And on the seventh day …

Gionta

They rested.
Riding the euphoria of two OT road wins, Jacques Martin gave the Canadiens Sunday off to hang with their families, watch some football and do whatever normal people do.
The team is back in action against Buffalo at the Bell Centre Monday night.

Pat Hickey’s game story

Pierre Ladouceur’s game report card

Miller doesn’t mince words on Lucic

•  •  •

Ottawa CH fan Chris O’Brien suggests a Stephen Foster adaptation:

Campdown ladies sing this song:

Budaj! Budaj!

•  •  •

And may we safely conclude that KHL coach Andrey Nazarov did not learn behind-the-bench demeanour from Jacques Martin?

384 Comments

  1. twilighthours says:

    AB,

    Scientific method and all… Unless your data isn’t actually that meaningful.

    Re: Eller, I just went back to your post and I read what you wrote (as you’re always asking us to do). You said Eller had better production than plex. I showed that he scored fewer goals, which was the original Eller argument – “will he be a goal scorer?” tomas plekanec scored more ahl goals than Lars Eller in their rookie ahl seasons.

    If the situation was reversed, you would be saying the exact same things to me – picking on my choice of words.

    To my final point: aren’t these little debates silly? I’m not sure why you get involved in so many of them.

    • Bill says:

      “To my final point: aren’t these little debates silly? I’m not sure why you get involved in so many of them.”

      Isn’t that the point of a forum like this? If not, we’re all in the wrong place!

      Full Breezer 4 Life

    • ProHabs says:

      That is because AB is one of those “thinks he knows it all” type of guys and so he always has to have the last word. He never knows when to drop something and let it go. Kind of like the kindergarden kids at the school I teach at.

      He talks about stats and stats but then this afternoon, his big arguement in support of Gomez’s game last night was that Weber’s shot was lucky (ya right) and that Desharnais also had a lucky game last night. So when stats don’t support his arguement, it is just luck that things happen.

      • Once again demonstrating you don’t know what you’re talking about.

        I don’t know when to let things drop, yet you follow me around like a little chihuahua nipping at my heels. Sad really.

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        • ProHabs says:

          Don’t flatter yourself. I used to visit EOTP often when Robert was there. I never visit that site anymore for obvious reason.

          Plus, if I followed you around, I would post about 50 comments on here a day as you seem to do. You seem to spend every waking minute on this site, probably reading your own posts over and over again as you seem to think the world revolves around you.

    • So your position is that the data isn’t meaningful, I can guarantee you that you’re wrong about that. It’ll be shown clearly in an article I’m publishing tomorrow.

      Seriously man, what’s silly is you saying that I manipulate stats when you’re looking at one column in a stat line and making a conclusion without context. Plekanec scored more goals, in MORE GAMES. Eller scored more goals per game, therefore he outscored Plekanec.

      If Crosby scored 30 goals in 60 games, and Ovechkin scores 31 in 82, who outscored the other?

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    • Everlasting1 says:

      I’m still waiting on his ‘scientific’ explanation on how a steel framed building can callapse at freefall speed due to fire. Won’t get one. All you’ll get is a dismissive attitude with insults.

      ——————————————————————-
      Thus sayeth the Lord, “Destroyed I the Amorite before them, whose height was like the height of the cedars, and he was strong as the oaks.” Amos 2:9

      “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

      • Actually I sent you a massive breakdown about why that happened and you ignored it because it didn’t fit your ideology. Not to mention the whole “free fall speed” thing, is a blatant lie.

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        • Everlasting1 says:

          Massive breakdown? I got zilch from you.
          The 47 story Solomon building DIDN’T collapse in under 7 secs? Video doesn’t lie. Not that I believe you studied any of this thoroughly, or were even aware of WTC7.

          ——————————————————————-
          Thus sayeth the Lord, “Destroyed I the Amorite before them, whose height was like the height of the cedars, and he was strong as the oaks.” Amos 2:9

          “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

          • The video in question doesn’t show the full collapse.

            Here’s is the breakdown I sent you months ago, although I doubt you have the patience to read it: http://www.debunking911.com/pull.htm

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          • Everlasting1 says:

            Pft. Like I haven’t come across this laughable site that tries to defy physics 101. Video in question? There were countless video sources showing the same time frame. Only way a building can collapse that uniformly, at that speed, and produce that amount of dust is by a controlled demolition. The building was pulverized.

            ——————————————————————-
            Thus sayeth the Lord, “Destroyed I the Amorite before them, whose height was like the height of the cedars, and he was strong as the oaks.” Amos 2:9

            “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

  2. JasonM says:

    Looks like Lucic earned himself an appointment with Shanaban tomorrow at 1PM.

    How he only got a 2 minute penalty for such a clear intent to injure makes me sad that the league still has not learned what happened to Pacioretty last year.

  3. twilighthours says:

    AB,

    You said that Eller out scored plex at the ahl level. I said that’s not true – plex scored more ahl goals thAn Eller. Regardless, semantics.

    But with all due respect, it often seems as if you rely completely on data to make an argument.

    Two last things regarding gomer: small sample size, but the best sample size. He was awful when it mattered… Foreshadowing for the rest of his career? And against Nashville – a centre should never ever make that play. The Centres job on a lost D zone face off is to take the opposing centre. Always. Gomer bungled it.

    • I said he outscored Plekanec at the AHL level at the same age. Outscored usually refers to points when you say it colloquially, and Eller had more. Regardless, your point doesn’t make sense anyway because Eller scored more goals per game than Plekanec did that year in the AHL. If you don’t recognize games played as a contributing factor to scoring numbers… I’m not sure where to go from there.

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  4. twilighthours says:

    Bill, for me to have a proper opinion on this, I’d have to go back and watch last years playoffs. That’s not going to happen – too painful.

    But as a recall plex’ line completely shut down the krejci line while gomer stood idly by and watched his check put the puck
    In the net.

    I may be completely off base, but that’s what I remember.

    It would be useful if people who want to use these new stats would actually cite them and explain them instead of just saying “based on what I’m seeing…” I have a decent handle on most of what people are using but I think it would benefit all HIO readers to know the source of the argument.

    • DEANDALLEY says:

      If Max wasn’t put out by Bigfoot the Broons would have been put out in the 1st round & the Habs would have been hoisting the Cup!

      “If your not first, your last”

    • I’d quote more stats, but I’m working on an article that’s taken the last 3 full days for research and revision so I’m answering quickly. Sorry if that seemed condescending. I just didn’t feel like looking it up at the moment.

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    • Bill says:

      You could argue that it was Marchand, Bergeron, and Recchi who did most of the crucial damage to the Habs, and I think it would be fair to say that Gomez’s line was matched against them for the most part. That’s a reasonable observation. I don’t really know how the stats relate, since Gomez’s defensive playoff stats are just mediocre.

      Full Breezer 4 Life

  5. The Dude says:

    A couple of months ago I pointed out “during a concussion debate” that the most dangerous thing you can do in hockey is throw your body in front of a puck to block a shot,well a 16 years old in Edmonton took a puck in the neck and passed away yesterday, R.I.P…. If you really want too stop chances of a fatality in hockey or concussion STOP DIVING IN FRONT OF EFFING PUCKS,YOU JUST DON’T KNOW what direction a heavy frozen vulcanized rubber puck will end up going and the the end result when balanced with the scales of life just don’t jive….do they!

  6. twilighthours says:

    Gomez good defensively? Metrics aside, he was horrific when it mattered most: last year’s playoffs. What did the bruins score – 16 goals in that series? And he was -6 with 4 assists. So he was on for at least 6 bruin goals and maybe a lot more. I’m sure someone could do a thorough analysis of the data if they wanted.

    What I trust a lot more than data are my impressions and overall memories of that series, and I distinctly remember thinking “he is killing us in our own zone.”

    • Bill says:

      If you look at the stats Berkshire likes (stuff at behindthenet) Gomez’s playoff numbers are mediocre rather than bad.

      From what I can tell – and I am not a numbers guy – it looks like Plekanec drew far tougher assignments and struggled somewhat defensively, whereas Gomez drew softer assignments and did fairly well defensively.

      Full Breezer 4 Life

      • That’s pretty much it, although the line Gomez was supposed to shut down (Marchand – Bergeron – Recchi) scored a lot more than the Krejci line. But Boston was much better at even strength in that series. Without Markov, Gorges and Pacioretty, with Wiz and Kostitsyn playing injured, we were in tough to begin with.

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    • Yup, he was bad. But that’s a small sample size and Boston dominated the score at ES so it’s not a particularly good way to evaluate him.

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  7. 123456 says:

    for those arguing pleks and eller – why not look at this years stats? i dont care about age or experience – at the end of the days it’s production …… variously defined but we can all agree points first – then plus/minus

  8. Bill says:

    Berkshire:

    Is Gomez really good defensively? I know his +/- was screwed last year because of his brutal offensive season (talk about a damning excuse btw) but putting that aside … I don’t see great defensive prowess with my eyes. I see a fairly average defensive player who is prone to floating a little in the d-zone.

    Full Breezer 4 Life

    • From pretty much every metric I can see, Gomez is pretty good defensively. He’s not Plekanec, but almost no one is. I don’t think he’s a great penalty killer, but he’s good at clearing the zone and a fairly good positional player.

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      • 123456 says:

        i think all agree pleks way better than gomer – the issue with gomer is he can and soemtiems is very good….. but what was he doing on the onyl goal against vs nashville – watch the goal again – was gomers fault.

        i have defended gomer so many times as he adds a lot of value in terms of puck possession – but my patience is running thin…. he needs to get points

        • The goal was actually JM’s fault for putting Gionta in the faceoff circle. However Gomez is used to being a center, he made a play that the center should make. I don’t think you can say he sucks because of that. His first game at wing in his NHL career to my knowledge.

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  9. twilighthours says:

    AB, I dunno buddy. You can argue “production” however you want, but you said that eller’s production level in the A at the same age was better than plex’. If I interpret production as goal scoring, which is the usual argument with eller, then plex out scored him at his level. Simple as that. More importantly, though, is that the differences are negligible, which is the honest truth but not something you would readily admit because you are Trying to make a case For Eller being a legit scoring threat. If Eller has the same career as plex we will all be thrilled but I don’t see anything close to the finish yet from Larry.

    Regarding gomer, you haven’t convinced me that DD has it much easier. But that’s irrelevant – right now, Desharnais is a more effective and better player and deserves more ice with better players than Gomez. He is also getting better while all signs point to Gomez getting worse.

    If all NHL players were robots and followed predictable growth patterns and tended to score at their mean point values and shoot% etc then your arguments would be more convincing. But sometimes it seems like you forget that there’s an actual game going on beyond the pages of data. It is indeed possible that NHL players are not predictable automatons.

    • Sorry I took so long to respond TH, got a phone call.

      I’m not sure what you’re talking about though. Eller scored 20 goals that year in 77 games, (18G, 70 games in NHL, 2G, 7 games in NHL). Plekanec scored 19G in 77 AHL games. In what way did Plekanec outscore Eller? Eller also had significantly more assists.

      Of course NHL players aren’t automatons, at no point have I suggested that. The OP said that Eller has never scored significantly before the NHL, that was patently false, for which I used Plekanec as an illustration.

      You’re mistaking me using statistics to enhance an argument for relying on them.

