About last night …

DDColo

Clocks get turned back in the wee hours of Sunday morning.
Too bad it’s only hour.
Your Montreal Canadiens might want to turn the calendar back to mid-October, when they won three of four games in western Canada.
The U.S. is not as hospitable.
Venturing out of their time zone for the second time this season, the Canadiens lost back-to-back games in Minnesota and Colorado.

As the second month of the season begins, the Canadiens limp home with an 8-7 record. They are  fifth in the Atlantic Division, second, behind Boston, in the wild-card standings.

It’s way too early in the season to start fretting about playoff seedings. And it’s hard to get a fix on where the Canadiens fit into the Eastern Conference power structure, since 11 of their 15 games have been against teams in the Western Conference.

That’s about to change. The November schedule includes games against Ottawa, the Islanders, Tampa Bay, Columbus, the Rangers, Washington (twice), Pittsburgh, Buffalo and the Leafs.

But before getting into the meat of that schedule, there’s one more game against the West. Tuesday night, St. Louis visits the Bell Centre for the first time since Jan. 12, 2012.

The Blues ran a clinic in that game. The 3-0 score in favour of the visitors flattered the Canadiens, who barely touched the puck all night, rarely troubled Jaro Halak and were held to a measly 19 shots on goal … in their own barn.

It was a different Canadiens team, en route to a last-place finish that sealed the fates of general manager Pierre Gauthier and coach Randy Cunneyworth, who had replaced Jacques Martin.

The lineup included Mike Cammalleri, Chris Campoli, Tomas Kaberle, Andrei Kostitsyn, Mathieu Darche, Erik Cole and Hal Gill.

David Desharnais played 18:29 against the visiting Blues that night.

What’s the over/under on DD’s ice time Tuesday night?

Desharnais played 14:20 in Colorado. He was benched for most of the third period as Michel Therrien juggled his lines in search of an offensive spark.

Alex Galchenyuk was moved to centre, between Brendan Gallagher and Max Pacioretty. I thought they were the Canadiens’ best forwards in the third period, especially once Max-Pac shook off the rust of his eight-game absence.

Lars Eller centred Rene Bourque and Louis Leblanc. Michaël Bournival bounced around a few lines but ended the game back with Tomas Plekanec and Brian Gionta.

The Canadiens had 30 shots on J-S Giguère, but at no point was the Colorado goaltender subjected to sustained pressure – except for some late-game shifts by the Galchenyuk line. The Avalanche has no stars on the blueline – and were second-guessed for not drafting homeboy Seth Jones – but there was enough size and skill to prevent the Canadiens from harassing Giguère.

It was a different story at the other end of the ice. Colorado has used its high draft picks to select gifted young forwards, and Gabriel Landeskog, Matt Duchene, Paul Statstny, Ryan O’Reilly and Nathan MacKinnon won puck battles and wreaked havoc aroudn Peter Budaj for long stretches of the game.

P.K. Subban and Andrei Markov, the Canadiens’ top defence pairing, were each minus-3 on the game, as was Lars Eller. The Subban turnover that became O’Reilly’s goal was a dagger in any hopes for a third-period comeback.

P.K. has been out of sorts in recent games. He hasn’t been strong in the Canadiens’ end, displaying defensive lacuna that bolster the case for leaving a Norris Trophy winner off Canada’s Olympic team.

Perhaps P.K. is nursing an injury. Or chafing under the coaching staff’s efforts to purge spontaneity and energy from his game.

The drop-off from Subban-Markov to the rest of the D is precipitous. Josh Gorges was steady on the weekend road trip, but Raphael Diaz was vulnerable to Minnesota and Colorado’s physical forecheck; while Francis Bouillon and Douglas Murray are willing warriors who, nonetheless, would be seventh or eighth defencemen on elite teams.

Alexei Emelin can’t get back soon enough – but the Russian Tank won’t be back against St. Louis.

 

 

 

 

 

 

651 Comments

  1. frontenac1 says:

    At the start of the game last night Diaz was Paired with Murray. I liked that and thought it was working fine. Why did they break them up?

  2. HabinBurlington says:

    Sometimes I wonder if our posts were done anonymously, if it wouldn’t be better. There are many excellent posts, and I am not sure that we always read each other’s posts neutrally, but rather look at the name, have a preconceived notion what they are going to say and then try find something wrong in that persons post.

