeGee says:

        He’s certainly one of the best players in the league, but these contracts are just ridiculous… I really don’t get the dynamic between GM’s and their owners right now… How can these guys sit in front of the PA with their demands while they approve 14 year 110MM deals…

        • mdp2011 says:

          I think player agent Allan Walsh sums it up best:

          “The 1 thing we know today; the new CBA is owner to owner issue. With revs booming, time for big markets+small markets to figure it out.”

          This is no longer an owner vs player CBA.

          • BeeGee says:

            Well, I had the impression Walsh was a bit of a douche, but that sounds about right.

        • The Chicoutimi Cucumber says:

          Everybody’s saying that, but the ‘owners’ are not one undifferentiated bloc. There are rich teams and poor teams, and the whole argument that the cap needs to drop, etc., makes perfect sense from the perspective of the dozen or so franchises that are losing money or scraping by. I guarantee you that the Phillys and TOs and NYRs are happy to rip the players off but, left to their own devices, would have no interest in going to the wall against the players.

          So that Philly made this offer has no real bearing on the question of how the bottom half of the league is doing. Heck, looked at from Nashville’s perspective, this is *exactly* an argument FOR a more constrained cap system. A lower cap and a narrower gap between cap ceiling and floor would protect teams like Nashville against this kind of predation.

          • BeeGee says:

            But in this case the league represents the owners in a negotiation against the players. You’d think the owners would get their shit together, make a deal amongst themselves and then present a unified front vs. the PA. That’s not the impression I’m getting at the moment.

          • mdp2011 says:

            yes, but that is not the NHLPA’s problem. If the NHL owners don’t know how to divide the ever increasing and record breaking pie amongst themselves, well that has nothing to do with the players.

          • BeeGee says:

            what he said

          • boing007 says:

            Didn’t know that they grow cucumbers in Chicoutimi.

            Richard R
            Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

        • wjc says:

          Bee Gee, not demands….proposals. It is the give and take of negotiations, a starting point…..repeat after me…..proposal. Not take it or leave it…DEMAND……no proposal…..this is what we are proposing…….respond with your counter proposal. This to work to a compromise.

          What if…..Nashville is not interested in long term contract worth multi millions. So they say psssst make an offer to him. We will take the 4 first round draft choices and not look bad….we will look like victims.

          Philadelphia gets the player they want…..Nashville gets to continue to build… and everyone is hap-hap….happy.

          wjc

      • habs03 says:

        I also said the same thing a few post below, but I’ve read that if the Preds match, they don’t have to honour any NTC that might have been given, pretty crazy, I don’t know the reasoning, but no way Preds trade him if they match and pay 27M in 1 year.

  18. HardHabits says:

    This only goes to show that the way to build a team is via the draft and the way to maximize profits is to trade players for picks and/or prospects.

    Trading prospects for players for a quick fix is THE mistake. It is why I am glad that the Gainey/Gauthier/Martin era and everything that preceded it is over.

    For those lambasting Bergevin for not doing anything the only thing I can say is you should go cheer for Dallas or Chicago. Bergevin is doing it right and I am pleased as punch that he hasn’t wallowed into the Free Agency fray to squander more futures on nothing now. Drafting, development and patience are the way to build a contender.

    At the end of the Gionta, Plekanec, and Markov contracts those players should be traded. No question about it. Trade them to a Cup contender for picks or prospects to continue the process of stocking the shelves and building organizational depth. That way if a really good player comes up in a possible trade it wouldn’t take a gutting to make the acquisition.

    As it stands the Habs should concentrate on having the kids compete for a Calder Cup so they can build their own identity and winning culture and have that attitude promoted when they make the big league.

    I know it doesn’t sound as sexy as Tanking™ but in the final analysis it is exactly what I meant when I invoked the Panzer.

    • Kfourn says:

      I agree

      _______________________________________________________
      Well, he’s kind of had it in for me ever since I accidentally ran over his dog. Actually, replace “accidentally” with “repeatedly” and replace “dog” with “son.”

      “It’s sad when our rookies have no NHL experience before they jump up to the NHL.” – nunacanadien

    • shiram says:

      I prefer a rational approach to players/picks and prospects over aiming for the bottom rankings.

    • GrimJim says:

      I think you are being overly simplistic in your assessment. Every Cup winning team has had significant contribution from both home-drafted players and free agent or traded players. LA had Williams and Kopitar AND Richards and Carter ; Boston had Lucic and Bergeron AND Chara and Horton ; Chicago had Kane and Toews AND Campbell and Hossa. A well constructed team has a balance of both, not relying solely on one pathway alone as you have been advocating.

      • jedimyrmidon says:

        I think he is saying that at the Habs’ current stage, they are not in a position to trade for players such as Weber or sign them to offer sheets and sacrifice picks. Perhaps a few years down the road. Trying to acquire such players for picks when you have little in terms of prospect depth will get you into the playoffs, but will probably not get you to the Cup unless you have a strong group of talented young players in addition tot the Big Acquisitions.

      • HardHabits says:

        I agree with what you’re saying and it doesn’t go contrary to what I said. ;-)

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      Trading prospects for players is how LA (Carter, Richards), Chicago (Hossa), and several other teams put themselves over the top to win or challenge for the cup.

      The recipe is to build a contender through the draft, but add those one or two key pieces when you get close.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • JUST ME says:

      I agree with your way of seeing things basically but you cannot compete with only veterans or only draft picks. You need a mix of both. It would be impossible to make it with only youngsters on defense or in goals,you need experience .
      Also since Rome wasn`t built in 7 days you cannot also go all in and trade the core of your team even if the future looks promising. Ask the Edmonton Oilers how they feel.

      I think that no Habs veterans in the roster right now should consider his job as safe and yes i hope that they follow the new trend they took in the past few months in building a strong farm team system. What is positive in the situation is that not only can we expect talent to graduate in maybe a year but also in two years,in three years. This is the way to go and for that you have to continue to feed your farm team.

  19. habs11s says:

    The Habs better get working on the 20 year 200 million contract that Alex Galchenyuk will get after his 3 years at entry level… These contracts are getting ridiculous…
    _____________________________________________________________

    “How would you like a job where when you made a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?” -Jacques Plante

  20. cunningdave says:

    At first glance this looks like a big screw for Nashville… but actually, it’s an amazing turn of events for them. Weber probably wouldn’t have signed with them, but they still hold his rights. So Weber, Philly and Weber’s agent are betting that Nashville won’t match, but they could match and acquire Weber’s rights for the next 14 years!

    Nashville now has the choice of taking a lot of high draft picks (possibly 4 1st rounders) or sign their best player for 14 years. Yesterday, they were 1 year away from losing their best player for nothing.

    • habs03 says:

      The contract is made that Weber gets paid 28M in less than a year, thats probably 1/8th of net worth of the Nashville team as a whole. And they can’t trade him if they match the offer.

      Ed Snider is a BOSS

      Man doesn’t give a damn, toss money left right, trades them etc. lol

  21. Ghosts of the Forum says:

    Wonder what you’d have to send back in compensation to sign Voracek to an offer sheet. With this news, and Philly reportedly going after Nash, I can’t see them matching even a fairly reasonable offer sheet to Voracek.

    Not saying I want to give up a first rounder or anything, but he’s a big winger who can score. Risky…but worth at least entertaining the idea?

    • arcosenate says:

      He’d give Plekanec a winger he could play with.

    • Chris says:

      I would sign Voracek if I felt very confident that my team wouldn’t finish bottom three, even if it cost me that first-rounder.

      Voracek is a heck of a hockey player. He is a year younger than Max Pacioretty and already has three seasons of 45+ points under his belt.

      He’s not particularly physical despite his frame, but he is ridiculously skilled and has great speed. Throw in that he produced nearly 50 points despite spending much of the first half of the season with Maxime Talbot and one of Sean Couturier or Danny Briere. Over the last couple of months of the season and into the playoffs, Voracek took a big step forwards while paired with Briere and Wayne Simmonds, giving the Flyers a second powerful offensive line.

      I would be loathe to give up Pacioretty for a first-rounder. Similarly, a first-rounder for Voracek would be a pretty good trade. A first round pick represents the hope of an NHL player. Voracek (a 7th overall pick himself) has already proven that he is going to be a good NHL player, with potential to be a star.

    • jmsheehy19 says:

      I’d love to offer sheet him at 3.13 cap hit. Giving up a second rounder would be worth it.

      That would give Eller a winger with some offensive potential (either Voracek or Bourque).

    • coutNY says:

      It would be nice, but I do not think the HABS are in position to make the move since we have about 6 million in space and PK still neding to sign. An arguement can be made we could reduce that cap number by HOPEFULLY getting Gomez off the books, through CBA stipulations in the new agreement, miracle trade, putting him in the AHL, or even as last resort buyout but this has not been pursued as of yet. Philly, despite if they land Weber $7.5 million hit, would be in position to match the sheet because I would assume they have determined Pronger is LTIR which will free up 5 million in space as replacement money which leaves them somewhere around 8 million left in cap room. I believe they would match anything reasonable the Habs would offer. Albeit this does not consider Philly needing to think about their future resigns.