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  10. Bill says:

    Miller’s out for tomorrow night apparently? May not be great news as Enroth has had a hot start …

    Full Breezer 4 Life

    • 123456 says:

      yes enroth is not only hot but a very good goalie. i’m in western NY and see the sabres a lot – right now the sabres ar eplaying better in front of enroth….. but he and miller got stoked by the booins last night so hopefully their mojo is gone for monday

  11. twilighthours says:

    Another slight twist, AB. If the 2003 NJD were a trap team in the dead puck era, what is this year’s mtl team?

    2004, njd averaged 2.6 goals per game when league games saw avg of 5.1ish goals total.

    This year’s habs – a trapping team – score 2.5 goals per game against the very marginally better 5.5ish (last year anyway) total goals per game.

    Are you suggesting that Gomez’ 70 points were scored under significantly more difficult circumstances than Desharnais faces? Because I don’t see that at all.

    • That’s exactly what I’m suggesting. Gomez was also playing as a 1st line player, playing against the opponent’s top lines every night. That’s something DD is completely incapable of. In fact whenever DD gets 2nd line matchups he gets shredded like crazy, no matter how good his linemates are.

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      • ooder says:

        hey andrew..you are saying DD is completely incapable of playing agasint the first line.
        thing is neither is gomez.. furthermore when put against the 3rd/4th line gomez doesn’t produce either
        ——————
        The 2010-11 Stanley Cup was not won, but given

    • Bill says:

      AB’s gonna really have to manipulate some stats if he is serious about defending Gomez. Corsi is great, but for a guy like Gomez – paid to be a number one centre – goals and assists remain reasonably significant as statistics. He’s not paid to be Doug Jarvis … though I’d accept that from him right about now.

      Full Breezer 4 Life

      • Has nothing to do with defending Gomez, although he is unfairly maligned. Someone made the comparison between Desharnais and Gomez, saying DD would have a better career. I pointed out that Gomez put up 70 points at 24 years old, DD’s age last season.

        The odds of DD at 25 becoming a dominant NHL forward when he needs two excellent wingers to handle 3rd line matchups is pretty much nil. And yes, when Gomez is healthy and ready to take faceoffs, if put in Desharnais’ slot with Pacioretty and Cole, I would be comfortable saying he would produce more points, simply because he would spend more time in the offensive zone.

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        • Bill says:

          Okay, well I don’t believe DD is going to become any kind of top-flight NHL player. I would say he could be a one-dimensional 50-60 point player though. Does that make him a desirable asset? Not to me.

          Age comparisons aside, who will have a more productive season this year? Hard to say.

          I guess it makes no sense to compare DD and Gomez unless it’s specifically about who should get more ice time and better wingers this year. Slight edge to DD unless Gomez can contribute as much offensively, because neither one is much of a defensive wizard.

          Full Breezer 4 Life

          • Gomez is actually pretty good defensively, which isn’t recognized by many here because of his atrocious offensive season (which made his +/- look worse than it should have) last year. Not to mention he’s so over-analyzed that any minor mistake he’s made is turned into some grand insult to the CH.

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  12. Mattyleg says:

    Hey all.
    I think it’s great that Gomez is on the wing.
    He plays centre like a wing anyway; goes into the zone and pulls up on the left boards, leaving the centre wide open.
    Apparently he came into the league as a winger.
    He should stay on the left.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  13. ooder says:

    are people here actually arguing about DD vs Gomez???
    are you guys serious?!?!?
    one scored yesterday and setup the game winner, the other hasn’t scored in almost 40 games.
    ——————
    The 2010-11 Stanley Cup was not won, but given

  14. twilighthours says:

    AB,

    Misleading on the plex/Eller comparison, no? I believe the argument was for Eller to be a good scorer at the NHL level. Plex actually had 1 more goal than Eller in the A at his age (19 vs 18). However, plex also had seasons of 23 and 29 goals for the bulldogs.

    Eller was rushed and so we will never know if he would have numbers like that but I can’t help but wonder if he would have benefited from another year or two.

    In plex’ first 140ish games he had 29 goals. In eller’s first 90ish he’s got 9. We will see how this season plays out but he better get going, eh?

    • That’s not misleading, Eller put up more points in fewer games. Eller also put up 2 NHL goals that year, so he still outscored Plekanec.

      Eller 18G in 70 games in the AHL at 19, 2G in 7 NHL games.

      Plekanec 19G in 77 AHL games.

      That’s in spite of Eller dealing with mono the first 2 months of the season in Peoria.

      Another significant difference is that Peoria was a terrible team. Plekanec was outpointed by 5 players in 02-03 in Hamilton, while Eller lead the Rivermen by 13 points.

      Plekanec was significantly older when he broke in, so I don’t see a comparison in NHL numbers. When Eller is 23 and 24 we’ll see how he compares to Plekanec’s first two seasons as an NHLer.

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  15. Duracell3 says:

    I just watched Lucic…what you can only call finishing his check I guess… on Miller.

    Not only does he screw up a clear breakaway by throwing the puck up, but once he does so he clearly realizes it and isn’t even looking at the puck. He’s just above the top of the circle when he starts looking at Miller and clearly stands upright getting ready to make contact. His quote afterword that he was simply going full speed and couldn’t do anything different is a f$%^*#g joke.

    Only the idiots of Boston would believe that. In the way that you have to have never worn a glove to believe Ference blatantly flipping off a crowd was some kind of accident, you have to be equally dense or have never skated to watch that and not understand that the only thing on his mind was running their goalie. I’m not even upset at the play, but just how insanely stupid/blind journalists and fans of certain teams are.

  16. Mothstoflame says:

    Just got home from the Dogs whoopin those Baby Sens in Ottawa. Louis Leblanc had a nice goal, Blunden was probably my second favorite on the night, he has got some confidence thats for sure. Avstin, was ALL over the ice and was first star. I didnt think he played overly well but it was a mistake free game. Good game well worth the trip for my first dogs game. I have had high hopes for louis for sometime. Though was i hoping to see shutlz, although i dont think he will amount to much he has been injured alot. Last but not least for alot of young guys those mustaches are getting greasy!!! Go Dogs Go Habs Go!!!

  17. Bill J says:

    I’ve got no hate for DD, I just think he should be on the wing.

    Eller as the #2 as center
    Gomez on #3


    If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

    Go Habs Go!

  18. Bripro says:

    I know this is Habs hockey, but for anyone who cares,
    the Als lost to the Tiger Cats.
    I’d be willing to bet Calvillo just played his last game.
    Congrats to the TiCats (b•st•rds!)

    • Habsrule1 says:

      It’s too bad about the Als, but at least they should know what to work on in the off-season. Defense!

      And I’ll take that bet on Calvillo. He passed for 513 yards. He’s not done yet.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • Bripro says:

        The injuries certainly didn’t help.
        Calvillo got pushed around and sacked more this year than I can remember. Their offensive line lost to injuries and retirements, and wasn’t the same.
        With certain minor health issues this year, and given his age, I think he’s pondering hanging them up. He’s a great QB. I wish him the best.

        • Habsrule1 says:

          I think the Als will come back to the top of the league if AC stays. If not, it’ll take a bit more time. You’re right about the injuries. I also think Popp will address any deiciencies the Als have.
          I still believe that given that AC has had very good stats once again, he will opt to return.
          But I’ve been wrong before….I think.

          Go Habs Go!!

          “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • savethepuck says:

      It’s a Habs site not a Montreal site, and I’m a Ti-Cats fan, so a good day for me.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

    • Everlasting1 says:

      Heck of a game. Calvillo not done by a long shot, should he choose to continue playing. But he has nothing more to prove.

      Most career passing yards (73,412), Most career touchdown passes (418), Most career completions (5444), Most career passing yards in Grey Cup games (2470 yards), Most completions in regular season game (44).

      ——————————————————————-
      Thus sayeth the Lord, “Destroyed I the Amorite before them, whose height was like the height of the cedars, and he was strong as the oaks.” Amos 2:9

      “We don’t see things as they are, but as we are.” – Anais Nin

    • slapshot777 says:

      Als have had a lot of injuries this year mostly to defense. Still looking at the positive. The Tiger Cats still had to go overtime with the Als. So tinkering in the offseason and the Als will be back to winning football. Still don’t know why Whitaker didn’t run for the 2 yards. The pass play was a 50/50 at the best of times and it showed on that play. Just the wrong call and the Cats got lucky.

      To you from failing hands we throw the torch, be yours to hold it high.

  19. twilighthours says:

    @vancouverhab

    Then to HH’s secondary point: take any data or indicator you want to show how the habs are playing. Goals and wins are the only ones that matter. “but we were one goal away from beating the bruins” and “bruins didn’t deserve to win the cup” are losers’ laments. Wins are the only thing that matter. You feel me?

  20. otter649 says:

    Concerning Cammy being injured – Yesterday CBC cameras were in the Habs dressing room & there was a partial shot of #13 who had a tensor bandage on his left hand/wrist with nothing on his right hand so it could explain maybe why he has turned into a modern day Richard Zednick trying to play with one hand (right) when checking/stick handling etc…..

    • savethepuck says:

      I think people have to get over bashing Cammy. He was bashed after coming back from injury and not producing in March of 2010, he was a monster in the 2010 play-offs. Again in the spring of 2011, he’s bashed about not producing after coming back from an injury, and surprise surprise, he’s a monster again in the play-offs.
      It’s tthe what have you done for me lately crap from this organization’s fans that is getting really tired. Maybe some here should see a pattern that when he comes back from injury, it takes time for him to get his timing back.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

  21. Malreg says:

    Nice to see Avstin has finally woken up, picking up 3 assists tonight.

  22. twilighthours says:

    @vamcouverhab, I see you also enjoy the apple/orange melange.

    Wouldn’t the best comparison be scoring chances/goals in hockey to scoring chances/goals in soccer (were such data kept)?

    Allow me to interrupt your thumbing through a thesaurus to remind you of HH’s point: teams can have lots of scoring chances but few goals because those teams can have players who struggle at finishing. Lars Eller and Scott Gomez being relevant examples.

    • VancouverHab says:

      I agree totally with you here — I obviously didn’t express myself well. That’s pretty much exactly what I mean: a team can create chances but score few goals because they are finishing poorly. BUT, the fact that the chances are being created IS a measure of offensive success, and lets the coach know that all the other stuff is working well.

      (A good friend of mine used to say that a coach can coach up to the scoring chance, but after that it’s down to the player.)

  23. habs001 says:

    pk while not scoring goals has played very well..he will be a key component in a few years if we become an elite team…camm has to start to produce. i felt that he could score 30-35 goals this year but if he scores only 20-24 goals this year you may have to consider trading him next year…

    • savethepuck says:

      He has been injured and missed close to half the games, but I find it humerous that posters on here keep bitching about his production when it’s evident that he is always slow to get his timing back when he comes back from an injury and the guy is an absolute monster every year in the play-offs. I thought a Stanley Cup was important in Montreal, why does everyone always suggest getting rid of our best play-off producer over the last 2 years. You want to keep the guys that elevate their game to the next level at crunch time, not discard them.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

  24. Danno says:

    Why do all the previous comments have to be relegated to the previous page as “older comments”? This is not a good feature of the new and improved HIO website.

    ________________________________________

    “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

    • Da Hema says:

      The “new and improved” HIO. They have a server that melts down under pressure like Montreal’s defencemen. The number of trackers they use to squeeze as much personal data as is possible from the users only compounds the slowness and (ultimately) unreliability of the site. That there are limits to how many replies (why?) are available to posters discourages thorough debate and discussion.