    Having said that, I’m guessing the reason this happens is because we are all such passionate Habs fans. Keep that in mind when we read each others views, everyone wants the Habs to be better and to win games. And sometimes when our passions get stirred we may go overboard with our views etc…

    But overall, when a person reads through these threads, there is a great deal of knowledge being displayed.

    Have a great Sunday everyone, and hopefully our Habs have a better week in the W/L column.

    CHeers, Go Habs Go!

    • slyCH says:

      It’s the “night-posts” that can be difficult to read. The one’s that are obviously inspired by certain “spirits” (if you know what I mean) that can get quite taxing to read and enjoy. Since I’ve gone back to the gym and put a self-imposed moratorium on the spirits, and my obvious lack of knowledge, I’ve refrained from posting lately. The site has degraded now in my clear vision. I read but do a lot of skimming over Avatars I know only bring frustration in my mind. You not being one of them, along with BILL, JB, MATTY, CHRIS, and a few others no name a few.

      CHeers.

  3. joeybarrie says:

    or pk is in a slump. Nursing a sore muscle or simply not having things go his way right now.
    in his own head or something.
    we are a top 10 team…. Potential wise.
    but don’t look now, cause so are most other teams.

    colorado has the benefit of what 5-6 high draft picks, and sucking since Roy left the team….
    it won’t last like this for them. They don’t have enough depth.
    but good for Roy, he is a winner. No doubt about that.

    Habs are a good team with a bright future.
    Teams win. Teams lose.
    Leafs got killed by the Nucks. I don’t see any their season is over and they won’t make the playoffs nonsense.
    its a long season. The 2nd goal for colorado was lucky, and we hit some posts. It goes both ways.

  4. frontenac1 says:

    The D will look good when Emelin is Back. Pairings; TU-74 – Markov. PK. – Gorges. Diaz-Murray. Cube/ One of The Kids.

  5. slyCH says:

    So from the look of things AG finally goes to his natural position of center leaving DD…where exactly? Do they put him on the wing while trying to move him in a trade? If a trade isn’t possible do they send him down to the dogs and if he doesn’t clear waivers and some team picks him up for nothing does anyone here cry over spilled milk? It seems like the team cannot afford to put him in the pressbox at this point. Something has to give.

    EDIT. Oh and another thing, can a buyout be out of the question after the season?

    • HabFab says:

      For the Habs it would have to be a regular buy-out… in other words it would count against the Cap.

      • Maritime Ronn says:

        Exactly because they already used the 2 compliance buyouts.

        • neumann103 says:

          I was never really convinced that the Kaberle buyout was such a great idea. I expect that Bergevin was confident that he was not entering into any new deals that could blow up quickly enough to need to be addressed in Summer 2014. But at base, I just didn’t think that you should rush into using the compliance buyout on a relatively minor 1 year issue.

          Let’s look at what would have been likely if Kaberle has not been bought out.

          He probably would have been the Habs #6 defenseman. His overall liability would have been less than Boullion or Murray. At least Kaberle can contribute in some way.

          There would not have been the money available to sign Daniel Briere, so that totally unnecessary move would have been avoided.

          A compliance buyout would have been available next summer for any necessary action. cough…Desharnais…cough

          “Et le but!”

          • slyCH says:

            I was baffled by the Kaberle buy-out myself when it happened.

          • neumann103 says:

            Sly

            If I went back to my comments in February I am sure that I would find some expectation that they would buy him out, even before they benched him. However it really only would have made sense if they were in major salary cap trouble, or had a key UFA signing that they needed to clear space to contain.

            When they essentially pissed away $8M on Briere, Parros, Bouillon and Murray, that became moot.

            I mean I would have rather just run with any one of Dumont, LeBlanc, Bournival, hell even Patrick Holland as the 12th forward and used some combination of Kaberle, Beaulieu, Tinordi and Pateryn as depth defensemen.

            And even if I did buy out Kaberle, I woud have strongly considered just doing it as a regular buyout, not the compliance buyout which could have been kept as a contignecy to address a more strategic problem. (eg Desharnais and Briere money really could have been useful next year to sign Eller and Subban)

            “Et le but!”

          • slyCH says:

            NEUBY, since we’re going back here I’m sure we could find a comment of mine baffled by the DD extension.

          • neumann103 says:

            Sly
            No doubt!

            Something along the lines of “too much, too long too soon”

            My main concern with Desharnais is that he has only one possible role: one-way offensive exploitation center when paired with big wingers.