  22. PrimeTime says:

    I wonder how the Holmgren admirers would feel if our GM had signed long term deals with 2 players, traded them the following year, and the same same players went on to win a Stanley Cup, while the newest long term signing sucked in goal. Now he wants to blow the bank on 1 player when the percentage of revenues for player compensation will likely decrease in the next CBA. I believe this is the mind of an addict/alcoholic/ gambler who never seems to realize why they end up on the losing end of the stick but the ride is too enjoyable.

    • Habfan10912 says:

      It does smell of a win now move but the Flyer team is desperate to replace Pronger. Probably for him its worth the risk.

      ———————————–

    • habs11s says:

      Sometimes the best move is making no moves at all…

      _____________________________________________________________

      “How would you like a job where when you made a mistake, a big red light goes on and 18,000 people boo?” -Jacques Plante

  23. HabinBurlington says:

    Here is a good description of the RFA Compensation. BeeGee, thanks for clarifying the 4 1st round picks, I had read others explain it as 2 1sts and 2nd and 3rd, and assumed that was correct.

    In reading the explanation of the compensation you are indeed correct about the 5 years divisible rule, which is specifically in the contract to avoid long term contracts from bypassing compensation.

    http://thehockeywriters.com/2011-12-nhl-rfa-compensation-rules/

  24. habstrinifan says:

    Do not read| Bypass! Just me in freaking shitty mood.

    So fans left right and centre around the league are in badass discussion re players like Weber and Suter and Parise.

    And in Mtl we wonder which player we could bring in to be our 14th 4th line candidate. Freakin Glorious times are here.

    Heck we couldnt even be bold and imaginative enough to land Robinson behind the bench.

    But oh yeah.. we gotta that new Tower thing going.

    Think I’ll bring along Durant’s History of the World to the Summit and sit in the freakin corner wiping beer stains off my shirt…. especially since I think it could well be a P.K less team on the ice.

    Freakin Glorious times. Your responses are duly canned. I told you to bypass.

  25. Bill says:

    While this signing doesn’t help the owners’ PR, it does demonstrate how hard it is for the small-market teams to compete with the big-market teams. Not that I really care.

    There shouldn’t be a team in Nashville to begin with. It’s a joke. If Holmgren were offer-sheeting PK, I’d be irritated, but who cares about Nashville? Think anyone in Nashville is going, “Wow, Holmgren, you jerk”? No.

    Holmgren is screwing his team over with this monstrous contract anyway. They’ll be choking on it within five years.

    Full Breezer 4 Life

    • jmsheehy19 says:

      Nashville actually has a pretty good base of fans. They know the game better than you’d think and the team’s popularity continues to grow.

      I agree the league over expanded in the south, but Nashville is not one of those teams on the way down.

      • Cardiac says:

        It helps that the team has put a consistently good product on the ice. They have missed the playoffs only once since the lockout and have put up four 100+ point seasons in the same span… despite being in the same division as Detroit, Chicago and St. Louis…

        *Edit* Look how popular hockey was in Dallas when the Stars had a good team and won the Cup.

        “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
        – Jerry Maguire

      • HabFanSince72 says:

        The problem is a pretty good fan base isn’t enough.


        Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • bleedhabs81 says:

      I am sure there are a handful of displaced Canadians who, unlike us, have dismissed their favorite Canadian team and now follow the Preds because they moved to Nashville… they might care…. maybe (although, they did dismiss their childhood team… so how harcore can they be)

      I was going to move to Nashville until that stupid Mike Fisher stole Carrie away (fist pump in anger).

  26. HabFanSince72 says:

    The Flyers could just wait one year and make the same offer to Weber and not have to give up four first rounders.


    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • shiram says:

      Someone else could have sent an offer sheet, some were reporting the Canucks might have went the offer sheet way. Besides the calm and rational way is not Holmgren’s way.

    • BeeGee says:

      Well, then they’d compete with 29 other clubs. And you’d have to think all involved are betting deals like this won’t be possible under the next CBA…

      • HabFanSince72 says:

        No they would compete with 3 or 4 other clubs at most. There would be few clubs that he would want to play for AND had the finances and cap space to sign him.


        Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

        • BeeGee says:

          Agreed he wouldn’t want to play for most clubs, but I think many NHL teams would pay the price, especially if the new CBA is more favorable to owners…

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Pittsburgh and another team were rumoured to be in heavy trade talks with Nashville. This was Philly’s pre-emptive strike to either land Weber or keep him from going to a competitor.

      • Cal says:

        Actually, this was Weber’s preemptive strike. He didn’t have to sign the offer sheet, but he did. He did the right move for his bank account, displaying yet again that it’s all about the money and nothing else.

    • Jordio-oh says:

      It wouldn’t be four first round picks.

      Current average salary has to exceed $7,835,220 in order to equate to four first round picks.

      Weber is slated to make, on average, $7,142,857 and so Philly would give up two first round picks, a second and a third.

      • GrimJim says:

        The compensation is determined by dividing by the lesser of the number of years of the offer sheet or five, according to CBA sec 10.4, so it’s over the 7.8 mil threshold

  27. Bripro says:

    Can someone help me make the distinction?
    He has signed an offer sheet. Should that not have meant that he’s a RFA?
    I thought he was an UFA?
    And who thinks the Preds will/won’t match it?
    Since they’re well below the cap floor, I don’t think they have a choice, do they? Especially given that he’s their franchise player.
    Whether they can afford a ridiculous contract like this or not, they don’t have much choice.
    Unless of course Buttman vetoes the deal….highly unlikely given the Wilds’ contracts, which have gone unanswered.

    • BeeGee says:

      He was RFA… IMHO this is Nashville’s best chance of keeping Weber.

    • mdp2011 says:

      He is RFA, one year away from being UFA. The Preds are in a tough spot, it is a lot of money for them, but they really can’t afford not to sign him. They could upset their fan base big time if they don’t match with already losing Suter. I love what Philly did, more teams should be doing this, and teams should have done it last summer with Stamkos.

  28. Habitforming says:

    Holmgren and Snyder should both be fined (for making it $26M in the first year as a signing bonus, knowing Nash can’t compete), and the offer should be deemed circumventing the spirit of the rule and award Nashville with 4 fist rounders if not matched.

    Then take Snyder out back and whip him with a rubber hose for doing this during the first week of negotiations with the NHLPA. I mean seriously, what was he thinking with this timing?

  29. jon514 says:

    For people who are saying 4 1st rounders is not worth Shea Weber. Shea Weber is my fav defenseman, but when I think about what a 1st round pick can land you even in the bottom 15 (Patches, Beaulieu, Tinordi) I think Nashville could use this to build a perennial contender.

    “This Team is Less than the sum of it’s parts while Gomez is one of those parts.”

    • BeeGee says:

      I think I’d take a bonafide superstar like Weber vs. guys that have good but relatively unproven potential like Patches, Beaulieu, Tinordi… But this deal is better for Philly than Montreal since they already have a lot of good young players.

      • jon514 says:

        Thanks for the source below btw.

        I sort of agree with you, and I don’t like that they are able to put Nashville in this position mostly because they know Nashville doesn’t have the cash to cover the signing bonus.

        Still with the loss of Weber and Suter, there’s a good chance Nashville lands one of the top 5 guys in next year’s draft. It really sucks for the fans who will only be watching half a team next year, but in 3 or 4 years, Nashville will be back in force.

        “This Team is Less than the sum of it’s parts while Gomez is one of those parts.”

      • boing007 says:

        I wouldn’t trade Patches, Tinordi and Beaulieu for Weber.
        But I might trade Kaberle, Diaz/Weber and Gomez for Weber.
        Richard R
        Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

    • jmsheehy19 says:

      The issue is picks aren’t guaranteed, especially out of the top ten. If he were traded for four high end prospects that would be different, but if you get 4 picks in the 15-30 range, you’d be lucky if two develop into high end players.

  30. habsavvy says:

    everyone knows Holmgren is a piece of s$%^&.
    but 1 thing I can say about him, is that he’s the most proactive GM in the history of the NHL, and honestly I wish our GM was more like him, instead of falling asleep at the switch.
    we’ve already lost out on several big names, and here’s another.
    habs are in desperate need of a top 4 dman, just like Weber.

    what a splash MB would make, if he got a star dman or scorer.

    I’m afraid MB is no better than Gauthier and this team will flounder just like last year.
    it takes balls to do the type of deals Holmgren does, and our GM just doesn’t have it.

    Philly hasn’t won a cup, but every year they’re in it, and always an exciting team.

    • stevieboy says:

      Very not savvy, despite your name.