      Yes, I am a grumpy hippo today.

      • Danno says:

        I also miss the way comments you didn’t read yet were flagged as “new” after refreshing the page.

        ________________________________________

        “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

        • Da Hema says:

          Yep. The designers of this website took something good and turned it into something less good. That seems to be the defining feature of people in the so-called “information technology” field.

          • Danno says:

            I also miss the way you used to be able to send a message directly to someone who commented through their profile.

            ________________________________________

            “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  25. savethepuck says:

    Due to a lot of negativity today, I don’t know if anyone else realized this or not, but of all the teams in the top 8 in the East on a busy NHL schedule, the Caps were the only team to get a point
    ( they lost in a shootout). I think it was a good night overall for the Habs,

    “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
    Carey Price

  26. bolder says:

    A day will come, when lucy will be laying on his back pointing in the air (like Horton) after someone rings his bell. What goes around …. Comes around.

  27. habs001 says:

    We will have to be patient with Eller…he was never a blue chip prospect and has had very limited scoring stats prior to the nhl..I still believe he needs somehow gain confidence in scoring as he does not seem to have a natural scoring touch…My concern is if he finishes this year with 5-7 goals and next year he is still at this pace after 40 games can you really make him your number 2 centre?…

    • Trisomy 21 says:

      Hard to say if he’s never given a chance. How well can he really do with Darche and Moen all year? Now DD on the other hand. People see he’s getting points but don’t seem to question that he’s always given the chance to play with some of the best wingers on the team. I don’t think it’s very fair that Martin just gives DD these golden opportunities but eventhough Eller has shown as much hustle and flashes of skill, gets the shaft.

    • “he was never a blue chip prospect and has had very limited scoring stats prior to the nhl.”

      False. His production levels in the AHL were better than Plekanec’s at the same age, and his numbers in the SEL at 19 were fantastic. Daniel Alfredsson had trouble even staying in the lineup at the same age.

      He’s already been playing as the #2 center since his Gomez was hurt in game 6.

      ______________________________
      Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
      http://mobro.co/AndrewBerkshire

  28. Ali says:

    Anyone else read Stubb’s piece on Lucic vs Miller? Dave, before calling out the sabres for not reacting, look at the team you cover! This team has been bending over for the Bruins and other teams who run Price for years!

    • Danno says:

      I read it and I thought it was very good. It’s fair comment and I think if you read between the lines he is criticizing the Habs for their lack of pushback too.

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  29. Habsrule1 says:

    I think this needs to be posted up here:
    Martin St Louis in his first 69 games:4G, 16A
    DD in his first 65 games: 11G, 8A
    DD may never be as good as MSL but let’s give the guy a chance. They actually even started in the NHL at the same age of 22-23!

    This being said, we could use more size so if we can get something for him, I’d listen.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • savethepuck says:

      Refer to my reply to Marc10 @ 5:00 Pm

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

    • CanadienBoy says:

      I’m with you on that one Gomez got to go because too many small center and DD could very well put up the same # as Gomez in is prime and does not have the ware and tare of a 30 + small players get

    • Martin St. Louis: one of the fastest and elusive skaters in the NHL

      David Desharnais: average to below average speed, constantly knocked off the puck with ease.

      ______________________________
      Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
      http://mobro.co/AndrewBerkshire

  30. HardHabits says:

    I don’t know how anybody could say that DD plays small. If anything he’s exploding right before our very eyes. Whose to say he couldn’t fill a spot in two Cup winning teams. Yeah so he needs to be propped up by two big power forwards. But that just rounds out the picture in a big way. DD is fine with those two mountains up front as far as I can see.

  31. Stev.R says:

    Campoli skated lightly last week. Any idea what that means? How long do you think til he’s back.

  32. HardHabits says:

    Scoring chances is to hockey what close is to horseshoes.

    If anybody remembers the Red Army team of the 70’s you’d say they had few scoring chances. Yet they won games. Why? Because they had a ridiculously high scoring ratio per shot taken. Never regressed to the mean either. Why? Because they chose their shots, refraining from shooting from all angles and the periphery. Generally when they shot it was already in the net.

    Last I remembered games were counted by goals scored and not scoring chances. Maybe they can come up with a new way of scoring. Goals can be worth three and scoring chances could be worth 1. Bring on those 43-37 scores.

    • savethepuck says:

      Hard to compare scoring chances in that era to scoring chances in today’s game. I was born in 65, I was a goaltender, and no matter how great I thought Ken Dryden or Tretiak, or other tenders were, you just have to look at the old replays to see that goaltending has changed in a dramatic fashion.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

    • VancouverHab says:

      Well, HH–that’s a clever analogy but an apples-to-oranges one.

      Scoring chances to goals scored are like corner kicks to goals scored in soccer. A team with higher corner kicks can say that they are doing penetration and possession better than an opponent. It is obviously (barring some future new study methodology) a loose metric, but it is prima facie indicative (in some form) of success relative to goals.

      Likewise of scoring chances is hockey — it is obviously not the whole picture but it some meaningful relevance to goals.

    • Ah yes, making sweeping judgements based on a handful of games. How many games has anyone here seen the 1970′s red army teams play? I’m guessing an absolute maximum of 20.

      ______________________________
      Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
      http://mobro.co/AndrewBerkshire

  33. Marc10 says:

    Love the DD hate fest. Now he’s peaking and a journeyman…

    If Marty St Louis or Daniel Briere could become superstars after a slow start to their careers, maybe DD can become a decent 2nd liner. Who can really say what his ceiling is and where he’ll ‘peak’.

    He’s a good player and he’s not the problem, but I appreciate he’s a local boy who isn’t big, particularly fast and that’s going to rile up some people.

    I think the odd man out is Gomer in this equation. Eller will eventually get to play with big wingers too. It’s only a matter if time before that happens.

    • savethepuck says:

      I remember a comparison of DD to St. Louis last year in the Hockey News when they showed that Marty didn’t make the NHL until he was the same age as DD was last year. A lot of people forget that. It historically takes a smaller player longer to establish himself as a legitimate NHL’er. I’m not about to put DD in Marty’s caliber, but I can understand your point. Gio was late to be successful in the NHL because of the same reasons and his size(same article).

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

    • Trisomy 21 says:

      Don’t misinterpret hate for DD with my desire for equal opportunity for Eller. He could become another big bodied forward we’ve dreamt of (am I bold as to say like Cole? Eller has a decent shot and has a couple moves in his arsenal). Alas, JM buries him on the depth chart. I’m just a fan of Lars and I don’t like to see someone less deserving (Although DD’s game last night makes this harder to say) getting the better line mates.
      I do understand that it’s hard to give ice time to all the prospects, but I mean come on, just one week with Eller between Cole and Max. (drooly face)

    • SmartDog says:

      +1

      ————————————-
      Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

  34. SmartDog says:

    Hey Berkshire,

    I’ll try to get past your holier-than-thou “you don’t know what you’re looking at” BS – saying you have the lock on insight just makes you look arrogant.

    But to your point that DD is only performing because he plays with Cole and Patches. So a) how do you explain Gomez, who (used to) play with only top six forwards and his numbers are no better (probably worse) than what DD has done and b) do you take into account the fact that DD is not a top 6 forward, but has been moved into that role because of injury and taking that into account, has performed quite well. He may NOT be a top six forward and that shows in some ways but his passing and general vision of his linemates is excellent – and I’ve seen that in every game I’ve watched (which is most games). I’m not saying he’s perfect, he makes mistakes, he gets pushed off the puck, but the offense/attack and play-making aspects of his game are to me easily top 6. I agree if only the rest of his game could be at that level… and sometimes though it does seem to be.

    For sure, I think he needs to get stronger. He should hang with Gallagher and his dad. That kid has strength in a small package.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • HardHabits says:

      Don’t argue with Berkshire SD. He pours over complex algorithmic and linear algebraic stats, not to mention pie charts, so he has proof. He has proof that DD sucks because he took so few shots and his goal was luck. He has proof I tell’s ya. Proof. He also knows more because his friends tell him so. It’s true. Facts baby.

      All you got is your two year plus iron man record for being right about Gomez all along. Where’s the proof in that. According to corsi and stats-monkey Gomez is worth every penny. His scoring chances are off the chart. Just last night he created a few of them. There was the scoring chance that Weber buried and the scoring chance in OT where he made his patented pass to nobody. The puck got turned over and Nashville almost scored at the other end. Gomez is a scoring chance machine.

    • VancouverHab says:

      Hello again, Smart Dog.

      Please don’t snarl or bite me, I just want to engage a point here.

      I’m not fine-grained guy when it comes to professional sports (I love it for the relaxation and tribalism). So at the rough-grain level, my remembrance of Gomez is that whenever he has played with Patches & Gio over the last two years, the line has been highly productive. But what happens is that whenever there has been an injury on any two of the other top three lines, JM gives Gomez Moen or Darche. So Gomez production goes down, but (in JM’s view) the full team balance is thus optimised.

      I would be sure that a study would show that Scott Gomez has played the bulk of the last two years with a non-Patches-or-Cole-level scorer. AND, the production problem is hightened by Gionta’s horrible production over these two years…which is clearly now not caused by Gomez.

      And it does seem to me that DD gets sheltered by being played exclusively with studly wingers: JM clearly doesn’t think (& I agree) that DD can “carry” a line–he needs strong players and weak match-ups for him to be effective in the NHL. Time will tell, of course, but on present evidence, that’s how it seems from a thumbnail perspective.

      And why do so many of you HATE Gomez? Obvious: it’s racism. You all think that Hispanic immigrants and their offspring are lazy ne’er-do-wells that sponge off white people’s society.

      Don’t be hatin’, you bigots.

      (You see the point here….)

      • SmartDog says:

        I’m all for disagreement. It’s rudeness that brings out the snarl in me.

        There was one stretch with Patches and Gio where Gomez production was good. It was a long stretch – like 20 games just before (I think) the Chara boo boo. But I think watching Patches, we can say that whoever he plays with seems to have a better time of it. Just like whoever plays with Pleks for a time (especially versus Gomez) seems to have their production go up.

        So if you’ve got a guy making… let’s just say making a high salary… but he needs two particular guys ONLY to be productive (and even so we haven’t seen them together long enough to say that would last), isn’t that a real question mark? Not to mention the guy is supposed to be a top six center and goes 20-30 games without a goal. And leads (or almost leads) the team in minus-play. And plays a windy east-west game while the rest of the team is playing a hustling north-south game. And he makes blind passes routinely. And….

        I’m not making this stuff up, sure Gomez when he’s on can make some sweet plays and passes, but his hit rate for these is too low, and the misses are costly. And yes he can gain the zone but he does it while making everyone wait for him, and often as not gains the zone and either loses the puck or makes a bad pass.

        His numbers don’t lie. I’ve seen him have good games – be really engaged, back-check like a demon, play positionally smart…etc. But those games are like 1 in 10. I think its’ telling that he apologized last year repeatedly for his play and then came out specifically when the season was over, addressed the media and said “I will be better”. But for the time he’s been back, he had one or two good games. The rest was vintage (last year) Gomez. Not that involved, hopeful passes that miss the mark, nothing especially positive.