            If he isn’t working out there is nowhere else to put him

            Compare this to a guy like eller.

            “Et le but!”

    • Maritime Ronn says:

      In any trade,Habs could retain up to 50% of Salary and Cap hit.
      Going down to Hamilton, the Habs would still have a 2.6M cap hit instead of 3.5M and would have to pay the full salary
      Pick your poison.

  6. HabFab says:

    Hi-lights of the Bulldog game last night;
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YZlTL8I9kwc

  7. frontenac1 says:

    Yeah, I was pissed off at the loss last night, but this morning,not so much.Shots 31-30. Budaj made some dandy saves, Jiggy wasn’t really tested and was lucky or snipers were missing open nets or just firing at his pads. C”mon amigos, with all the injuries we are 1 game over 500 early in the season. Habs will start a Roll soon,I can feel it, like I feel my sore head this morning.Saludos!

  8. Hobie Hansen says:

    Mr. Boone,

    If you’re taking a gander at the posts this morning I’m hoping you understand that even though I disagreed with some of your comments during last night’s game that I at least showed some respect and didn’t cross the line? The fight fans and non fight fans were really going at it.

    I hope you noticed that I wasn’t being one of the foul mouth idiots throwing vulgarities your way! Some people we’re completely out of line.

    Love all the work you do! Part of the fun around here is having a difference in opinions. Take care sir!

    But can you please try and give George Parros a break? :-).

  9. The Chicoutimi Cucumber says:

    All those sighing their wish that we’d hired Roy should remember that Roy couldn’t have been hired as just a coach; he wanted to be GM too. So unless he excels in both roles, he would have been a bad hire, and we won’t know whether he is a decent GM for a few years yet.

    • Mark C says:

      Great point, which is always forgotten around here. I’m not sure many posters would have been happy with the Downie for Talbot trade.

      • neumann103 says:

        Which way do you mean? Getting rid of that psycho Downie to the only team in the NHL dirty enough to really be an appropriate fit for him in return for a very useful hockey player in Max Talbot who has a very cheap contract?

        And by the time Roy was interviewed for the Hab’s coaching position the GM had already been hired.

        Don’t get me wrong, I was nervous about the potential issues in annointing Patrick the all powerful saviour in Montreal, but would have taken him in a heartbeat over Therrien.

        And the whole “let him get some experience somewhere else first” arrogance that many displayed was misplaced. If his success in Colorado continues at all, he is never coming to Montreal. Maybe to Quebec city when/if they get a franchise.

        I think last time around was probably the only opportunity for the Habs to grab Roy as coach. I can understand that Bergevin felt he needed someone with experience and may not have been able to afford the almost implicit Roy challenge to his authority. But i think the horse left the barn never to return.

        “Et le but!”

  10. Maritime Ronn says:

    If any good came out of the last week it,s finally having Galchenyuk taking his rightful position.
    If Coach MT keeps him between Max and Gallagher, we may be in for something special for a long time.

    Keep the Plex line, and Eller between Bourque-Leblanc-Prust-Briere….the other team will have its hands full.

    • Eddie says:

      Exactly. The sooner Galchenyuk begins his climb to the top as a centre, the closer we get to #25.

      Now that we agree, watch him go back to the wing for the next 25 games.

      I hope I’m not an alarmist if I post that Galchenyuk is a fine winger but he’s going to be an All Star center.

  11. tab says:

    Great post Boonie, nice to see great insights, I agree 100%.
    Tab

  12. habs-fan-84 says:

    To be frank, PK has not looked good since the Winnipeg game in the middle of October. PK does not walk on water – as some seem to suggest – and he’s not immune to criticism.

    As the reigning Norris trophy winner, he needs to be held to a higher standard. At this point PK is unfortunately playing himself off the Olympic team.

    with all that said I have never understood MTs decision from day 1 to play Diaz ahead of P.K. on the PK, especially when you consider his prominent role on the PK prior to MTs arrival.

    The bottom line: P.K. simply needs to play better.

    Having not seen last night’s game(my band was playing a show) I cannot comment on MTs remarks after the game.

  13. Eddie says:

    When Therrien is confident enough in his own abilities he will stand in front of the microphones and defend his players after a loss, all of his players, without exception.

    This is the leadership Therrien has always been missing since the outset.

    The criticism stays in the room, and when he is asked about a specific players troubles on the ice, he should move on to the next question.