      MB is rebuilding a crappy team and doing a great job of it, we will have a competetive team this year that wont go all the way. Why the hell should he blow one hundred mil on a bad contract that wont bring him a cup anyhow?
      You want splash, go to Hollywood.
      Im glad hes the GM and not you.

      Stevie

      • boing007 says:

        @stevieboy
        You want splash, go to Hollywood.

        Or Marineland. Lots of splashing there.

        Richard R
        Price is an oyster. Unfortunately not all oysters produce pearls.

    • ProHabs says:

      Gauthier didn’t have any imagination to do something like this. Lets give Bergevin a chance here.

    • shiram says:

      While I’m not one that thinks everyting Bergevin touches turns to gold, it’s still too early to dismiss him.

    • 123456 says:

      unfortunately i have to agree – some of hte philly contracts have been crazy bu tlook at some of their cap hits:

      bryzgalov 5.6
      pringer 4.9
      timmonen 6.3
      and briere is hte only forward with a hit of over 4.2 . . .

      so crazy – yes, smart…. IDK long term can backfire
      but aggressive and turned the team around fast

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      Gainey was proactive 3 years ago. Turned over essentially two thirds of the team in 3 days.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

    • ont fan says:

      habssavvy…that’s a good one. I needed a chuckle today. You been living in a cave? Who exactly did we miss out on who wanted to come here? Where were you a couple of years ago? Holmgren could be the next Sather.

  31. jon514 says:

    Is it really 4 1st round picks? Can someone please include a link to this rule?

    “This Team is Less than the sum of it’s parts while Gomez is one of those parts.”

  32. BeeGee says:

    Don’t know if this was said yet, but it is 4 1st rounders not 2 1sts, a 3rd and a 4th… For the compensation total, they divide 5 years (not 14) into total value (about $110M).

    • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

      Exactly. Even so, I would give the next 4 year’s 1st rounders if I was Philly. With the core they have, there is no way they pick higher than 15 at any point, and it is more likely they pick lower than that in at least two of those years. While you could still get some good players, it’s too uncertain. Weber is young and is a STUD D-man. Easy deal to make.

      If Nashville doesn’t match, they likely work out a deal to get a couple of players plus a couple of picks from Philly instead.

      • BeeGee says:

        I guess I agree with you. But 4 1st rounders is not as obvious a deal as previously thought.
        Not sure I understand what you mean. If the Preds don’t match, they loose Weber and get compensatory picks. End of story.

    • jon514 says:

      Can you please post a link?

      “This Team is Less than the sum of it’s parts while Gomez is one of those parts.”

  33. Chris says:

    Lost in the boldness of Holmgren is whether signing Weber for that kind of term. The consensus seems to be that he is worth it, a 27 year old in his prime as arguably the best defenceman in the game. I’m not so sure.

    When you look around at all these long-term mega-contracts, history really isn’t on the side of the GM’s offering them:

    Rick DiPietro’s career has been derailed by injuries.

    Alexander Ovechkin was the best player in hockey when he signed his own mega-deal in January 2008. He was in the last season of his entry-level deal, and he ended up averaging 54 goals and 103 points in his first three seasons. In the first couple of years of his new deal, things seemed to be progressing (averaged 53 goals and 109 points). But then the wheels have fallen off…the last two seasons have seen him average 35 goals and 75 points. Still good numbers in today’s NHL, but not anywhere close to what you would expect for a guy just entering his prime.

    Jeff Carter has been traded twice and now has serious character issues dogging him along with declining production.

    Ilya Kovalchuk has averaged 34 goals and 71 points in the first two years of his new deal after averaging 42 goals and 80 points over the previous 8 seasons.

    Henrik Zetterberg has averaged 23 goals and 73 points in the first three years of his 10 year contract after averaging 36 goals and 79 points in four seasons (despite missing 36 games over those four years).

    Roberto Luongo is a basketcase out in Vancouver, who desperately want to get out from under his deal, but can’t find many takers.

    If Luongo is a basketcase, Ilya Bryzgalov is a space cadet in Philadelphia.

    Rick Nash is trade bait for Columbus, but they again can’t find teams with sufficient room willing to give them what they deem to be fair value for their only star player, a guy who has averaged 31 goals and 60 points on his current deal. Not exactly world-beating numbers (but then again, he never was as good as his reputation).

    Duncan Keith was a Norris Trophy winner but his production has been going the wrong way the past couple of seasons and his PP quarterback skills are coming into question as the Black Hawks struggle despite excellent talent.

    Mike Richards was traded and is a second/third line centre for Los Angeles behind Kopitar.

    Vincent Lecavalier averaged 39 goals and 85 points in his previous four year deal, a time over which he missed 8 games due to injuries. He has become a shadow of that player, however, averaging 25 goals and 60 points while missing 40 games. Anybody think that Tampa Bay wishes they had a mulligan on that one?

    Brian Campbell and Christian Ehrhoff haven’t really lived up to their 8 and 10 year deals, respectively. Daniel Briere has been up and down throughout his 8 year deal.

    And then there is he-who-shall-not-be-named.

    These long term deals really haven’t worked out the way the teams signing the players probably hoped they would. And it seems to be the same teams doing these deals.

    Philadelphia has signed Carter, Richards, Bryzgalov, Pronger, Briere and now Weber to long contracts.

    Detroit has signed Zetterberg and Franzen to ludicrously long contracts.

    The Rangers are guilty for deals to Gomez, Drury, Redden and Richards.

    Chicago signed Hossa (who has missed 43 games in three seasons and now has to recover from a major concussion), Keith and Campbell to long deals. Toews is almost certainly next, barring a cap on contract term in the next CBA.

    • HabFanSince72 says:

      On the other hand most of those teams are doing well.

      Keith, Campbell, Hossa, Carter and Richards all helped their teams win the cup.

      Luongo led his team to one game of the final and back to back President’s trophies.

      Zatterberg and Datsyuk also led the Wings to the 7th game of the finals after signing their big deals.

      Briere and Pronger similarly took the Flyers to the finals.


      Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

      • Cardiac says:

        Also, despite the drop in offensive stats, Kovalchuk is not anywhere near the defensive liability he once was earlier in his career.

        “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
        – Jerry Maguire

      • Chris says:

        Good point regarding team success. I would throw up the caveat that those teams are doing well often in spite of themselves.

        New York was fortunate to divest itself of Gomez’s deal, while Redden is buried.

        Detroit is heading for a big-time fall in the short-term as they weren’t able to replace the losses of Rafalski, Lidstrom and Stuart over the past couple of years, while their forwards are getting very long in the tooth.

        Chicago got into salary cap one year after winning the Stanley Cup and lost some good players for peanuts and ended up almost missing the playoffs the following season. I would also point out that both Keith was signed to his mega-deal the year after they won the Stanley Cup, but your point stands with Hossa and Campbell.

        Only the rich teams can pull this strategy off, because they are the ones that often have to eat salary over the long term. And historically, those rich teams have always been the most likely contenders year-over-year.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Couldn’t agree more Chris! I think Philly reaps the benefits for years 1-3 then I think big dropoffs occur. The notion of knowing you will never need to prove yourself again in order to be paid is a risky gamble.

      There is nothing about Weber’s attitude which suggests he loses motivation, but human nature is what it is.

      Good Post.

    • bleedhabs81 says:

      Solids points made by both Chris and Habsfan.

      I think Habsfan is right regarding short term success… but Chris is absolutely correct that these monster contracts almost never work out well for both the player or the team over the long term.

      A few years ago, I would have said Crosby was the only sure fire long term contract… I think the Pens might end up eating a lot of that 12 year deal

  34. HFX-HabFan says:

    As per Twitter

    #Preds Weber offer sheet from #Flyers. 1st 4 yrs 1M salary+13M sb; yrs 5-6 4M sal+ 8Msb; yrs 7-10 6M sal; year 11 3M sal; last 3 yrs 1M sal

    • habstrinifan says:

      Thanks… obvious obfuscation to obviate the 1st rnd picks compensation. An easy enough wrinkle for Bettman to straighten. I think he will do so with support of vast majority of owners. Least I hope so.

      • Bripro says:

        I doubt it, trini. He didn’t do a thing regarding the Suter and Parise signings. I don’t see where he’ll act differently now.
        Which will give the NHLPA more ammunition.
        Those owners really aren’t too bright, are they?
        How did they manage to amass such fortunes?

  35. HFX-HabFan says:

    Gutsy move by Holmgren, but a well-calculated risk. In theory, adding Weber means that even if Philly has to give up four first rounders (which I don’t think they do), they’ll be at worst low-20s picks.

    On the other side of the fence, if any team can stand to lose both Suter and Weber in the same off-season, it’s Nashville. They’ve previously withstood the losses of Hamhuis, Timonen, Zidlicky, etc. Kevin Klein is emerging as one of the most underrated D in the league, Ryan Ellis can easily replace Weber’s PP minutes, and Jonathan Blum was one of my pre-season favourites for the Calder last year, though he spent much of the season in the AHL.