        Seriously, I don’t get this guy because as much as I’ve been right about how much of a suckfest he would be, I thought his pride would kick in after last year and he would look like a guy who doesn’t want to punch his ticket to the minors. who knows? Maybe he’ll pick it up by Xmas. But I’d put money against it. I think he’s just done. If this is his best after an off-season of hard work… I mean, what else is there to say? Surely 1 assist and minus 2 over 7 games must be having even his teammates shaking their heads, dontcha think?

        SD

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • The answer is simple, and if you would read what I type instead of constantly being irrational, you would have the answer already.

      1) Gomez didn’t play with top 6 forwards all last year. In fact most of the year Moen was on his wing.

      2) Quality of competition: Desharnais is currently playing against 3rd and 4th lines with two of the team’s best wingers. Something Gomez has never done before.

      3) Gomez had a crap offensive year. However if you want to compare the two over the course of their careers, at 25 Gomez didn’t play in the NHL because of the lockout, but at 24, the year DD broke into the league, Gomez put up 70 points on a trap team in the dead puck era.

      It has nothing to do with being arrogant SD, it has everything to do with you being repetitive and ignoring any information that doesn’t agree with your opinion (95% of information). You’re unable to separate reality from perception, and it makes you look foolish.

      ______________________________
      Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
      http://mobro.co/AndrewBerkshire

      • SmartDog says:

        Wow You are a CHARMER!!!

        Are you sure you’re not pulling this stuff out of your nether region, because it sure looks that way.

        Gomez didn’t play with top 6 forwards? Well then I guess I’m remembering the last two years ALL wrong. And Moen… would that be the guy who is playing with rookies and is one of the top scorers on our team this year? Maybe playing with Gomez was half his problem.

        I’ve just concluded what many on here have Berkshire. Talking to you is a waste of time. Go back to your slide ruler and have fun! Stay away from people. Complex, messy people with opinions that just don’t agree with your genius.

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

  35. Ferguson-22 says:

    Just back from the Dogs game against the baby sens (5-2 Dogs). Pretty entertaining game. Leblanc (2 goals) has some nice moves. Most impressed by Willsie: lots of hustle and some good hits (plus scored the first goal).

  36. Trisomy 21 says:

    My mind is made up on Diaz, I don’t think he should be starting in the line up. He did have bright spots but also some bad giveaways, and I believe 1/4 of the season is a long enough trial to see he’s not up to par yet. Potential he may have, but ready he is not. Whether Emelin is ready or not, I don’t know, but I think Diaz needs to hone his positioning and playmaking in the AHL for a while, in the mean time give Emelin a shot. If he doesn’t pan out, well we should have some injured players coming back in the next couple of weeks anyways right?

    • kempie says:

      Exactly. Plus Diaz is waiver exempt ATM.

      • Mick says:

        Emelin who? We may never know what he could become because of the idiot behind the bench.

        • Habsrule1 says:

          These types of posts make me laugh. Some dude sitting on his couch eating cheetos calling a Jack Adams trohy winner, who has coached over 1200 games in the NHL, winning more than half, an idiot when it comes to hockey.

          Never ceases to amaze. That’s why I love this site.

          Go Habs Go!!

          “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • Da Hema says:

      It is shocking to see how a gentle breeze can knock the puck from Diaz in the defensive zone. Diaz does not appear even to possess the strength to lift the stick of an opponent let alone perform puck pursuit along the boards as a defenceman in the NHL must be able to do. I know he has an offensive upside, but he is small in relation to NHL forwards let alone defencemen. If we had Larry Robinson playing we could absorb (or at least conceal the weaknesses of) a player like Diaz. But, of course, we don’t.

    • Boomer says:

      when campoli or markov come back he’ll be sent down to Hamilton, i think he has a two way contract, might be wrong there, the guy has potential though, i hope we dont give up on him

      Boom baby!

      • Un Canadien errant says:

        Mr. Diaz has a one-way contract, but that’s not an important consideration in this matter. All it means is that he will be paid his salary of $900 000 whether here or in Hamilton. His salary will come off the Canadiens cap total if he is sent down.

        What does matter is that he is waiver-exempt, so the Canadiens can send him down to the farm team and recall him as often as they want, as they can do with Mr. Palushaj, but were not able to do with Mr. Woywitka.

        For those who accuse the Canadiens/Geoff Molson of not spending money to win, let’s consider that the offer of a one-way contract probably had a big influence in Mr. Diaz’ and his agent’s decision to sign with Montreal. If they had cheaped out and offered a two-way contract, the offer might not have been accepted, and he may have signed with another team. That the Canadiens didn’t mind paying him his full salary in Hamilton if need be is a positive sign of the direction of the team.

        Bookmark the link below, it gives a lot of info you can refer to with respect to the Canadiens’ roster and salary cap situation, for now and in the future.

        http://www.capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=2

        ———————————
        How about it NHL? No fighting, just hockey?

        http://relentlessineptitude.blogspot.com/

        • Bill J says:

          Previous owner also had a big wallet, but yeah thank the ghosts of the forum that PKP didn’t buy the Habs.


          If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

          Go Habs Go!

    • Bill says:

      Well, JM loves Diaz, so don’t hold your breath. Maybe we can get Jessica to ask JM why he won’t use a big, strong D-man who likes to hit when he’s icing the softest D in the league?

      Full Breezer 4 Life

    • savethepuck says:

      I think Marky is close to returning and I think Diaz and Emelin are the 2 odd men out. I’m curious to see what the organization does.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

    • Gerry H says:

      I’d wager that Diaz goes to the Bulldogs when Markov returns, notwithstanding the fact that he has had more ice time than Emelin. With the stability that 79’s return will bring to the D, JM will look to the seventh D for a shift in the flavour of the Habs blue line, i.e. grit, when the opponent demands it. He hasn’t had that option to-date, due mainly to the overall weakness and inexperience of the Habs’ defensive core in the absence of Markova and Campoli, and the substandard play of PK so far.

    • SmartDog says:

      I think he and Emelin are both learning both show some strong points to their game and both could turn out to be real assets. But I can’t stand that Emeline gets benched more because (it seems) Diaz’s more conservative style of play suits Martin. If we lose another good prospect (Emelin) because of Martin I’m gonna. Well… I’m gonna nothin. I already wish Martin was gone, it’s not like that’s gonna change. Jacques Martin – the most consistently
      mediocre coach in all of hockeydom.

      ————————————-
      Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

  37. Habsrule1 says:

    I like this team! Is anyone else on the bandwagon? It’s lonely all by myself :-(

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

    • Danno says:

      The bandwaggon has a wheel in the ditch and a wheel on the track

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

      • Habsrule1 says:

        LOL nice one. That’s from half of the fans jumping off cause the Habs are not 10 points in front of the rest of the league. That’s all some people would accept.

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • OneTimer says:

          If you’re only a fan when your team is 10 pts ahead of the rest of the league, I’d say you’re not a fan at all. A real fan sticks with the club “true tick and tin”, as they say in my home province. ;)

    • savethepuck says:

      Whoever is the mechanic who looks after the Habs bandwagon must make a fortune replacing shocks on it, because it has a lot of weight on and of it. I’m with you though thinking this team will at minimum be fighting for 1st place in the NorthEast at the end of the season.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

      • habstrinifan says:

        “I’m with you though thinking this team will at minimum be fighting for 1st place in the NorthEast at the end of the season. ”

        WOW! Not only are you ON he bandwagon, you are all dressed up and ready for it to be the lead float.

        Hope you are RIGHT! It would be an absolute blast to be riding that high going into the playoffs with teams fearing our wicked playoff aura.

    • SmartDog says:

      Hold down the fort. We’ll all catch up with you one day. I agree there are lots of good pieces, but to me there are problems to be solved before we’re going anywhere big. Getting a healthy Markov back (if such a thing exists), would be one big step.

      ————————————-
      Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

  38. ProHabs says:

    Read some of the comments on the Sabres website from the article above. The fans are not happy with the Sabres reaction after the Lucy hit and are calling the Sabres soft. Interesting read.

  39. showey47 says:

    Al’s got a couple of huge breaks on that over turned fumble call and a marginal interference call which turned into a TD.

  40. the jacques says:

    I gave the guys the day off so i could go to staples to stack up on notepads.

    If you smell what the jacques is cooking.

    • Danno says:

      I loved the way you remained silent and did your best wax-museum dummy imitation during Nashville’s time out last night.

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  41. Hobie Hansen says:

    It will be interesting to see this team with their complete lineup.

    With today’s NHL and all the injuries it may be difficult to get a 100% healthy lineup going for an extended period. Some believe it might be even more difficult to do so with a smaller and more vulnerable team.

    If Markov returns and gets back to at least close to where he once was, that will make a noticeable difference to our Habs. I seriously hope he plays 3rd pair duty and PP minutes for the first five games. After that his time has to be managed very closely and carefully. Even If it takes 40 games for him to find his grove!

    Cole has looked good the last little while and Pacioretty obviously looks real good. Some players are up and down and a couple have had bad starts.

    If Montreal gets 100% healthy and the players play at the level they’re capable of, they could do some damage.

    There’s still two spots for concern though. Out closest rivals know that if Montreal is leaned on and the game turns physical it is to Montreal’s disadvantage.

    The defense is still missing a real rugged defenseman and the bottom two lines are missing another player like Moen or two! White will make a difference when he comes back, whenever that might be but even still, the Habs could use someone a weight-class above a Moen or White.

    The Bruins just displayed “Again” last night that they’re going to play rough and physical hockey and use it towards their advantage. They run into goaltenders, beat up on players and they use those tactics to pump up their team, intimidate the other team and swing the momentum in their favor.

    Standing up to the Bruins and some other similar teams is a tough chore and Montreal can sometimes get them on the run if they’re playing a perfectly executed hockey but the chance of that isn’t always high.

    Like I said, a couple bigger bodies to give the Habs a little more resilience and an “all for one” attitude against clubs like Boson would take this team to the next level.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      Good post Hobie. It’s nice to see some positivity once in a while. I’m sure it’s just Habs-coloured glasses to most though.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  42. jimmy shaker says:

    Who would you chaps rather have as the 4th line center?

    Metropolit, halpern, betts or noki?

    Shaker

  43. The_Franchise31 says:

    Making the Habs worse doesn’t make the picks we trade for better… And I’d much rather stay mediocre and let those young guys develop in the ahl then rush them in to fast…. And who exactly are these leaders/stars that we will sign that you speak of?

  44. NightRyder says:

    Gomez should have his name legally changed to 0-0-0 -1

  45. Bripro says:

    There’s a lot of knotted undershorts on this site today.

  46. Stephan Cooper checks in with goal projections for the rest of the season: http://www.habseyesontheprize.com/2011/11/13/2558159/habs-goal-projections-for-2011-12-season

    ______________________________
    Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
    http://mobro.co/AndrewBerkshire

    • Bripro says:

      I would contradict two of his stats.
      Moen is playing beyond his level, but his confidence is such that if he continues, he could hit 15 – 18 goals this year. Maybe even 20.
      I know he’s late in his career, but other power forwards like John Leclair, didn’t realize they could score until at least a few years of playing.
      And I think DD is slowly waking up, and should be able to pot a dozen.
      He certainly has the hands for it. And if he stays with Cole and Max, look for all three to up their stats.

      • Sorry, but neither of those things are going to happen. Moen is shooting at 23.81%. He’s never going to sustain that.

        And Desharnais isn’t even producing a single shot per game, in spite of playing against tertiary competition and with the best and biggest wingers on the team.