    • Ton says:

      so you want him to be wishy washy! what he said was the truth……..I want a boss that tells like it is! I ask how did Scotty handle the players> read Lafleur’s book………”tough coach and I hated him but he was the best coach I ever had”

      • theflower says:

        That was then Ton, wake up its 2013 that neanderthal way of coaching only works so long now. MT with Sid as his stud could not get him to the promised land. You think his style of coaching can get us to the promised land??? Daft if you do. He has shown already, he has learned nothing in terms of man management. He has learned some better two-way coaching, but trust me a leopard does not change his spots and either will MT. Expect years of mediocrity under MT whoever is on this team. He is a coach good enough to keep this team slightly above .500 but has nothing in him that indicates he is a next level coach.

        • Ton says:

          no! Sid credits MT for getting him to the next level……..Sid actually called him to congratulate him for getting the Habs coaching job therefore there was respect. tell me whom will coach the habs today? whom will be a good coach?

          also do not lose perspective…read Boone’s post….we are simply a 500 hockey team forget last year….we would have ended up a 500 hockey team by game 80!

          • theflower says:

            Of course ex-players say nice things about their former coach, it’s rare that we hear the other side. Bottom line Sid is thanking Dan Bylsma for getting him to the cup not MT, let’s be clear on that. I am not losing perspective, I am looking at the long term picture. MT is good at getting players to a certain level, not more as proven by his history. Who is better? No idea since they have to speak French that limits our talent pool. I do think Guy Boucher is on the list though. Would he be better? No idea. The one thing he has going for him is he is the only coach that has won any kind of cup for the Habs organisation for ages though.

  14. boonie says:

    I don’t post often anymore. So, I’ll keep this short, so folks will read it; pithy, so folks will think I’m smart and agree with me; and vague so I can’t be pinned down when all of this turns out to be wrong.

    1. We’re a bubble team. That’s ok. Two years ago, we were hopeless. The average team this year gets .552 points per game. The teams we’ve played are averaging .536 points per game. Our record is 8-7. 11 times, we’ve beaten a sub .500 team or lost to a team playing better than .500. The outliers — wins against Vancouver (early) and Anaheim (arguably our best game); and losses against Calgary and Edmonton (yeesh).

    2. Subban is fine. Maybe not Norris, but a notch below ain’t bad. Markov is still something in the offensive zone. But the Wild revealed he can’t get back. Twice (at least), including one goal, they were sending long passes up the right side like a stretch pass in football and beating him like an old cornerback. I submit PK’s issues stem from covering up for his veteran teammate. PK needs a partner who can let PK go to town.

    3. Price and Eller are good. Price ain’t Roy and, contrary to Boone early season analysis, Eller ain’t Béliveau and. That doesn’t mean they suck. They just aren’t historically distinguished players. Gallagher and Chucky sure seem like the real deal. Not that they are Shutt and Lafleur.

    4. The rest of the team is a mixed bag of young, old, big, small, feisty and flat. In short, a bubble bunch.

    5. As Bill posts these days, MB ain’t Sam Pollock. In fact, other than drafting Gal (which 99.9% of HIO folks would have in his position), I’m not sure he’s all that Or the bag of chips. Other than being the Goat’s polar opposite personality-wise, he seems like an inexperienced manager who had the right look, right name and right mother tongue for job when we went looking. Keep in mind, he was third in the pecking order in Chicago. Maybe more seasoning will help. Right now, he’s pretty consistent with our bubble org.

    • Eddie says:

      You should post more often.

    • HabFab says:

      What Ed said^^^^^^^^^

      Insightful like some of your previous posts.

    • Old Bald Bird says:

      You should probably post more often.

    • Ton says:

      good post! your right it proves my point> Subban is fine but not great! he is a keeper absolutely but considering we are entering a crucial summer of decisions do we put the franchise at risk by signing PK for 8 years at 64 million!? markov will seek a 5 year deal between 20 and 25 million! there’s too many “if’s” with these two players>

    • JohninTruro says:

      Pacioretty?

    • wjc says:

      Pollack came from a different era.

      He had less teams, protected players on 12 different teams.

      How would he function in a 30 team market, probably not so well.

      The supply of players is from a different source, you have to draft in order and you do not have a stock of players hidden.

      Some will say he had to eventually draft, but he had first place teams drafting first, how could he accomplish that….by trading off prospects for draft choices 3 or 4 years down the road. He could make mistakes in drafting and he did….check the draft record, but he had the resourses to recover.