    And, if Weber walks, that puts the Preds that much further below the cap floor, making the Gomez contract much more enticing, no?

    • Cardiac says:

      Not that we would get much in return for Gomer…

      “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
      – Jerry Maguire

    • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

      LOL…no team can “withstand the loss of Weber and Suter in the same offseason”. If Nashville doesn’t match and doesn’t make a trade with Philly, they will get an additional 1st-round pick in each of the next 4 seasons. It does nothing for them next season. They would miss the playoffs.

      Ellis is still unproven and Weber and Suter were the best pairing in the league. You don’t replace that.

      • HabFanSince72 says:

        I’m not sure they can match.

        They would have to pay him the $13M signing bonus right away, with the season possibly canceled or delayed, that might be unfeasible for them.


        Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

      • HFX-HabFan says:

        I like how in what you put in quotes, you misquoted me.

  36. Brinkley says:

    Some things never change.

    Holmgen was a cheap-shot scum bag as a player and he apparently hasn’t changed despite wearing the GM’s hat.

    I believe there is an unwritten rule……don’t go after another teams RFAs – players hit UFA status too early as it is!

    Hope Weber turns it down and Holmgren gets ostracized by the rest of the GM fraternity.

    GO Habs!

    • shiram says:

      Weber already accepted it, it’s up to Nasville to match or not.

    • habstrinifan says:

      Geez!

    • mdp2011 says:

      Bull!!!! It is in the CBA, nothing wrong with what he did, more GMs should be doing it.

    • Luke says:

      “I believe there is an unwritten rule……don’t go after another teams RFAs – players hit UFA status too early as it is!”

      Hey, if the hockey community (reporters/fans/players etc) are going to crap on players for unispired play (Semin, AK46 etc) shouldn’t they crap on the GMs too?

      Holmgren is using a tool available to him. If “you” don’t like him targeting RFAs, then “you” shouldn’t complain when AK46 doesn’t hustle on the back check.

      In fact, more GMs should do it. At least Holmgren is proving to his team, fans & owner that he is willing to do whatever it takes to win.

      PK must be a very happy RFA right now… ballpark the start at about 5.5m, 5 years?

    • Chris says:

      There is no unwritten rule, except for morons like Brian Burke who wish there was.

      Scott Stevens, Brendan Shanahan, Thomas Vanek, Ryan Kesler…all are high profile players that have been signed to offer sheets. In some cases (Vanek, Kesler), the team matches but is forced into paying a higher salary than they would have liked. In others, the team lets the player go and takes compensation.

      As others have said, this is a tool in the CBA that smart GM’s should use more often. You can either poach a very good player or force a team into burning more cap space than they would like. Either result is a victory if you are a rival GM trying to win the Stanley Cup.

  37. PrimeTime says:

    Once a Flyer, always a Flyer! Holmgren is an ass….in the mold of Snyder himself. I can’t see Bettman allowing this contract offer to be acceptable in the “best interest of the league” based on his 1st proposal in the CBA negotiations which is to protect the smaller market teams. Flyers are trying to make a last ditch effort to take advantage of the current CBA. We’ll see who has more leverage…….I bet Fehr is just hoping Snyder gets his way!

  38. kempie says:

    I wonder if Donald Fehr has stopped laughing yet. 5 years term limit? Save us from ourselves? Gotta hand it to Paul Homegrown though. Not exactly a stand pat kind of guy is he? Dude has one itchy trigger finger.

  39. Mattyleg says:

    Morning peeps,
    Might just be me, but I can’t imagine that the owners would lock the players out again.
    On top of the fact that EVERYONE loses incredible amounts of money when this happens, it would also create a precedent that every time that the CBA went up for discussion, the owners would do this, and actual negotiations would become a farce.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • Habfan10912 says:

      Good morning to you as well Matty. I could not agree with you any more. I think we will have a better idea after this weeks negotiations are concluded.

      ———————————–

  40. naweed235 says:

    Say what you will about the flyers but you gotta admit they have the most exciting GM in the league. I mean the guy has balls of steel and is never afraid to make the big moves.

    • Propwash says:

      Big moves and smart moves are two different waves in two different oceans.

      _____________________________
      “Access Forbidden” gettin’ ya down?
      Hold down Shift while clicking refresh.

      • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

        And which ones weren’t smart? I would do the Richards and Carter trades any day of the week from Philly’s perspective, even though LA won the Cup. Philly didn’t lose anything in talent, they got younger and they cleared cap space to sign a goalie. Now, you can disagree with the contract he gave Bryzgalov, but he was a legit goalie. Bit of a space cadet, and it hasn’t worked out, but he’s still the best goalie they’ve had in ages.

        • Kooch7800 says:

          The goalie is the biggest blunder in my opinion. Huge contract now on a crap goalie.

          • habstrinifan says:

            Holmgren needs to play it safer as a GM. Like spend 7 mill here and 5 mill there and 5 mill over there on safe bets … say like Gomez Kaberle and Bourque.

          • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

            Well, Bryz certainly didn’t have a good first year with them, but I think it’s a little early to write him off. He was great in Phoenix. It’s still a horrible contract, but if the owner is willing to pay it, and Bryz finds his game again, it’s a good move for Philly. Would you rather have Leighton or Bryzgalov?

          • Kooch7800 says:

            3.3 mill per season for bourque….Kabrele 4.25

            Gomez is actually a cap hit of 7.3

        • Cal says:

          Trading away 2 important cogs to a Cup win after he signed both to long term deals displays Holmgren’s poor judgment. Another is the signing of head case Bryzgalov.
          The object is to win the Cup, so LA has thus far won the deal for Richards. Leighton got the Flyers to the Finals, so which goalie is better under pressure?
          Holmgren has built a decent team that should contend. Watching them in the playoffs this past season showed me a team with little or no discipline and a propensity to playing poor defense.

          • Clay says:

            That’s as much – or more – on the coach rather than the players though. (Not the goalie part, but the “little or no discipline and a propensity to playing poor defense” part).

            __________________________
            ☞ The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. ~ Richard Feynman ☜

      • naweed235 says:

        don’t you think getting arguably the best young D-man in the game for 4 potentially low 1st round picks worth it? I sure do… Heck I would give up 4 more on top of that… figure of speech ofcourse…

        • Propwash says:

          For the money that they want to pay him? They could use that type of cash to sign several players and address other issues the team has.

          _____________________________
          “Access Forbidden” gettin’ ya down?
          Hold down Shift while clicking refresh.

          • naweed235 says:

            well as it stands right now, they have probably the deepest line up of talented forwards… With Weber added their D is also amongst the best in the league… Their goalie situation is a bit iffy but you never know… Bryz is a talented goalie… for all we know he might have had an off year…
            I think if this goes through, the flyers will be serious contenders for atleast the next 5 years…

          • habstrinifan says:

            Exactly.. like Habs did.

    • Ian Cobb says:

      With someone else’s money that will never be paid. Big balls no brains.!

    • habstrinifan says:

      There you go naweed. First man to use the word for today. Excitement! That’s what we need in this f””ing town. Well in Mtl LOL.

      That is what the F sports is all about. outrageous spectacular things done by boys playing games….owners and players.

  41. Ian Cobb says:

    Montrealhockeytalk.com
    (you knew this was going to happen!)

    That P.K and Plekanec are involved in a potential trade with Chicago that would bring Kane and Hjalmarsson to Montreal!

  42. shiram says:

    Apparently in the case of a salary rollback, signing bonuses are protected, another interesting tidbit in this morning of offer sheet.

  43. chelseafan says:

    My idea, for contracts, has long been that no one year of the contract may be more than 20% less (in dollars) than any other. This would allow players to still earn big money and sign long term deals while preventing circumvention and not forcing teams (like Nashville- for example) to have to fork out 16% of its franchise value in one yea (to one player!!).
    I thought offer sheets were taboo…

  44. SmartDog says:

    The NHL rules are full of loopholes. Just sign a guy for a ridiculous number of years, both of you knowing he won’t live out the full term, and the cap hit drops letting you give up less to get him. It’s amazing how even a bunch of overpaid suits can’t look at the rules and say this one can be fixed by adding this clause, this one by adding these limits, etc. These things always seem to come as a surprise as if they’ve discovered a new species of human hiding in the Amazon. Like “teams have found a clever way around this by…” Clever my ass. Teams have found some really obvious ways to bend the rules in their favor is more like it.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Perhaps the reality is that the league being run by Rangers/Bruins/Flyers etc… want the loopholes, since the big market teams are the ones exploiting the loopholes most often.

      • Cal says:

        Can you say “Same old sh!t, different pile”?
        I was never in favour of teams trying to buy their championships (hello Dolan and Leonsis), but if they all agreed to parity they should at least try to restrain themselves a little. I think they mistook parity for parody, because that’s what the NHL has become: a joke of a league.