        ______________________________
        Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
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        • CanadienBoy says:

          Sorry but DD at 10pt in 16 game will give 50 to 60 at years end not bad for a young kid learning to play in the NHL

          • And his production has been almost entirely due to his linemates carrying him, combined with a ridiculous amount of luck. Producing 1 shot in 5 games is unacceptable for a player getting that much PP time and his favourable matchups.

            ______________________________
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          • Trisomy 21 says:

            A monkey could get 50 assists playing with Max/Cammy and Cole all year long.

          • Habsrule1 says:

            I do not understand anyone having ANY problem with DD’s play. He has been beyond good this season. As far as his linematescarrying him, DD is the one going to the net and getting the chances from in close.
            All this and he’s a rookie still learning to play to the NHL speed and against bigger players.
            Nothing but hats off to DD.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Not a single thing you said there was true HR1. DD is 25 years old, he’s already peaking. He’s no some green rookie, he’s basically a journeyman.

            ______________________________
            Seriousfan09 has started a Movember team named McPhee’s Irregulars. Donate to him, or me or the team to raise money for a great cause!
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          • Habsrule1 says:

            He’s still only played 50 or so games in the NHL. Whether you watch the games or not, I’m not sure, but I see him going to the net constantly and getting chances to score, much like the ones he has put in so far this year.
            No clue why you hate the guy so much, but he’s not the first small guy that was not a superstar in his first 50 games.
            Any idea how many goals & points St Louis had in his first 69 NHL games? Didn’t think so. He had 4G, 16A
            In DD’s first 65 he has 11G, 8A.
            He may never be anywhere as good as MSL, but give the guy a chance!

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • Bill says:

          Even if Desharnais could hit 50 points, there is just no place on the team for him. We can’t have three small to tiny centres. Eller is pretty raw, but I’d be happy with his game on the 2nd line and I think he’d produce reasonably well with DD’s wingers.

          It’s not entirely fair to say his wingers have carried him, because he’s a fine playmaker, it must be said. But he’s so one-dimensional it’s surprising that he’s visible in our universe.

          I’d trade DD for whatever I could get (2nd rounder like Grabovski?) and hand the third line to Gomez as soon as White is ready to return.

          Full Breezer 4 Life

    • V says:

      Good article. Well worth the read… like most of the articles on that site.

      I don’t post comments there because it’s a bit of a pain to get signed up. I know you’re associated with it. Please tell the guys who produce it that I read it every day and really enjoy the site and contributors.

      • I will do that, and thanks. It was so long ago since I signed up that I can’t even remember if it’s tough to sign up. It’s well worth it though, I think you should do it! The commenting system is excellent, you even get to see which comments are new, and the comments show up live without refreshing.

        ______________________________
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  47. novahab says:

    How to change the game and turn the NHL on its head. Mr. Molson it very simple. The fans of the Canadiens want to see fast exciting intertaining hockey . What the media used to call fire wagon hockey. Over the summer under complete secretacy take out the first row of seats and make the ice suface bigger. What is Bettman going to do stop you from playing shut down the most storied team in league history. The larger ice surface will create so much excitment . Can you imgine the buzz the complete uproard. Lets be the Montreal Canadiens of old lets do something exciting. This whole league is turning into a bore and benching clearing brawls are not the answer.

    • V says:

      You are on to something. (You are probably also on something, but let’s not concern ourselves with that right now)

      I say keep going and take out the next 50 rows and turn it into a football field. Astro turf and the whole thing.

      Imagine teams showing up with skates on and charging out of the tunnel to go tumbling head over heels at the 50 year line. We’ve got 11 guys on the field and they only have 6 – and one of them can barely move with all the goalie gear on.

      Now with only 6000 seats left, ticket prices are going up. But it would be so worth paying an extra 300-400 dollars a ticket to see that kind of mismatch. Until the league and other teams figure it out, we are back in the dynasty business baby.

  48. kempie says:

    Lars Eller reminds me of a young Mats Sundin. Minus the point a game average part I guess but it’s still early. Oh, and Shea Weber is an completely scary monster.

  49. Bripro says:

    The major problem with Gomez is that he doesn’t follow JM’s game plan. Actually, he doesn’t really follow any game plan.
    I find him very effective in his transition game and his success in clearing the puck out of our end.
    OK so last night he boo booed! But he hadn’t played in seven games.
    How sharp would we be?
    He needs to be a little more predictable for his team mates.
    His third period set up play could have had goal written all over it if someone had followed him and knew where he was going.
    All in all, for his first game back, we’ll give him a passing grade.
    If he’s still pointless in 3-4 games, I might change my review.
    I know….that would mean flip-flopping. Not like that ever happens on this site.

  50. Mr. Biter says:

    Obviously all the SG, PG, and JM haters took last night off and are back with a vengence.

    Mr. Biter

  51. Danno says:

    Why did Martin play Gomez – a guy who can’t score – in overtime after he failed to cover his man (Shea Weber)? Then during the four on four, Gomez does his pass to nobody from behind the net resulting in a turnover which could have cost us the game. I don’t get it.

    ________________________________________

    “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

    • neumann103 says:

      I actually thought Gomez had some bright spots in the first and third periods, but you do wonder how long would Eller be in the doghouse and publicly called out by the coach for half of the lapses Gomez commits?

      “Et le but!”

    • Derek2 says:

      Clearly he missed his man on the goal. But regarding the rush he made in overtime, why wasn’t anybody else following him into the offensive zone to be in position to take a pass?

      Our chief weapons are fear and surprise

      • showey47 says:

        Maybe they were changing on the fly? But that was a stupid pass by gomez. A play like that in 4 on 4 hockey guarantees and odd man rush the other way which the preds nearly scored on.

    • Bripro says:

      I don’t think he was passing from behind the net. I think he was trying to bank it off the goalie’s pad.

  52. SmartDog says:

    Thoughts about last night/the Habs.

    1. Patches. Great goal by him. Takes his time, in close. Zing!
    2. Cole. Cole’s playing well. A better addition than I thought, but he’s sort of a big body with so-so hands. On that set-up in front of the net the RDS guys were making such a big deal about the goalie getting over quickly but Cole was slow like molasses to shoot. A one-timer would’ve gone in if it hit the right third of the net.
    3. DD. It really pissed me off after the last game when everyone was saying how DD wasn’t a factor, he’s finding himself too small, was shut down etc. After ONE not-so-great game. This includes media guys. How do people flip-flop so quickly. anyway, great to see DD come back with such a strong game.
    4. Pleks. Pleks point streak was snapped last night. Too bad. But he’s still my favorite hab to watch. He still does nothing spectacularly well – but EVERYTHING well. I think because of this he’s the kind of player that will get better and better into his early 30’s as his well-rounded game just gets better by inches each year.
    5. PK. Great game by PK. That overtime goal shows why he’s such a keeper on this team. Draws all the attention to himself and then dishes to a sniper. Brilliant.
    6. Budaj. I didn’t like this move, I admit it. But it’s looking pretty good so far. Great game by our back-up.
    7. a +2 game for Gorges, Patches and DD. Nuff said.

    SD

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • DD was being ragged on because he’s continually given the best wingers on the team, against soft competition and he has been garbage for 6 straight games.

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      • SmartDog says:

        Garbage for six straight games…? WTF? What are you smoking this morning? The whole team had a couple of week games. Did he suck when he scored on Boston?

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • I can assure you that I’m not smoking anything. If you had any idea what to look for you’d see what I’m seeing as well.

          Yes, he did suck against Boston. One play doesn’t determine if a player is playing well or not. Just like his two scoring chances last night don’t erase the fact that he was barely above water at even strength, carried by the two best wingers on the team, while playing against the Predators’ 3rd line.

          Meanwhile we have player like Eller, who consistently gets the scraps in wingers, and plays against secondary competition while Plekanec handles the top job. Desharnais is put in a position almost any semi-talented player in the NHL would succeed, and so far in half the season’s games he’s been underwhelming. For most of the last few weeks he’s looked like an AHLer.

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      • roady says:

        7 points in last 8 games ‘aint too shabby…

        take your drink to the end of the bar buddy…come on now, don’t be a fool…

        • 2 points in the last 4, ONE shot in 5 games.

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          • roady says:

            he’s obviously not the shooter, 11 in 16 games, and if we had some finish on this team he’d be the point leader.

            take your drink to the end of the bar buddy…come on now, don’t be a fool…

          • It doesn’t matter if he’s not a designated sniper/shooter. Can you name a single player in the last decade who finished top 150 in the NHL in points with fewer shots than games played? No.

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    • V says:

      There. We agree on something. I like DD as well. Agree he has not been good every night and has his challenges. But a great story and someone who clearly knows how to rise to the challenges of a new league – he’s still learning.

      I bet he’s more consistent and having even bigger impact by year’s end.

      • SmartDog says:

        Agreed. DD is not always great, but he’s a rookie and for that, and for what he’s paid he’s been delivering.

        There’s a difference between someone making $1 million a year only having one great game out of every few than someone who is getting 3 or 4 (or even 7). Sure it would be great if he put up bigger numbers but he’s totally lived up to expectations and his numbers aren’t bad.

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • neumann103 says:

      Agree all round.

      My Thoughts

      1. Agree about Max Pac. Great decision, patience and finish. But PK created that scoring chance out of thin air.
      2. I liked the Cole signing from the start. Yes it is too much money for too long but he fills the precise gap that existed in a free agent year where little in that niche was available. Very fast for the type of player he is. The points will come, but he is the type of player who contributes even when not scoring. And getting better (more comfortable)?
      3. I am more in the Eller camp than the DD camp (faster, stronger, more balanced, better long term prospect, a natural center) but DD keeps pointing out the nonsense of the idea that an arbitrary height limit makes you an AHLer for life. He made one incredibly great behind the net play that didn’t result in a goal but should have.
      4. Plekanec is my favorite player in the NHL. Period. For overall balance in every aspect of the game he is remarkable.
      5. Let PK be PK!
      6. Budaj is an upgrade over Auld. I thought so in the summer, the pre-season was generally non-representative of everything, and he has played well when actually in games. Should be 2-0. I still go back to my 2010 question: why not Biron for less money instead of Auld, but I think Budaj has the potential to spell Price and god forbid, well you know…

      “Et le but!”

  53. SmartDog says:

    Did you see the TSN highlights from last night?
    They show Gomez on the Predators goal like this… “watch Scott Gomez”.. and then they show how he’s chasing the puck and leaves his man free to score. I hate Gomez more every time I see him. Loser.

    ————————————-
    Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • V says:

      Here is an interesting pop quiz.

      Person A makes 7.5 million a year playing the game he loves. He seems very happy doing it.

      Person B likely makes a very, very, very tiny percentage of that unhappily obsessing about the game Person A plays.

      Question: Who is the loser?

      • SmartDog says:

        Wow. That’s REALLY REALLY funny. I’m so impressed.
        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • V says:

          Thanks I guess. Gomez just does not strike me as a loser. Seems well adjusted, rich, playing the game he loves in a great town. Team mates seem to really like him.

          Trying to find the loser in all that and can’t.

      • HardHabits says:

        Here is another interesting pop quiz.

        Person A makes 7.5 million comments a day about a player whose game sucks. He seems to very consistent about it.

        Person B makes a very, very, very small minded comment about it as if unhappily obsessing about the fact that Person A is correct.

        Question: Who is the loser?

        • SmartDog says:

          Thanks at least for the consistent part.

          Can we add that person A also makes other constructive, sometimes interesting or insightful comments that are appreciated by many.