      He quit in 1978, knowing that his image would be tarnished, if he continued and never took on another M.G. job even though he was still young enough. The slope was too slippery and his reputation would have be shattered.

      wjc

  15. Thomas Le Fan says:

    Wow. We lose a couple of road games against good teams in contests that we kept close for the most part and half the place goes nuts. PK is not the problem. Therrien might be. Man, I wish we had hired Patrick! Go Habs!

    There is no crying in baseball, “i” in team or “chuck” in Galchenyuk but … there is fighting in hockey.

  16. kalevine says:

    I actually thought Habs played well overall, although I thought Budaj could have stopped all of those goals. With the score 2-1 Max, who played very well; considering it was his first game back, hit the crossbar on an amazing shot. That could have changed the game.

  17. JM says:

    The only way to look at last nights game. The AVS are a team playing at 90+ % on the season The Habs are playing at 50 + % on the season and the score showed it. A lot of blame going around. Myself I’d say it’s a combination of players and coaching …. Tomorrow night will be more of the same. Play good for awhile than lose!!

  18. Bill says:

    Bim: It’s not the quantity, it’s the quality. I still think the Habs only have two top four defencemen. They are indeed quite deep in bottom pairing defencemen however! Not sure those guys get us much in a trade, yknow?

    Also I believe the only defencemen under contract for next year (not counting Bulldogs) are Gorges and Emelin. Markov and Subban should be re-signed. What happens with Diaz, Murray, Bouillon, and Drewiske is anyone’s guess, but Diaz is the only one I would keep.

  19. FlyAngler says:

    Right Boone. The coaching staff wants to purge spontaneity and energy from P K’s game. With the ability to spin a story like that you should be the head of communications for the PM of Canada or in the White House. No, I suspect that what the coaching staff is trying to PROMOTE in P K is greater responsibility, accountability and discipline and the notion that he needs to work as hard in his own end as he does in the opponents’ end. Too often that notion seems to be a foreign concept. He is definitely doing better with regard to refraining from taking bad penalties, but there is still room for improvement on give aways, minimizing the occasions when he gets caught up ice and better defensive play. There are all kinds of players in the NBA who are great on offense but disinterested in playing at the other end of the floor. The great players in sports play both ends. P K has an incredible array of talent and skills. He is not great yet however and whether he becomes great or not is up to him.

    “Elever le flambeau!…Raise the Torch!”

    • Ton says:

      Great post…….posters need to understand that we do want PK to succeed but lets not loose perspective………he is not great and I could be wrong this will be proven by the fact that he will not make the Canada team! (maybe by default for the reason of injury!) In the end we do hope he becomes great but do you take a Carey Price gamble with him> (give him the money before he becomes great?> I say no !)

      • FlyAngler says:

        I agree 1000%. I hope that P K wins 10 more Norris Trophies and even more importantly, a slew of Stanley Cups and Conn Smythe Trophies. Of course we want him to succeed! Denying that there are no growth edges in his game however, is only whistling past the grave yard and classic enabling. It won’t help P K, it won’t help the team and ultimately only serves to stunt his growth and development. In the game against Nashville, P K was the 3rd best defenseman on the ice- Weber and Jones were both better and that was a major reason that the Habs lost the game. That said, P K has the tools to be better than both of them on most nights if he sets his mind to it and I hope that he does just that.

        “Elever le flambeau!…Raise the Torch!”

  20. scavanau says:

    Everyone see the Lupul failed elbow attempt on Henrik Sedin last night? But instead it connected nicely with Kadris chin.

  21. Ton says:

    ok.reading all the comments>>>>>>and certainly I will get blasted for my comments…..hopefully some will find my input somewhat valuable. PK is not an elite D………he’s not a team player! Some will argue he won the Norris trophy….but he won it in a short season! I am betting he will not make the Canada team …..his strengths are his great shot but as well a weakness (its become predictable and how often does he fan on his shot!) his skating is his strength but as well his weakness! (how often does he push he edges to the extreme and falls) His positional play in his own end requires improvement……..he is a pond player which makes him exciting and good but as well it creates a weakness! If I were GM would I pay him the 7mill or 8 mill he is looking for> absolutely not but would I expect solid players in return> sure I would! Think about our greats like Orr, Harvey, Larry, Serge, Lapointe, and compare for yourselves…..evaluate them based on attitude> balance> positional play> offense> Defense> shot blocking> etc. he costs two goals yesterday and maybe the game so lets get out of our comic strip hero mode and back into what made the Canadiens great for years! TEAM PLAY…….CREDIT GOES TO MT FOR BLASTING HIM! TIME HAS COME TO MAKE A DECISION ON PK DO WE LOCK HIM UP FOR 8 YEARS????…….I AM PREDICTING NO….HABS ARE LEARY OF THE INVESTMENT AND I’M I’M CERTAIN THERE GETTING COLD FEET ON PK!