    • wjc says:

      The game on the ice, is not the only game.

      wjc

  45. shiram says:

    Well looking at the Preds without Weber, maybe they’d take one of Weber/Diaz/Kaberle? Not to mention that they are far from the cap floor…

    • 123456 says:

      kaberle and gomez for a bag of used pucks

      • wjc says:

        And you call yourself a Canadiens fan.

        wjc

        • Clay says:

          Since you avoided the question last time, and the new thread opened, I will ask you again (please keep in mind this is not meant as an insult, but as a serious question):
          What exactly is your relationship to Gomez? Parent? Brother? Sister? Cousin? Lover?
          I’m thinking the latter by the way you suck his **** in every post (this may come across as rude, but again, it’s just my guess given the options available).

          __________________________
          ☞ The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. ~ Richard Feynman ☜

          • 123456 says:

            I am a fan, and I think Kabarle and GOmez are good players….but I also think their cap hits are not proportional to what they bring to the team. I would prefer they be gone and we have $11M in cap space……. Think of it this way, Gomez and S. Weber will both have a cap hit of slightly more than $7.5M, which would you prefer?????

      • SmartDog says:

        Throw in Youpi

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

  46. kempie says:

    OMFG. I don’t know what else to say.

  47. shiram says:

    Flyers right now have $7,806,627 of cap space, if this is offer sheet is not matched, they’ll have to move someone.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Shiram, that is with Pronger still counting though. Once he is placed on LTIR they get almost 5 mill allowances to exceed the cap.

      • shiram says:

        Even on a 35+ contract?
        edit : searches seems to indicate so, but Pronger retiring would screw the Flyers over.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          Yup.

          Edit: Oh yah if Pronger retires, that screws the Flyers over. Somehow I am sure Snyder/Holmgren have had a chat with Pronger making sure he doesn’t do that. Perhaps Snyder gives Pronger the same deal he gave Bobby Clarke years ago, which was essentially a guaranteed job for life with the team when his playing days are over.

  48. habstrinifan says:

    I think it would be worse for the League and the game eventually if Nashville matches the offer and then finds a trading partner (other than Philly) for Weber. It would then be seen as de rigeur operations. Three teams having inked a player for that price if only on paper for two of them.

    As it stands now it is an anomaly. An Oakland Seals Findlay kind of anomaly. And the compensation does in fact imply that, almost takes it to ‘slap on the wrist’ level. 4 1ST rnd picks.

    It would also be problematical for the league if the commissioner rejects it.

    Take the picks, call a press conference, paint a rosy draft picture and move on.

    When you assess the ultimate winner, unless Philly wins 2 cups with Weber, it could well be Nahville. I mean they had already lost Suter. They were in a battle to keep Weber. A trade would not have returned 4 1st rnd picks. Their team was in a rebuild already.

    This gives them publicity and a rallying cry to spin for the fans.

    I dont think fans in Nashville are star crazy when it comes to their support of hockey. The team and interest/love for the game trump any current player on their roster. As hockey becomes more entrenched, idenification with individual ‘stars’ will but it isnt yet. I mean people werent walking around Nashville talking about Weber’s fantastic play last year.
    Weber was a great asset, but he wasnt ‘dynamite’ on the ice. Go out and find ‘dynamite’ with your picks And sell that process and acquisition.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      As the contract currently sits, compensation would be 2 1st and a 2nd and a 3rd round pick though according to what is now coming out. That is a dramatic difference from 4 1st round picks.

      • Kooch7800 says:

        they won’ t be high first rounders either as Philly will be a lot better with Weber

        “Like Canadian Hip hop..check us out http://www.groovecontrolmusic.com

      • habstrinifan says:

        I have to read it again but I was going on my recollection from reading on this matter some weeks ago. Wasnt compensation a graduated factor based on the salary you are ‘offering’ the acquired player. And my recall wa sthat 4 1st rnd picks was at the top of the table and certainly Weber’s projected cap hit will be. I should have gone back and re-read instead of writing all this but too lazy to google now..easier to rant lol. But you may be right. I hope you are wrong. Cause it’s an easier decision for Nashville if 4 1st rnd picks beckon.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          It is tied to caphit, and the way Philly structured the deal, the caphit comes in low enough to change compensation away from the 4 1sts. This is the reason many hope Bettman doesn’t allow this deal through. It was rumoured that Holmgren/Poile had been talking trade and Holmgren grew weary of waiting. I don’t think this offer by Holmgren was done in a friendly way, I think he said Eff this, I am getting this player one way or the other. If not, no one else gets himfor a while.

          • habstrinifan says:

            Thank you HabinBurlington. Then I think the commissioner could and should step in to order the deal to be ‘reconstructed’ to meet the ‘spirit’ of the clause. And thus Nashville gets their 41st rnd picks.

            I do not want the deal negated. I think this is good on an excitement level for the NHL all over the USA. And when you can say 4 1st rnd picks it adds to the news worthiness. USA sports fans know 1st rnd picks and chatter will increase re hockey based on that fact. Even fans who really dont know Weber know 41st rnd picks implication.

            This really is a PR bonanza I think. Big time dealings.

            In Philly… fans dont care re money or whatever. They care they got Weber. They prize Weber more than Nashville’s ordinary fans do. Excitement there… I bet its the talk of the town.

            In Nashville… again it gets the Predators on the news. I wonder what the reaction was to having lost Suter. The reaction would be greater for 4 1st rnd picks than for losing Weber. Again all good.

            For the NHL. Big time chatter. This shows they are playing in the deep water re free agency etc.. like NFL. Look at our board. All lit up. If Weber would have been traded it would not have been as impactful.

            Bettman recoconstruct the deal. Give Nashville the 41st rnd. Make this all about excitement for the league.

    • Cal says:

      See below (joeybarrie) for the draft picks. It’s less than the 4 1st rounders.

    • Viruk42 says:

      “Under the current CBA, players signed to offer sheets can’t be traded until the next off-season.”

      http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/2012/7/19/3169102/philadelphia-flyers-signs-shea-weber-to-offer-sheet

      With that in mind, Nashville would have to pay Weber some 26mil for just one season, and then trade him. It’s not going to happen.

    • jmsheehy19 says:

      As Burly said I believe the compensation would be 2 1sts, a 2nd, and a 3rd. But even if it were 4 1sts, they will almost assuredly be in the back half or third of the round. Nashville would ABSOLUTELY get a better deal than that in a trade.

      And as someone who has friends in Nashville and has visited many times, the fans were talking about Weber last year, as they do every year. He’s one of, if not the, best Dman in the league and one of the main draws in Nashville (at least from the people I know and their friends)

  49. toinz says:

    You can sign Voracek to anything under 3.36 million a year and it will only cost you a 2nd round pick if Philly doesn’t match.

    You can go up to 5 million and it will cost you a first and a 3rd. Voracek is definitely worth the 25th and 85th picks.

    Philly would hit the cap if Weber stays. Also they cant match Voracek until Nashville decides.

    Would be a smart move by a GM who is drafting late and wants some talent on the right side. (looking at you Mike Gillis)

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Philly can exceed cap by almost 5 million by placing Pronger on LTIR. Not sure if you calculated that in. Amazing how much Capology has become a part of being a GM.

      • toinz says:

        I did put that into the equation.

        here is my reasoning. Weber will hit for the Flyers remaining cap space, offering too much money would cripple the Flyers, especially if the cap hit eats all of Pronger’s LTIR money.

        Going forward, the Flyers have to think about re-signing Hartnell and Simmonds after next season. The hawks got screwed by the Sharks in the same way last year.

        I think Gillis needs to do this immediately. Lets not forget that the Flyers once offer sheeted Ryan Kesler.

  50. naweed235 says:

    I am just going to go ahead and say it: “Where was Bergevin in all this??? Looks like MB and Dudely were sleeping again… WHY OH GOD WHY!?!?!?!??!!??!”
    :)

    • habstrinifan says:

      I dont understand your post. Unless you are having fun which is ok too. But I dont see how Bergevin could have reasonably been a player for Weber. Can you explain?

      • Clay says:

        Sounds like sarcasm to me Trini – at least, that’s my take on it.

        __________________________
        ☞ The first principle is that you must not fool yourself, and you are the easiest person to fool. ~ Richard Feynman ☜

      • naweed235 says:

        I thought the quotes and the smiley face in the end would make it clear but otherwise I gotta get on inventing that sarcasm font pretty soon …

  51. joeybarrie says:

    Parise and Suter signed contracts with a 10 million signing bonus the first year. Not 26.
    no way can this loophole be abused as well as the end of the contract.
    they voided Kovy’s causemof the amount of loopholes they used, so it stands to reason, maybe they can void this one.
    I mean Nashville, Phoenix, Florida, etc are Bettmans little projects.
    interesting how this will play out.
    I really don’t want philly to get any better.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      You bring up a good point about how these teams are Bettmans little projects, however, I wonder if perhaps the proper term is “were” little projects. It was widely speculated that having these teams all over the Southern Belt allowed the league to show representation in all the major markets across the U.S. thus helping him sell a National TV Contract into the States. Now that the contract is a done deal, these teams may not be as important to Bettman.