          So what if Gomer is my whipping boy. If ever there was someone who deserved it, it’s him.

          ————————————-
          Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • V says:

          Now you’ve got me thinking. Because no one on the site knows small-minded like you do.

    • Yeah, Gomez made a play on run of the mill point shot from a non-scoring area and got burned by bad luck in Weber getting off a perfect shot. Man he sucks. He’s so bad that for the first time all season the 4th line spent more time in the offensive zone than the defensive one. So bad that his first two touches on the puck in the game produced scoring chances. Your obsession is so blind you might as well be smacking your head against a wall instead of watching hockey.

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      • SmartDog says:

        I thought he had an okay game. I didn’t see the brilliance you are suggesting. And of course he finished -1 but we all know that numbers lie when it comes to Scott Gomez right?

        So you’re saying while we had an extra man, it was a “lucky shot” that beat Budaj, and not the fact that Gomez was out of position? You’re the blind one Berkie. No matter how good a game you think he played, his mistake was directly a cause of that goal.

        ————————————-
        Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

        • I did not say brilliant. I pointed out several plays that were very good.

          And +/- is largely a useless stat.

          Yes it was a lucky shot, or unlucky for the Habs. If you’re looking for someone to blame for that goal, look towards Martin who decided Brian Gionta would be taking a defensive zone faceoff.

          Blaming Gomez for that goal is ridiculous, whether you believe he misses his assignment or not. 99/100 times a shot from where Weber was is a routine stop. It was not a scoring chance.

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          • SmartDog says:

            An open shot from the top of the circle is not a scoring chance?
            That makes zero sense.

            Watch the clip. Total awesome scoring chance, and Gomez is obviously the free man who could’ve been covering that side.
            http://www.tsn.ca/nhl/story/?id=380321
            ————————————-
            Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

          • No, that isn’t a scoring chance. The angle is not great and there’s no screen. It was a perfect shot. Now if Gomez was a step quicker and intercepted that pass, which looks like what he was going for, does anyone bash him? I doubt it.

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          • jimmy shaker says:

            Actually that shot, so precisely placed and with the zip weber had on it would go in on any tender in the league 9 out of 10 times. Budaj was out past the paint and weber still got it by him, the only place where it had a chance….far corner right above peter’s pad and under his glove. Great shot and great goal, but someone on the ice needed to cover weber in that situation, so blame gomez or the other forward, blown assignment period!

            Shaker

          • Shaker, 9/10 times Weber doesn’t place that shot in that exact space. half the time he probably misses the net.

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    • Stev.R says:

      I think it was more a lack of communication with the other winger. When I played, we had atleast one play where the wingers crossed off the faceoff. Weber would have been the other wingers responsibility. I don’t know if this is the play they were supposed to be running but it could have been. In which case it would not have been Gomez’s fault.

  54. People saying Miller is a wuss are really missing the point. His job isn’t to fight or be physical, and it shouldn’t be. That’s stupid. He’s there to stop pucks and he happens to be really good at it. He’s also a goaltender that relies more on speed and reflexes than explosiveness (like Price), which means he’s really damn skinny. He’s a tiny guy who Lucic took advantage of in a vulnerable position.

    Watching the play, when Miller spun around after the hit I kept hoping his goalie stick would catch Milan in the face or something and break his jaw. At least that would make him think twice.

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    • SmartDog says:

      Didn’t see the clip but just read about it.
      This kills me. Can you imagine a Hab running the goalie like that? Would PK do it? Nope. The Bruins to crap like this so much and are used to getting away with it. I liked Ruff’s comments – “if it’s open season on goaltenders, let’s get at it”. Could you imagine Martin if someone ran Price? “Well, I thought maybe it was a bigger penalty, but it’s up to the league to call those things.” zzzzzz Martin the underwhelming leader.

      ————————————-
      Listen to the Smart Dog. He knows his poop!

    • The Cat says:

      Well I said todays goalies are wusses, I mean considering how the game is going where a speeding train can collide with you and all he gets is two minutes, Id tell my goalie to sacrifice a few games suspension -if need be- in favour of the bad ass aura which would serve well in the long run. I know Im a goon, I prefer old time goonery to todays almost life threatening cheapshots…And when players were in Billy Smith’s crease, they tried to get out of there fast :)

      [Disclaimer]: I’m a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.

    • Mr. Biter says:

      Funny part is Buffalo’s enforcer (Gaustad) was on the ice and later “regretted” not getting ivolved. Rupp was also quoted about Gaustad not doing his job. Is Gaustad becomming a vegetarian? BTW what would be the responses here if Lutwit did that to Price, no one could do anything.

      Mr. Biter

      • The dumbest part about that is I think Gaustad is just as tough as Lucic is in a fight, he’s just not a maniac who tries to hurt people all the time, and he didn’t keep beating someone for a full minute after they’d separated their shoulder, so he doesn’t have the same BS reputation Lucic does.

        If that happens to Price it depends who’s on the ice at the time. Moen would probably do something, most other players wouldn’t. Either way it wouldn’t have been as big of a deal because Price is significantly bigger and stronger than Miller.

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        • Mr. Biter says:

          Agree with you about Gaustad not being a jerk like Lutwit (Lutwit is the biggest jerk in the league) but that is his job to look after Miller and according to Rupp he knows why he’s here and did not do his job. Not a great endoresment from your coach.

          Mr. Biter

          • I think that’s just emotion from Ruff. Lindy Ruff is whiny and annoying but not stupid. Gaustad is a faceoff specialist and very good 4th line grinder who can contribute goals at ES. Not a goon.

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          • Mr. Biter says:

            Just quoting Gaustad and Rupp. Lutwit also was quoted that if someone ran a Broon goalie like he did there would be retribution.

            Mr. Biter

  55. Ian Cobb says:

    Response to JF. Not in depth because I am heading out to watch the Als and Dallas, Buffalo games.

    Yes I am very disappointed the way Martin has the boys playing this year. More reasons than I can post right now.

    But this is a 22 man roster, a TEAM if you will. Martin does not use all his talent. The amount of players that Martin has dismissed over the past 3 years is simply amazing. In order to have this group of players today. We should be battling for the league lead this year, not fighting to keep our feet out of the bottom of the barrel. He has forwards playing defense and defense playing forward. He plays Plekanec to the point of exhaustion and so much more. Martin will be replaced at the end of this year for sure. But that is after two of the better assit. coaches have left the organization, Boucher and Muller.

    This team should be playing so much better it makes me ill to watch. More later!

    • Habfan4lfe says:

      You are bang on Ian but there is no reason to throw the season or other players away, the Molsons should get some balls and do it now. It is painful to watch talented players get wasted away. This is a storied franchise being thrown away to idiots.

    • piper says:

      I agree about Martin plus he seems to show no emotion and i think it rubs off on some of the players. Too bad we lost both Muller and Boucher, it would have been nice to have kept one or the other.

      • Habsrule1 says:

        Muller can still be offered an NHL job at year’s end, or any time for that matter. Why not in Montreal?

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • The Cat says:

        Absolutely. JM teams never play inspired hockey.

        [Disclaimer]: I’m a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.

        • Bill J says:

          Huh ? Not trying to defend him, but the ECF appearance begs to differ. That was all inspired hockey.


          If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

          Go Habs Go!

          • HardHabits says:

            Uninspired hockey of you ask me. The Habs were bombarded and over-whelmed. The Pens and Caps were stymied by Halak. Forget Cammy’s goals, Gorges and Gill blocking shots, etc. Take away Halak’s heroics and Washington advances. Game 6 in Round 1 was other-wordly.

          • The Cat says:

            Defending in your own end. holding onto dear life aint inspired….There was a guy in Sherbrooke when I was a kid who won a 500 000$ jackpot twice in one year. That guy’s number selecting skills equal the ECF run by Montreal. A fluke.

            [Disclaimer]: I’m a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.

          • Bill J says:

            Dave, the part that you took away was the inspired part, it can’t be taken away. It was precisely that, inspired hockey by a select group of Hab players.


            If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

            Go Habs Go!

          • piper says:

            sorry Bill, but that inspiration came from the horseshoe up Halaks arse. when it fell out in the third round so did the inspiration.
            Martin had SFA to do with it.

    • Ton says:

      Muller will never be head coach of the canadiens because we all know for what reason, it is what it is. Many teams by the way passed on Muller this year! Given that every other team in the leaque is trying to build a winner (they all do it through the draft by the way!) were not going to see one sided sam pollock deals anymore. Again your limited to whom can coach the canadiens>we had a legend in Gainey (people here were highly critical), we had top junior coaches (Jullien, Vignault, Terrien, etc) and they too never worked out. Times have changed Ian.

      • Habsrule1 says:

        Every team that needed a coach passed because he had no head coaching experience (perhaps other reasons but that was the main one). As far as the Habs not getting him, unfortunately you’re probably right. The French thing slipped my mind for a moment.
        Bring on Patrick Roy.

        Go Habs Go!!

        “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

        • Ton says:

          and its too bad because kirk would make a much better coach than patrick, gauranteed!

          • Mr. Biter says:

            If Kirk has a good year this year he will be in the NHL next year. Unfortunatly without us making the playoffs, it won’t be with us. Have said that I don’t want us not to make the playoffs so he won’t be here.

            Mr. Biter

    • JF says:

      Ian – I’m not a fan of Jacques Martin and have plenty of criticisms of him. Like many, I find his personnel decisions bizarre and at times plain wrong; I’d like him to show more emotion, defend his players when the officiating is bad, be generally more aggressive and dynamic; and I hate the way he has the team collapse into a defensive shell when protecting a one-goal lead in the third period. Nevertheless, I think he’s a better coach than most people on this site give him credit for. His team has been decimated by injuries all season and is missing their best defenceman, but he’s got them within reach of a playoff spot. The young guys who came up last year are doing well. After our horrendous start, we’re winning games. And I don’t think the accusation that he has “dismissed” players is justified. Every team has good players or players with potential who don’t fit in and are traded. It’s up to Gauthier to get a better return on those trades than he did for Sergei Kostitsyn and Maxim Lapierre.

      But the real problem is that at the moment there just is no one to replace JM. I want the Habs to know who they want as a successor and go after that person, not react too quickly to a slump and make a mistaken decision. I’m willing to see how the season plays out and, if we’re out of the playoff picture at the trade deadline, turn the team over to the youth, as two cents has said in a couple of recent posts. Trade most of our UFAs and overpaid veterans, stock pile draft picks and prospects, overhaul the coaching staff, and let the kids play.

  56. montreal ace says:

    I am loving the fact that I have not noticed the refs, so much the last couple of games.

    • Habfan4lfe says:

      I have, missing call after call. It’s like there is some golden rule that if the opposing team has 1 penalty they can’t call another one. I was surprised however that they didn’t call more ghost penalties seeing how this was the 1000’th game for their coach, plus it would have helped the American franchise. I guess Bettman was too busy with other things to call the refs to change it up.

    • habfanacrossthed says:

      Patrick Roy as GM would be my choice.

      GHOD – Go Habs Or Die

      • Mr. Biter says:

        Are you Ill? Take two Alieve, some Rum go to bed early and when you wake up you’ll forget about above post. He has no experience and we really need that?

        Mr. Biter

      • Ton says:

        never. a gm needs contacts, connections, relationships, roy was a loner and he was not the most liked in a dressing room. it was his character nothing wrong with that, loners can be winners just as much as someone who is liked and networks. better coach and than gm thats for sure.