    • Eddie says:

      Can we lock you up for 8 years?

    • FlyAngler says:

      Ton,

      Don’t concern yourself with the idol worshippers. They are the ones who are delusional not you.

      “Elever le flambeau!…Raise the Torch!”

    • Maritime Ronn says:

      You mention that PK is not a team player.
      Could you expand on that?

      • Eddie says:

        Please Ronn, do we need to read more of this? The people who don’t see Subbans greatness will never see it.

      • Ton says:

        the high ‘individual” risks he takes at crucial times in the games to seek high personal returns! great players weigh those risks and execute them and mange them far better than PK at this current age!

        • Maritime Ronn says:

          That does not make him NOT a team player.
          Perhaps just not totally aware-maybe trying to do too much, yet to say that he is not a team player because of that is not quite right

          • Ton says:

            ronn yes it does when you think “me” more often than not your putting yourself ahead of the team…….I will say he’s getting better and moving towards the right direction as he matures

            perhaps some perception but far to many analysists and players have called out PK for his lack of team play! granted he was young and immature but quite honestly we must forget it and move on! PK like many is treating this like a business and will fetch the money wherever he goes…….but do you as a GM in montreal put the franchise at risk by signing him to the franchise’s largest contract ever!?

    • Bob_Sacamano says:

      Ridiculous.

    • Savardian Spin-o-rama says:

      Sorry, it wasn’t team play that made the ancient Habs (and I say ancient to emphasize how long they’ve been bad) great. Nope, it was great players. Sure, they had to play as a team but it wasn’t necessary for them to win EVERY game. This edition of the Hab’s, and every other since the 70s dynasty, can only win with great team play. Think about it. How many players have the Habs had in the last 40 years who could put the team on his back and basically will them to victory? Not too many, eh? Try none. Okay, maybe Carey once in a while but that’s it. Face it kids: our team is average and on a parallel trajectory towards more of the same for the foreseeable future. They need more elite talent, especially goal getters. For cripes sakes, when’s the last time they’ve had a reliably prolific scorer? Gotta go back to the Stephane Richer era. Man, that was a long time ago. Too long IMO.

      Oh, and PK is a terrific defenseman. Ray Bourque thinks so too. He said so on RDS last night. I’ve also heard/read the same opinion from the likes of Denis Potvin, Bobby Orr, Paul Coffey and Serge Savard.

  22. aHabGrowsInBrooklyn says:

    So, a second loss on the trot to the strongest team in the league, and it’s trade/fire/waive the whole team. Emelin will be confused when he returns…

  23. HabFab says:

    There was a Fire MT thread started on another blog last night and I would like to quote Commandant on two of his comments;

    As for the stuff with PK…. MT was tough on him last year and it led to the best season of his career. He had a bad game tonight… MT is being tough with him. Some players have to be coddled and some need a kick in the ass. PK doesn’t strike me as the type of kid who needs much coddling, seeing and hearing from his Dad, it sounds like the kick in the ass style of motivation is what he’s got his whole life.

    There was an incident earlier this year where MT called out PK in the dressing room and it got filmed for 24CH.
    The team asked PK if they wanted to air it, or if he’d rather it stay behind closed doors.
    PK said to air it…. and that it didn’t bother him.
    I think we’re overreacting.
    PK knows as well as anyone that he messed up on a couple tonight.
    In fact I bet he has a great game on Tuesday.

    • JF says:

      Sensible, rational. Good post. I think people are being alarmist.