      I obviously don’t know the details in the language of the TV contract, but perhaps there is room to have 1-2 or even 3 of these teams dissappear.

      This league has always been run by a handful of powerful teams and it doesn’t appear to be changing. Bettmans ruling on this contract being good or bad should be very telling in regards to his thoughts on his former little projects.

    • Cal says:

      I really don’t care about Philly getting better or not. I care about the manner in which they are attempting to do it. How can Bettman negotiate with the NHLPA now, when Snyder has essentially kneecapped him (not that he wasn’t short enough already)?
      It’s not a matter of players making too much or the owners making too much. There is a $3.4billion US pie to divvy up between them. It’s all about the individual greed on both sides and the obsession with money above all other considerations. To state it the vernacular, Eff ‘em both!

  52. Habziefan09 says:

    In 94 and again in 04, the owners had us believe that the issue was the players. Oh… it’s the players that are to blame because they don’t have 24 karat gold towels to wipe their butts with after their showers.. yadda yadda..

    Come on.. really? This is really blowing up in the owners and Bettman’s faces right now.. 98 million here, 100 million there.. Let us not forget a certain Ranger Manager (or should I say Oiler has been) signed a 3rd line centre to that contract that we, as habs fans are stuck with for the next year. Sather started this crap with Gomez.. And yes I do say 3rd line centre.. because he was at the time when he signed this damn thing.

    So Betts gets up there and says…”Oh we want you to take only 46%, limit 5 years on a contract, can’t go anywhere for 10 and no salary arbitration. If the owners really wanted to have this as their collective bargaining agreement, why are these owners so hell bent on the two faced signings this year? It makes you wonder if there are some in the background signing these guys thinking they will get some of this back when they are thinking they are going to break the union again.

    Am I shocked.. not really.. Though to blame the players in this is something that should not be done. If player A won’t take a contract then leave him at home.. And the owners/managers should have an agreement with themselves.. If anyone is RFA, no poaching.. so that we can leave the player sulk at home… But this is not the case with Weber and the Minnesota situation..

    Crosby deserved a contract like his, in 83, Gretzky signed a contract until 1999 with Edmonton… Hell.. we had opened the safe for Le Gros Bill when he signed his contract.

    This UFA frenzy this summer really has me connecting the dots as well as we saw the lack of reaction from the PA. Fehr was very cordial and did not call out Bettman like some thought he would when we heard about the owners demands. He is playing it wize. In this round of UFC CBA style, the owners are making a mockery of themselves and the PA is just sitting back and watching them all fall apart. They no legs to stand on when they are offering these BS contracts.
    __________________________________________________________
    Twitter: Habziefan09

    Confucius says: “Baseball has it all wrong, Man with 4 balls cannot walk!”

    http://habziefan09.blogspot.com

  53. Stuck_in_To. says:

    If it is true that the no. of 1st rounders is based on cap hit, then the smartest thing the league can do is rule that the portion of the offer circumventing the cap hit be taken into account. And if the bonus really is designed to tie the Preds’ hands in countering, then it should surely be calculated into the compensation. Preds get Phillies’ 1st rounder for the rest of Weber’s career!

    But seriously, what is really the problem with this situation? The league created this mess and Philly is smart enough and successful enough to take advantage of it. Weber is in a uniquely bad position on a team that has failed to build a happy and cup contending crew AND his current deal expires in what is an unknown CBA that most likely is going to be a lot less lucrative for him. Meanwhile, he watched Parise, Suter and Crosby laughing all the way to Fort F-ing Knox. He’s looking at a Ray Borque career in Boston … yeah, great player, too bad about the team he played on. That or he might get traded but be stuck driving German sports cars instead of Italian. Imagine having to park your Porsche next to Suter’s super Ferrari at the Old Defenseman’s Dinner Club.

    In the end, it just all seems stupid which makes it hard to blame one side more than the other. But what keeps nagging at me is whether this would be the scenario if the Preds franchise weren’t in Nashville.

  54. 123456 says:

    does anyone know if nashville can trade weber right now? does an offer sheet preclude a trade?

  55. Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

    Bill Meltzer, one of the only legitimate and credible bloggers on Hockeybuzz, brings up an interesting scenario for Nashville.

    While Nashville can’t work out a straight trade with Philly for Weber (since he has been offer sheeted), a deal could be worked out by making two transactions on the same day. Meltzer compares this to the Chris Gratton situation in 1997. Essentially, Nashville could come to an agreement with Philly to not match the offer sheet, and then trade back some or all of the compensatory picks to Philly for actual players.

    This could be what ends up happening. He suggests it could be something along the lines of the Schenn brothers plus Nashville keeps two of the 1st rounders for Weber.

    Here’s the story:

    http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog/Bill-Meltzer/Meltzers-Musings-Is-Weber-Offer-Sheet-a-Wise-Move/45/45674

    • mrhabby says:

      maybe this was the way it was all to be played out anyway.

      • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

        The only reason to go through such a scenario if it was talked about all along would be for Nashville to save face. That’s it. Otherwise, why not just make the straight trade.

        Meltzer believes that trade talks had stalled and that Holmgren informed Poile he would offer sheet Weber. This effectively forces the Preds to either match or deal only with the Flyers.

        Pretty smart move by Holmgren, even if he doesn’t land Weber. He is either going to get the biggest D-man out there or prevent him from signing with a rival team next year as a UFA.

    • Stuck_in_To. says:

      That does sound a whole lot more sane and hopeful than the situation “as is”. Thanks for sharing an interesting angle.

  56. mrhabby says:

    and peeps complained about MB taking Price to arbitration..this is why it was done to prevent hawks like snyder and holmgren from swooping and down to pluck players away from teams.

    this is the 2nd year that the flyers are major players. no doubt they need to sign weber in order to make there goalie better than last year and with pronger still a question mark.

    it will be very interesting to see what Bettman does. will he let it go or void the contract. his relationship with snyder will be tested a little.

    • joeybarrie says:

      I can’t imagine how he can void the contract.
      The question is will the Preds match.
      if they do not, their whole struggle to compete in a non market goes out the window.
      No way they make the playoffs without Suter, Weber, AK, Radulov, Tootoo, and Bouillon.

      • toinz says:

        making a small market franchise have to pony up 4 times the value of the contract in the first year is more than a valid reason to void it.

        Will Bettman do it though. He may have a few angry owners after him right about now.

      • mrhabby says:

        i think they have to match or go into a trade scenario with the flyers. agree playoffs will be a stretch with all those players gone.

  57. HabinBurlington says:

    The problem with Poile accepting the compensation, is it doesn’t help his team now in the short term. The Preds were getting better year in year out the past few seasons and thus tickets sales were increasing as well.

    Suddenly they are without Suter and Weber, add to that Radulov is not coming back, and this team is much different and most likely worse off. The draft picks won’t start paying off for years to come, which in the meantime could mean a drop off in performance which could coincide with a dropoff in attendance.

    Nashville is in a tough spot. Like others have said, may have been much better off having traded Weber.

  58. Cardiac says:

    So if Nashville matches the offer and Weber stays put in Nashville, do you suppose the Fylers’ “Plan B” will be to target Subban? Even if they don’t, would another team have the cojones to pull this stunt?

    Your thoughts…

    “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
    – Jerry Maguire

    • Strummer says:

      It’s a realistic scenario- looks like Philly is “in for a penny/ in for pound”

      Or as Cliff Fletcher said (before salary cap) “Draft, schmaft ”

      ______________________________________________________
      “It’s just an opinion – I could be wrong”

    • Kooch7800 says:

      Weber is a much better D man that Subban CURRENTLY. Subban has great potential and still is a good D man but has a lot of developing to do. Weber is already there as an Elite D man in the game

      I wouldn’t be surprised if an offer sheet came Subban’s way but not in the same realm in length or dollars as the Weber offer.

  59. accp says:

    Good on Philly. Now if they only had a Goalie.

    • 11000 cups says:

      MB taking Price to arbitration may prove to be one of his better moves. With the money the Flyers throw around and the way Bryz played last year signing Price to an offer sheet may have been one of Holmgrens off-season plans. (No sources just speculating).

      ‘There are 10 types of people in the world….those who know binary and those who don’t!’ –unknown

      • Habziefan09 says:

        Love your quote :) I got it right away :P

        ____________________________________________________________
        Twitter: Habziefan09

        Confucius says: “Baseball has it all wrong, Man with 4 balls cannot walk!”

        http://habziefan09.blogspot.com

        • 11000 cups says:

          Thanks habzie. It was the first line I read in a computer text book many years ago. I didn’t understand the quote until we had completed the first unit.

          ‘There are 10 types of people in the world….those who know binary and those who don’t!’ –unknown

          • bleedhabs81 says:

            actually, there are 11 people.