  57. piper says:

    Good game last night by DD. I’ve been down on him and did not think he was strong and quick enough for this league. Last night he showed he could but I would still rather have a bigger cenre. Perhaps he may have some trade value.
    As far as the wee Swiss fellas……not so good.

  58. PureGuava says:

    Has there ever been a player that is in more need of a goal than Scott Gomez?

    “Of course I’m crazy, but that doesn’t mean I’m wrong.”
    – Robert Anton Wilson

  59. BKAK72 says:

    If you think the HABS have disappointed (overall) to date, then perhaps it is time to look at these two clubs and recognize the season is nowhere near finished:

    Boston 15 GP / 16 PTS
    Vancouver 17 GP / 17 PTS

    IMO by game #35 both the HABS and Bruins will be in the top 8 and the LEAFS and Panthers will be out.

    — HABS INSIDE/OUT R.I.P. –

  60. wildwilly says:

    A nice article from Down Goes Brown: http://www.downgoesbrown.com/

    Boston is built to play a specific game and they do it well. Montreal (and Buffalo) is built for a different game… The most effective way depends on the night.

  61. Habsrule1 says:

    4 out of 4 points on the road against teams that are not easy to score on, especially Rinne, and with our back-up in nets.
    How anyone can post negatives is beyond me, but that’s probably due to my Habs-coloured glasses.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  62. twilighthours says:

    I have wiped the NYR debacle from my memory, so 6 wins in last 7 games

    Still a long road to climb. Slightly less grim but still tough.

    Wish I knew what the plan is for the D. I’m not sold on Diaz like the rest of you. Frankly, I think Weber is better.

    • savethepuck says:

      Weber is better and younger with a larger upside. Weber is the most mentioned name on here as trade bait and if that happens, within a year, he’ll be the most mentioned name on here ahead of Ribiero, Grabovsky, and SK as the one this stupid organization let get away.

      “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
      Carey Price

      • Bill J says:

        If Weber is not traded, the same will be said of Diaz or Emelin. Weber has very good value, and people that believe he will be traded assume we would get fair market value.


        If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

        Go Habs Go!

        • Habsrule1 says:

          It’s hard to get what fans think is fair market value for a young D who has done almost nothing in the NHL. Unfortunately right now his value really is not that high. If we let him play and continue to improve then it may be high after this season, but he’s still no Shea Weber.

          Go Habs Go!!

          “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Bill J says:

            He will never be Shea, what a crazy comparison. And btw, who cares what fans say is fair market value ? They’re not in the market, NHL gm’s are!

            I know I brought up the fair market value topic, but I was speaking from the realistic vantage point, not the rose colored Hab glasses side.


            If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

            Go Habs Go!

          • Habsrule1 says:

            Actually, it is crazy but that’s what fans do. All the Halak fans thought we should be getting way more for Halak, but the fact w as he only had less than one very good season.
            I hope we keep all our young D, but if we trade them, we need to realize they may not have been worth as much as we thought.

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

          • Bill J says:

            On this I agree. I just can not see keeping all three (Diaz, Weber and Emelin) when Markov returns.

            Right now this defensive depth is the Habs best token. And frankly speaking, Tinordi and Beaulieu will make up for losing one of those 3 this year…. IF PG can get something decent in return.

            If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

            Go Habs Go!

          • Habsrule1 says:

            We agree again. I’d be very happy with draft picks or forward prospects for 1 of them if we decide to trade 1…or 2 at some point

            Go Habs Go!!

            “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

      • showey47 says:

        I don’t get the trading weber thing. He is steadily improving his play defensively and comes at a cheap cap hit for this season and next. We have 4 ufs’s on defence this summer which could leave us in a pretty bad situation if we deal weber.

        • Bill J says:

          Of your 4, 2 are Due to leave regardless. Spacek and Campoli will not be kept.

          And if Weber is traded along with AK46 and Spacek for Shea Weber and a forward prospect, would you still scoff at the idea ? I don’t believe this trade will happen, but crazier trades have happened.

          If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

          Go Habs Go!

          • showey47 says:

            If you were Poile would you make that trade? No chance i would make it i was the preds g.m. Come on,we both know better. Any chance getting shea weber is going to start with subban going the other way,for starters. If Poile makes it known that weber is available 29 teams will be making trade packages for him. You will be talking about proven high end young nhl talent with cap friendly contracts and high picks.

          • Bill J says:

            I did say I held doubt that trade would happen, didn’t I ? My point was… If some crazy deal happens, and it involved Yannick. Would you scoff at it ?

            Just for the sake of this conversation was that question posed to you. Not because I saw it happening.


            If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

            Go Habs Go!

          • showey47 says:

            Of course i would have made the move if i was benefitting from such a lopsided deal. Especially if it was a long term move for us. I just don’t think the mike milbury’s exist in the league anymore.

    • Danno says:

      Le Jeune Weber has a good, hard & accurate shot now

      ________________________________________

      “Hey Richard, two minutes for looking so good!”

  63. Tony McLean says:

    The Sabres were enablers, let’s face it they did only slightly more than the Canadiens when MaxPac was decapitated. I can only imagine what Ruff had to say after the game to his milquetoast players, “What are you, the Canadiens!?”
    ———————————————————–
    If it wasn’t for St. Patrick the Canadiens would be Leafs East.

  64. Dust says:

    i think price could take care of lucic himself. That i would like to see. Price filling in lucic with his blocker.

    • Ton says:

      First class coward and I hate the sob. Smiles and asks ref to step in and break up fight. Like the way he tells the cops this summer after he hit his girlfriend> “do you know who I am”?? He will get his but that’s there tactic lets cowardly turn the tide of the game but gooning it up for 3 minutes Horton, Thornton, Marchand, Ferrance, lucic are all part of it and it works. Julien plays the media but its there trademark, their brand of hockey and Neely will not have any other way.

  65. habstrinifan says:

    Thank you Ian for introducing some realism to the ‘euphoria’. It is ALWAYS better when the HABS win. I dont switch my TV off from the recaps from around the league etc. So I am indeed glad.

    But I cannot get over the feeling that fighting for goals as we do against teams like Predators and Phoenix is simply not good enough. And worse I am seeing no exciting hockey on HABS horizon.

    Geez it’s so hard to post nowadays. Dont want to be accused of trolling by ALL the ‘real’ HABS fans and yet want so much to see this team play to its tradition.

    • Dust says:

      phoenix and nashville aren’t bad teams. both teams are playoff teams in a tougher western conference. i thought montreal played two good road games for two wins.

    • Sharks9 says:

      Struggling for goals against Pekka Rinne? That’s what happens to most teams in the league, not just the Habs.

      Plus Cammalleri is playing injured and Kostitsyn is out.

      25 before 14

    • dasbooth says:

      I have to disagree with your “no exciting hockey on the HABS horizon” – The finish on DD’s goal last night was the kind of finish we have been lacking, if he can do that more consistently then that becomes a legitimate threat. And the play of Wolverine has given Habs fans more to be optimistic about then anything in recent history. That coupled with the quality and occasionally exciting play of PK, Eller seemingly improving day to day, and Price playing as one of the best in the league I think gives us a lot to be hopeful for. The teams that have the top tier goal scorers are teams that have had to tank for consecutive seasons to get those picks, we have been a legitimate threat, not necessarily cup contenders, but threatening for years.

      Lots to be optimistic about. Also, when you consider that we should have won the Edmonton game if not for outstanding goaltending from the Wall, we could be on a streak of 7 – 1 in our last 8. The team is playing well.

      “Shutouts are really more of a team stat” – Carey Price

      • habstrinifan says:

        A very nice post.

        Lots of ‘encouraging’ observations. I feel better|

        Still troubled by the eagerness to not ‘forgive’ our young players, but to bench, diminish and altogether demand perfection from those who dare make the play that brings fans out of their seats and eventual improvements in confidence and aggressive skill… and who do it under the pressure of a disapproving coach.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      What everyone needs to realize is as proud of we all should be about what the Habs did in the past, it’s much harder to do it now. Even the absolute best teams now don’t dominate the way the Habs did in the past.
      The Habs just came off 2 seasons with major injury problems and still went to the ECF once and came within 1 goal of knocking of the eventual champs the other time.
      If we get Markov bak and he plays almost as good as before, we might be in for another good ride. This team is better than many of you give them credit for.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  66. LL says:

    So the Bruins won a Cup last year, if they don’t repeat, and often, their fanbase will be unhappy.

    So if our team wins The Cup this year, and they suck it out for the next 10, will that be satisfactory? I bet not.

    I wouldn’t dare tell anyone else what to think or feel, but I really like our team, am disappointed when they lose, and thrilled when they win.

    In the 70’s, Cups were a given. Since they aren’t anymore, should I hate on the team every chance I get, or just enjoy each season, no matter what happens?

    I know, I know, that’s loser talk. ;)

    • Tony McLean says:

      No dynasty since 1979 and no cup since 1993, we’ve got a right to be unhappy. I don’t see Gandhi Gauthier and Mohandas Martin being capable of winning in the playoffs – unless Price sprouts wings. Which he has not done yet.

      I am excited about Bournival Gallagher Leblanc and Beaulieu though!

  67. Old Bald Bird says:

    It’s the discrepancy that chafes me most. The refs tolerate Boston’s brutality, but hand out penalties by the basketful for almost inadvertent taps stick on stick. Or a firickin snow shower for goodness sakes. Etc etc.

    • Tony McLean says:

      The code is “the more you do, the more you get away with.” Phylthy and the Gooins been doin’ it for decades. Ever heard of Scott Stevens?
      ———————————————————–
      If it wasn’t for St. Patrick the Canadiens would be Leafs East.

  68. zedder81 says:

    This is the new NHL. Lurch can take a 100 foot run at a goalie and get a two minute penalty. Why wouldn’t the neanderthal do it? 2 minutes for intentionally taking a run at a goalie. What pisses you off is no one runs Thomas back. That’s the only answer. Not fighting Lurch, but running Thomas.

    In my life the Habs have won 8 Stanley Cups and the Leafs 0. How can you put a value on that?

    • The Cat says:

      Goalies today are pansies a bit, some of them need to look at how Billy Smith took care of business.

      [Disclaimer]: I’m a hockey fan. I care about the habs, but probably not as much as you.

      • savethepuck says:

        So did Ron Hextall and to some extent, Patrick Roy. But I definitely remember Billy Smith, he was old school with a Capital ‘O’.

        “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
        Carey Price

      • ZepFan2 says:

        Ron Hextall would eat Billy Smith for a snack!

        ———————————————————————-
        Welcome to the newer NHL: The National Headshot League.

    • wow, i liked the part when he reached, almost as much as the projection

      sorry ian, this email is lazy

    • zedder81 says:

      Can’t agree with much of anything in that email.

      In my life the Habs have won 8 Stanley Cups and the Leafs 0. How can you put a value on that?

    • JF says:

      Ian – I’m a bit surprised at the extent to which you’ve turned against Jacques Martin. I don’t agree with much in that post. The Habs played well last night and won a hard-fought game, despite missing key players. That post simply trots out the usual whines and overlooks the facts of the game.

      I have plenty of criticisms of Jacques Martin, but I think he’s actually doing a good job in the circumstances (see my post on the other thread). Equally important, who would you replace him with? It’s possible that at the end of the season, the Habs might be able to get Kirk Muller back if they’re willing to waive the French-language requirement, or possibly there’s someone in the Q or elsewhere in Junior whom they’ve got their eye on. But to whom should they turn in the middle of a season?