            Those who get it, those who don’t, and those who don’t really care.

  60. 123456 says:

    Someone has forgotted his panties were all in a bunch when his partner decided to leave town . . . LOL

  61. Ian Cobb says:

    NUT’S
    This is why the league has to implement 5 year (max) contracts only!

  62. toinz says:

    Another possibility is Bettman pulls a David Stern and annuls the contract because it violates the spirit of the CBA.

    They did it to the Devils, but would bettman do it to the Flyers.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Yah but they let the Minnesota contracts through and this seems like a near identical contract.

      • Cal says:

        $26 million up front is utter bullsh!t. NHL must say no.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          I don’t disagree Cal, but don’t forget Snyder is the kingpin of the NHL along with Jacobs. Snyder’s company is a big shareholder in the NBC Sports station which just gave the Bettman his U.S. National TV Contract. It stinks, but I don’t see Bettman playing hardball with Ed Snyder.

          • toinz says:

            It would mean saying No to the head of NBC sports, but asking a small market team to pony up 26 million dollars falls well within “against the spirit of the CBA” issues.

            Weber also just screwed the players union too. There is absolutely no way the NHL will allow these 14 year deals anymore.

            If they want the smaller market teams to survive, especially in areas where players wouldnt wanna play, the NHL needs to put the hammer down, either right now, or in the CBA negotiations.

  63. Ian Cobb says:

    THEY CALL ME SHANE.!

    Here is a story about one of my hero’s and one of our super HIO members.

    Shane and I first met on this site a number of years ago and in person when he helped me at the last few Summits in Montreal.

    He lives in Brandon Man. where he was stationed as a Sargent in our military and is a young injured war hero. He is from P.E.I.

    He is home in PEI for the summer and a local newspaper just wrote this article about him. Please read it and say hi to him at this years Summit in Oct.

    He is a great Canadian, my friend and a very passionate Hab’s fan. click below
    http://peicanada.com/opinion_cindy_chant_editor/columns_opinions/saluting_forgotten_soldier

  64. Phil C says:

    I don’t think sign and trade is an option for Poile because he has to wait a year to trade him and would have to pay the $25m bonus. There is no way they trade him after paying $25M, and I don’t think they are allowed to get money back in a trade.

  65. Thomas Le Fan says:

    Weber’s now officially a dick in my book. Definitely Flyer material.

    • Maksimir says:

      Oh yeah – he’s a dick because someone threw $100 million dollars in his lap – ONE HUNDRED MILLION! He knows the Preds can’t match that – so what’s he supposed to do? Turn down a fortune?

      • Thomas Le Fan says:

        Oh right! What was I thinking? He was going to have to slave away on the Nashville plantation for, like, a whipping a day and all the slop he could eat.

        • bleedhabs81 says:

          TLF, you are a better man than everyone else (not being condescending).

          Not saying he would live much differently if he only made 25 Million, but come one, why wouldn’t you take the money? Do you think he loves playing hockey in poor hockey market where the best chance they had was probably last year? Might as well get out and get rich doing it.

          Spend a little on yourself, your family, invest in something you think is worth while and then do lots of good with charity….

      • 11000 cups says:

        Technically only 26 million was thrown in his lap..the other 74 million has to be earned:). I fully agree with you though, no way that kind of money would be turned down by anyone.

        ‘There are 10 types of people in the world….those who know binary and those who don’t!’ –unknown

  66. toinz says:

    You need a cap hit of 8.4 million to get four first round draft picks, if not it is only 2 1st, a 2nd, and a 3rd.

    That is awful compensation for losing a franchise player.

    The preds are currently below the floor. If Weber wanted to leave Nashville, he could have waited a year and chose his team. Now if Nashville matches, he isnt going anywhere.

    Another point, Nashville is currently 14 million below the floor. If they do not match, where are they gonna spend 14 million dollars. They have 2 RFAs left to sign and Weber’s replacement, who isnt there because all the good d-men are signed.

    • joeybarrie says:

      MB should be calling Poile right now to help out with Gomez…

    • coutNY says:

      “You need a cap hit of 8.4 million to get four first round draft picks” but the rules read:
      ” This is determined by dividing total compensation by the less of the number of years of the offer sheet, or five (this discourages long-term offer sheets in some cases).”
      So I beleave if the total years are more than 5 they divide the whole contract by 5; making the actual pick compensation # upwards of $20 million so the RFA draft pick compensation is 4 first rounders…

  67. HardHabits says:

    Totally ludicrous. Either the cap hit should be equal to the salary, if front or back loaded, or all contracts should have same cap hit/salary for each year of the term. This front loading nonsense is idiotic.

    Let’s Tank again like we did last season.

  68. Cal says:

    Poile must match the offer and tell the Flyers and Weber to go bleep themselves. Then, he can negotiate a trade with any team in the NHL.

  69. SmartDog says:

    I guess not everyone is on vacation. :P

    Here’s what Nashville gets:
    It is expected the Predators would receive either four first round draft picks or two first round picks, one second and one third from the Flyers.

    As good as Weber is FOUR first round picks, wow. For a building team (and Nashville needs to rebuild), in the long run that would likely have even bigger impact than Weber. But it’s the short run that’s the focus here obviously – for both teams.

    Speaking of short, so Bettman’s losing the board room. ha ha. Yeah, 5 year contract limits. Sure, what-ever.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • 123456 says:

      yea 5 yrs……. and 5 years for entry level contract. . .blah blah.

      one has to wonder if a few more monster contract will emerge before the CBA is completed so owners can lock up players long term, circumvent the cap with the low salary out years, and inflate salares because it appears there will be a 10% or so salary rollback. . . . .

      • SmartDog says:

        What a mess. The league can’t even police itself. Bettman is saying one thing and the GM’s are doing another. Fehr must be laughing in his corn flakes right now.

        These long contracts are rarely a good thing. I still can’t believe the extension they gave Crosby. After his concussion history, you really can’t know. All of these guys are a headshot or two away from being a question mark.

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • mrhabby says:

          its been the first offer sheet in years. i don’t think its a mess. hypocritical but not a mess.

          • SmartDog says:

            okay a mess may be a bit much but the timing couldn’t be more off, and it’s not just offer sheets it’s long term contracts – we’ve had several of those in the last month alone

            ————————————-
            Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • wjc says:

          What about this: Nashville can’t afford Webber.
          Philadelphia can.
          Nashville says to Philly…psssst…..give Weber an offer sheet. We will take the 4 first rounders.
          We cannot trade for that deal, because the fans will be on to the game. So we will look like we were forced into this deal…..it is a win/win for both of us.

          Fans are appeased and blame Philly, Nashville remains blameless. Webber is happy, Nashville continues to build without big contracts, they do not want. Philly goes deep into playoffs….Pay-per-view and NBC are pleased as well.

          Sometimes things aren’t what they seem.

          wjc

    • joeybarrie says:

      4 first round draft picks. I don’t know if its worth it.
      I agree that Weber is most likely going to be a much better player than any of the 4 picks. But not all of them.
      Look what Edmonton gave up for Dustin Penner.
      the picks given to Anaheim were used to choose Tyler Myers, Justin Schultz and Kirill Petrov. Now Anaheim screwed up all those picks in retrospect. Especially Schultz, cause he went right back to Edmonton.
      But to say that Weber is better than having 4 players such as Jordan Eberle, Tyler Myers, Erik Karlsson, and John Carlson is not accurate.
      I’m am not convinced having a 7.5 million dollar cap hit for 14 years and losing your first 4 draft picks for the next 4 years is worth Weber.
      unfortunately, losing 2 first rounders and a 2 and a 3rd… Probably is.

      14 years. The only thing that sucks is if he retires it doesn’t go against the cap. The league should reject this, but probably can’t. It should be changed.

      • mksness says:

        this move would make philly a top 3 team in the east for more than 4 years especially with their other talent. so you’re giving up late round 1 rounders. the players you mentioned were all drafted early in the first rounds by teams that missed the playoffs. also you ave to remember that not all first round picks make it to the nhl as super stars either.

    • Welks says:

      Bettman’s losing the board room? Lets hope he loses his job before the NHL loses another season and more fans.

  70. frankcasting says:

    “Terry Jones of the Edmonton Sun on Twitter: I’ve seen coaches lose the dressing room. But I think we’re watching Gary Bettman lose the board room.” Don Fehr must be killing himself laughing this morning, The Count must be pulling Bill Daly’s hair out … oh wait … what a joke of a league.

    Loving the Habs since 1965

  71. aj says:

    Ha Ha! So much for Ken Holland’s plan to bring in some tough defence for the Red Wings by hopefully acquiring either Weber or Suter.

    Let’s just see whether Bergevin could ‘entice’ Shane Doan to come and sign here rather than Detroit.