    • Philly-Poo says:

      I always thought you were one of the better “posters” on here… I realize you didn’t write this, but, wow is it ever lame duck sauce. More grieving, lamenting, and negativity from yet another individual who can’t be happy when we win a game? If people aren’t happy with the Canadiens, well, no one is forcing them to watch the games, go do something else if you can’t be happy with a win. Remember, a goal is a goal; highlight goals dont happen all the time. A win is a win, some games are more boring or lopsided, but whether it’s a 2-1 win or a 5-1 win, a win is a win.
      With all the praise heaped on AK, you’d think this was either written by him, or some hysterical, I-need-to-be-locked-up-before-I-do-something-stupid homicidal lunatic who still lives in their parent’s basement… Furthermore, the lack of proper grammar and spelling was very evident…

    • Ton says:

      teams like the canadiens have won cups, dallas, jersey, and our 86 team was very similar in style. Martin I agree plays conservative and holds back players especially offensive minded players. He preaches a robotic system that is first over players skills. But I disagree with the email> we have good hockey players, Gil played a strong game and certainly i would have him on my bench as a 5th or 6th defensive. Martin has a 4 year contract and he will likely finish off those 4 years. He’s not the first habs coach of this style to be in montreal>Bowman, Macneil, Lemaire, Bob Berry, etc.

    • Tony McLean says:

      I think Pleky looks great. Now if only he could lock up with the same two wingers and if Moen be kept away from him (and the top 2 lines) forever… Plekanec’s looking to make the All Star team. ColeTrain is looking terrific too. And MaxPac…yeah lots of work to be done but Budaj is surprising and with Leblanc Bournival and Beaulieu and Gallagher…all is not lost. Now bring Larry Robinson home.

      • ZepFan2 says:

        “And MaxPac…yeah lots of work to be done”

        Yeah, only seven goals and five assists. Is second in points on the team. F-cking bum should be traded!

        Some fans are never happy.

        ———————————————————————-
        Welcome to the newer NHL: The National Headshot League.

    • Bill J says:

      Ian just a thought… Why not let those people emailing you post their own thoughts publicly.

      Now you represent your opinion & those who choose to write you a private message ? Remind me to never email you.


      If you want to add an avatar here, read this and follow the steps

      Go Habs Go!

    • The Dude says:

      I’m just guessing Ian,but I’m figuring that email was from Berkshire,lol

    • ZepFan2 says:

      DD’s goal was a “garbage goal”?

      Pfft, tell that to Steve Shutt or Phil Esposito.

      ———————————————————————-
      Welcome to the newer NHL: The National Headshot League.

    • Habsrule1 says:

      I agree with closer to none of it than most of it. Ian, I’m surprised that you have gotten so negative since last year. Take a deep breathe. this team is better than you think.
      Although, I would not be too dissapointed if we got some fresh coaching blood myself.

      Go Habs Go!!

      “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  69. Ian Cobb says:

    This weeks stats where we place in the 30 team league, compared to last Sunday.
    Next week I will put this up on Monday, because we will be returning from the Annual HIO Fan Summit on the Sunday.

    Goals Against-42, We are in 19th place. Last week 19th place.

    Total points—-16, We are in 24th place. Last week 25th place.

    Goals For——-40, we are in 23rd place. Last week 17th place.

    With just a little over two goals a game, there won’t be any 20 goal scorers on the club this year. But we may have 20 goals scored against us while we have the power play!

    16 teams make the play offs out of 30. We are in 24th place! overall. (I mean under most)

    Even when we win games, I dislike Martin style hockey.! No creativity or plays that pull you out of your chair. I am also becoming so negative, when positive is mostly my normal demeanor.

    Excited for next weekend”s HIO gathering in Montreal.
    See everyone there.!

    • Old Bald Bird says:

      PK kind of pulled me out of my chair at the end. What a player! I assume that he will be taken to task severely for being so creative. Kidding.

      • habstrinifan says:

        If P.K had been stripped of that puck you wouldnt have head the end of it from Boone and from HIO. They may not admit it now but just review the posts/blogs of the past weeks.

        Any attempt by HABS players, especially Eller and Subban lately, to use individual improptu flair and skill, is met with howls of calls for detention and the use of behavioural modification punsihment to correct their deviation from the “Martinization” of HABS hockey and habs players.

        In Habland, fear of disaster prevails!

        Martin’s doghouse attitude has taken hold, fully!

    • Tony McLean says:

      Agreed but the NHL is mostly about Roger Neilson styled overcoaching, smothering defensive systems and the trap so coaches and GMs can keep their jobs as long as possible. Ultra conservative. Even Boucher’s using the 1-3-1.

    • Mark C says:

      Pacioretty is on a 36 goal pace, and is tied for 20th in goals. This team is going to have 20 goal scorers.

  70. adam76 says:

    Teams that are .500 in November have a less then 50% chance of making the playoffs. We need a four game winning streak and we need it now.

    • Ton says:

      lots of hockey left , I have see teams in the east turn it on after the all star break and make the playoffs, I have also seen the opposite> loossing streak after the all star game and placing 10th.

    • Bob_Sacamano says:

      Most teams going to the playoffs will sooner or later play .500 hockey or worse over 16 games…

    • LA Loyalist says:

      This is why our season opening swoon was so bad. It is not easy to make up these points with loser points getting handed out. So many posters saying “don’t worry, we’ll get it together”.

      Well, Martin not having the team ready for opening night and the bad start is going to hang over us like cheap cologne for quite a while yet.

  71. Ton says:

    You can see how the east is shaping! I think we a chance with a full team to make some noice in the east if we make the playoffs, getting in is the goal of all teams in the east. With this said do we have an all around team no! Bruins being champions are the team to beat, they will beat you in the alley way, that’s why they won the cup. They will resort to the kind of stuff to indimitate the opposition when the tide in the game needs to be changed. We can beat them playing hockey but I don’t think we could handle Price being charged either. You know they will do it, nothing is beyond them now!!! When Lucic throws it in your face like he did it with the sabres he’s also referencing other teams. This worries me. Furthermore he is a coward because I seen him begging the ref to stop the Orr fight and seen him refuse George L’s offer to fight. Coward and hypocrite but how do we contest this tactic without getting away from the hockey game that we play better than them.

    • Mick says:

      The Habs have only one answer for Lurch. That is to score more goals than Boston. The Bruins hate to lose to the Habs. That is the only way we can rub it in their face.
      Go Habs!

      • Ton says:

        I agree with you, at any one given time the habs should have a scoring threat> ak, pac, Gionta, Camm, Cole……….I would like to see one more added this season without it costing a bunch!

    • Number31 says:

      Luchicken. The guy who runs from Travis Moen? He has bumped Price before. And ran from pretty much all scrums afterwards…

      Play Emelin. Hell I’ve seen Weber check Luchicken on his butt a few times and come out with the puck, leaving the ogre confused.

  72. Mick says:

    Good on DD for his effort last night, the guy has talent and heart.
    This doesn’t change the fact that DD is not our future 2nd line or third line center. The question is what to do with Him. Eller should get a chance with Cole and Patches so he can develop and Yes Gomer will be back on the 2nd line when everyone is back.
    What to do with DD?

    • LA Loyalist says:

      Two road wins we would have lost for sure last year, so that’s something. Phoenix and Nashville are not nothing.

      As for what to do with DD, well, he was plus 2. Gomez was minus 1.

      Do the math.

      Maybe Gomez can wash DD’s car or something, if he can afford a car. I wouldn’t let him wash mine, but that’s another story.

      DD gives a crap. Yeah I like size, but I like passion and smarts and effort more, all of which Gomer left in his locker in NJ.

      • Mick says:

        I like DD he has good skill in the O Zone but is weak along the boards and is a slow skater. Let’s get real, DD is getting a chance to play with skilled players and has done well enough. DD is a temporary fix, not the future. We will see if JM has the smarts to come up with the best line combos when everyone is back.
        We all have seen JM’s magic over the last few years to have our doubts.

    • Tony McLean says:

      Then who plays with Pleky? He deserves the biggest and best.

  73. CharlieHodgeFan says:

    I want to see this Russian coaching against Roy.

  74. ths says:

    If we can’t get Guy Boucher back lets get this guy. He’ll be great in Boston

    Ooh Aah Habs on the war path

    • Dust says:

      why would you want boucher? Martin’s system is boring enough, but lets make the game even more boring and get a coach who sends no one on the forecheck. Enough with this love affair with boucher. Roy was right about him. boring defensive hockey. I don’t even like martin but i’ll take him over boucher. His no forecheck is disgusting. I would hate to have him as a coach. theres a reason why he turned down the columbus job. He needed stars like st louis stamkos and lecav to make him look good

  75. LL says:

    Agree, I always thought he was good. Last night, finally, he was playing in the right role suited for him. Hope he evolves into the next MaxP.

  76. Habsrule1 says:

    Sounds like an excellent plan. I pretty much agree with everything. I hope it happens.

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  77. Bripro says:

    Keep dreaming big!
    Gomez isn’t going anywhere (except maybe a buyout), and neither are Gionta and (perhaps) Moen.
    I don’t think Gill will come back (although his heel saved a setup pass for a goal last night – good thing he’s got 8 foot legs), and Spacek is probably gone.
    “Stockpile draft picks”…how do you plan on doing that?
    You need to remove the rose-colored tint in your glasses.
    Every GM wants what you want.

  78. Habsrule1 says:

    The Habs, like any other team, can trade for draft picks, but most players we would be trading would get us 2-5 round picks. Gomez may be bought out, then you have cap space for other FA’s.
    Everything he stated is possible, but who knows what we can actually fetch with these players. I would keep Gionta & even Gill. The point is that we have a good core and more good young players coming. I still think we need 1 gamebreaker, kinda like Cammalleri, but better (and I love Cammalleri).

    Go Habs Go!!

    “Fans are great, but the quickest way to start losing is to listen to them.” – Sam Pollock

  79. Bripro says:

    Since the departure of Serge Savard, the Habs’ history of trading, exchange of draft picks, etc., has been less than exemplary. And of those we have in the ranks or currently sitting in the rafters (see Emelin), PG and JM have a peculiar way of treating them. Let’s give this team another 10 games or so and see if trades or fire sales are even necessary.
    The team still isn’t playing with a full deck.
    I don’t think they will effectively, as long as JM is coach.

  80. ProHabs says:

    Does the future really look that bright. If you look at most of the forward prospects, once again, most are SMALL. Desharnais, Leblanc, Gallager, Pallusah. To me it sounds like the same recipe the Habs have been using under the PG/JM regime except with different names on the back of their shirts.

  81. Mick says:

    DD is what 26? Hardly old but not one of the young ones.

  82. the jacques says:

    Don’t worry,i will run most of the out of town long before they blossom into quality nhlers.

    If you smell what the jacques is cooking.

  83. GenerationYHabs says:

    Isn’t Palushaj 6 ft ? Thats hardly what I would classify as a small winger, especially standing next to DD and Gio.

  84. OneTimer says:

    For some posters, it’s 6’3 or bust. Size = cup, it’s that easy, really!

  85. Jordio-oh says:

    I just take offence to the downplaying of the importance of numbers.

    With that said, your Star Wars example is much cooler than the Moneyball one I was about to draft up.

    So well done, sir.


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