  72. BeeGee says:

    I might be wrong, but it’s my understanding that if the offer sheet is matched, that’s the end of the line. Therefore with this move Holmgren:
    A) Is guaranteed neither division rivals Pens or Rangers would get their hands on Weber (with whom the preds were rumored to be talking).
    B) Gives his buddy Poile a chance to keep his player at what seems to be “fair” market price (100MM/14 for Weber < 98MM/13 for Suter)
    C) Has an outside chance to land Weber for cheap: 2 first rounders, a 3rd and a 4th… (all probably low picks) if the Pred's owners don't put up the cash…

    • 123456 says:

      B brings up a point that most will dismiss. . . any possibility holgrem & poile had discussions before this offer was made…..

      • BeeGee says:

        Well… they do have history. I don’t want to seem paranoid, but if this move forces Weber to sign and the Preds owners to fork the cash, everyone’s happy…

  73. 123456 says:

    can someone post what nashville gets for picks in return?

    • joeybarrie says:

      Phiily makes it so its a cap hit of just under 7.2 million.
      So the compensation is 2 first round draft picks, a second and a third. If the cap hit was 650k higher it would have been 4 first round picks.
      seems like a huge difference there in compensation over salary.

  74. HabinBurlington says:

    So the compensation is tied to the yearly caphit, this seems like a loophole to me. Given the rough and tumble game Weber plays, I think it may be wishful thinking that he plays this entire contract and is still on the ice in year 13 and 14 at age 39 and 40.

    Seems to me that by giving this length it helps the Philly caphit, decreases the compensation all the while no expectations for Weber to play those final years.

    Nashville suddenly is in a complete different scenario than they were just 1 full season ago. I also wonder if the uproar when Poile brought Radulov back to the NHL much to the chagrine of many of other GM’s also opened the door for GM’s like Holmgren to be unafraid to poach Weber with the offer sheet.

    • ed lopaz says:

      am I missing something?

      Nashville will match the offer without a doubt.

      why?

      1) the cap hit is reasonable as Weber is arguably the best defender in the game, and at his age he will be for years to come.

      2) once the offer is matched, Weber will be traded for WAY MORE then 4 first rounder. I believe Nashville can get 2 high impact young players and at least 2 first rounders. Which means they could get a top 6 young forward, a top 4 young d-man, and 2 first rounders

      what am I missing?

      the fact that Weber is now formally declaring that he wants out of Nashville?

      big deal.

      Nashville will still be able to trade him, and at least 6 teams, maybe more, would be willing to offer AT LEAST what I suggested above, maybe more.

      • HabinBurlington says:

        But, as Dreger reports, the frontloading could be so dramatic that Nashville can’t match. Also, what if Weber doesn’t want to play in Nashville for that term, Poile may get him signed but have an unhappy Weber. As for then trading Weber, you now have to trade the contract and find a team willing to swallow that format of a contract.

        Obviously none of us know what will happen, but this will be intriguing to watch play out.

        • BeeGee says:

          They would be nuts not to dish out the cash… It’s a huge amount now of course, but they will end up paying it in any case. I would be very very surprised if they don’t match.

      • BeeGee says:

        1- As per CBA, he could only be traded 1 year after the offer sheet is matched.
        2- Amongst others, Vanek signed an offer sheet that was then matched. His signing doesn’t necessarily mean he wants out. It means he agrees with the term and money. Name me a player that ever refused an offer sheet… can’t think of one..

    • Phil C says:

      Lowering the cap hit makes it affordable, but also limits what they owe Nashville to 2 1st round picks, a 2nd, and a 3rd instead of 4 1st rounders. And the bonus structure makes it unaffordable for Nashville. Yet another reason why Nashville should have signed him or traded him before free agency.

      As for disrespect for Poile, it’s definitely possible, but the Flyers have made offer sheets before, they just lost the Suter lottery despite offering him more money, and Weber is a special player that does not come along often who fits with their team image. I really don’t blame them in this case.

      I am glad the Habs took Price to arbitration!

      • HabinBurlington says:

        Agree Phil, especially with the part about lowering the compensation. I think that is a loophole that if I was a smaller market team would want to close. Will be very hard for Nashville to financially match this contract. And you are correct in why Montreal was very smart in how they handled Price, to avoid such an offer being made to him by another team.

      • Cal says:

        Let’s hope Poile matches and then trades Weber to anywhere but Philly.

        • Jan_pronounced_Yan says:

          He would have to wait a year to do that. What if Weber got hurt or something? Philly actually has many good young assets to trade to Nashville, so if a trade happens, I think it will be with Philly.

  75. TomNickle says:

    Max Pacioretty, John Carlson, David Perron and Claude Giroux all have something in common.

    Know what it is?

  76. arcosenate says:

    What is it?

  77. mksness says:

    true but how many prospects in that area didn’t make it?

  78. HabFanSince72 says:

    Maybe but the average 25th player selected isn’t that good.

    That is how you evaluate the draft pick.

    Your argument is like saying the expected return from a mutual fund is the best return of any mutual fund in the past 4 years.


    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

  79. jmsheehy19 says:

    as others said though, the actual hit rate is much lower. So a more realistic statement would be 1 or 2 of those listed.
    Obviously if they get 3 of the 4 than it works out.

    Or they could get 3 of David Fischer, Angelo Esposito, Greg Nemisz, Bob Sanguinetti.

  80. TomNickle says:

    Team’s not being able to find four in a row isn’t the point. And it isn’t that they were taken in the high twenties. Just later in the first round.

  81. TomNickle says:

    Plenty. But first round picks are gold. 4 of them is a King’s ransom.

  82. HabFanSince72 says:

    That’s ridiculous. (I realize its not you making that argument.)

    The point is their management team has assembled a much better roster than ours has.

    You’d have to be blinkered not to see it.


    Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

  83. HardHabits says:

    I chose those teams because of the ex-Habs management that are now employed there.

    As for signing a generational player or one that can be built around via free agency (like Chara for example) I am all for it. I also clearly state that once enough assets are built up trades can be made, which also satisfies the people who have brought up Carter, Richards, Horton and Hossa.

    What I am opposed to is signing a player to a ludicrous offer sheet or trading away a player like McDonagh for Gomez.

  84. TomNickle says:

    No my argument is that first round picks provide the opportunity, and you don’t have to pay for them.

    It would be more like being able to play the market with one of the top 30 financial analysts in the World.

    And I like those odds.

  85. cunningdave says:

    Yes, plus their own picks. Unless they traded them away (not that I know of) they’ll have 2 1st round picks for 4 years, which they can use to pick great players or for trades.

    Nashville got their asses handed to them by Phoenix with Weber and Suter in the lineup. I’ll say again: as of yesterday, Nashville was going to get nothing but one more year of service from Weber. Now they have the option (previously not available) of signing him long-term, or taking bounty of picks. This is good for Nashville.

  86. Cardiac says:

    You read my mind.

    “There’s genius everywhere, but until they turn pro, it’s like popcorn in the pan. Some pop… some don’t.”
    – Jerry Maguire

  87. Cal says:

    They haven’t won since 1975. They suck. ;)

  88. HardHabits says:

    Against signing an RFA like Weber to an offer sheet. In favour of letting a player go if the compensation is up there. Burke was a dumb-ass for signing Kessel. The Bruins made off like bandits getting Tyler Seguin and Dougie Hamilton.

  89. HardHabits says:

    PMSTime making his monthly appearance.

  90. commandant says:

    Save the owners from the players like Shea Weber who clearly walked into Ed Snider’s office with a gun and forced him to make this offer sheet.

    Geez

    No one forced any owner to do these deals. Why do these guys who are smart business people to become this rich in the first place need to be saved from their own ability to make dumb decisions?

    Go Habs Go!
    NHL Free Agency and Trade Analysis now.
    Team By Team Prospect Reports coming soon
    http://lastwordonsports.com/

  91. ed lopaz says:

    nashville needs to be saved not philly.

    the CBA will be changed to help Nashville compete.

  92. commandant says:

    don’t need to change the CBA.

    Give them better revenue sharing, and there is no money flow issue that allows this poaching to take place.

    Go Habs Go!
    NHL Free Agency and Trade Analysis now.
    Team By Team Prospect Reports coming soon
    http://lastwordonsports.com/

  93. commandant says:

    If you match, you can’t trade him for 1 calendar year.

    Go Habs Go!
    NHL Free Agency and Trade Analysis now.
    Team By Team Prospect Reports coming soon
    http://lastwordonsports.com/

  94. ProHabs says:

    And you would have paid him 27 million bucks over that 1 year.

  95. ont fan says:

    What about the 27 mil. signing bonus. That’s gone.

  96. ed lopaz says:

    that needs to be changed.

  97. commandant says:

    You pay him 27 million in cash during that 1 calendar year. Money you can’t recover in a trade.

    Go Habs Go!
    NHL Free Agency and Trade Analysis now.
    Team By Team Prospect Reports coming soon
    http://lastwordonsports.com/


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