    • theflower says:

      As i said before Mt’s style of no one is bigger than the team and leave ego’s at the door can work to take a poor or mediocre team to become better, as MT has done with Montreal. There is a fine line though, that if he crosses as he did in Pittsburgh, he loses the room and the team. The problem with these kind of coaches in the modern era is that rarely it leads to greatness. Coaches who are player coaches are higher risk, but also higher reward as players tend to have higher success under these type of guys. The downside is these coaches can be a wild card sometimes going against GM’s etc. see Patrick Roy. An organisation like Montreal steeped in history and in the fish bowl, may never want that guy, hence the reason Roy was passed up for the “safer” Therrien. We can expect a long term of slightly over .500 hockey with this team, but I am willing to guarantee no cups under the Therrien regime. History shows us he could not do it with the best player in hockey, he won’t do it with the Habs.

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      Great post, HF.

  24. Bim says:

    Looking at Habs back end for a while now and I have often wondered “what are they going to do with 10 NHL quality defensemen?” American thankgiving is just around the corner so perhaps we’ll see a couple of deals made to try and get some more scoring. Names without contracts for next year…some thought starters are Gionta, Markov, Boullion, Diaz. Would these guys be up for grabs? Three of them just happen to be defensemen too. And maybe, just maybe they could even package in some baggage with some of them too ( I’m looking at you DD). A lot remains to be done and last place is just around the corner if nothing is done.

    • otisfxu says:

      10 quality NHL defensemen??? We have 10 defensmen,,,,,and the reason we have 10 defensemen is because only 5-6 should be NHL defencemen, but trying to find those 5-6 is tough

  25. HabinBurlington says:

    Bizarre incident in the Leaf game last night with Bolland getting a severe laceration from Kassian’s skate. This will be a big blow to the Leafs as Bolland has been a real good player for he Leafs, as he fits exactly what Carlyle wants from his players. The Leafs will now face some adversity from injuries just as the Habs and other teams have had to deal with early in the season.

  26. --Habs-- says:

    Look! They faced a very good talented team last night. But that’s not what impressed me about the Avs. What impressed me was the hard work and mostly the coordinated attack! Habs looked out of sorts. One example was how many times a Hab forward was looking to see if his line partner was moving in for the 4check. Saw it in the Minni game as well. And while the lost look was taking place the feet weren’t moving. That’s a sign of issues in the game plan. When players look lost?…….?.trouble. At a dozen games in these kinks should be gone which is also a call concern.

    “Habs” on my license plate!

  27. Bill says:

    It literally takes two losses in a row for people to lose their minds. The level of anger here about the Habs and MT should be reserved for human rights atrocities, global finance, and PJ Stock’s continued appearance on television.

    I’ve been wrong about many, many things. David Desharnais being a good signing for his production level being one.

    But I think I was also wrong about Therrien being a disastrous hiring, which was my initial reaction. He’s proven to be competent at least. I thought he’d ruin PK, but PK won the Norris under him. Now, obviously that is mostly PK’s doing, but it couldn’t have happened if MT were seriously trying to undermine or misuse him, as some here suggest.

    Therrien’s comments after the game were not complimentary and they were not meant to be. He didn’t use a name. Did Subban play well? Not really. Should a coach have higher standards of expectation for a superstar like Subban than a journeyman like Bouillon? Absolutely.

    This is a blip. It will be forgotten. No doubt Subban doesn’t like Therrien much, but Subban, Therrien, Bergevin, the entire team, and every fan knows that Therrien will eventually be gone, while Subban is here to stay.

    I’m still no fan of Therrien. But this is just not a big deal. Would Roy have been a better choice? I didn’t think so, and maybe I was wrong about that too, but that will always be a maybe. It’s hard to imagine Roy coaching in Montreal without it being a bit of a circus.

    • Eddie says:

      This could end up being the difference between a 4 year contract and an 8 year deal for Subban. If he signs 8 years then its a blip. But if he signs 4 years its an indication he will be leaving the door open to walk away in his prime.

      Therrien should not have been hired, I am convinced of that.

      Not only because he had established a public tension between he and Subban through the Francophone media, but because he’s not a very good coach.

      Therrien is not likely to stay on beyond his 3rd season I would guess.

    • DAVE. N says:

      Good post,
      Sometimes a team has to face the measuring stick of a competitor that has superior skills; The Habs faced that last night. PK has had a couple of tough games lately, MaxPac was rusty, Kid line was well checked in the last 2 games, goaltending has been more than adequate.
      Nope..did not like the Therrien hire either, but MB, as a new GM, had to hire experience.
      Therriens remarks? Old school coaching, IMO Will it work? Nope.. IMO, he will lose the room, and that would be a shame; this team has potential. The first 2 periods last night, the tail end of a back to back should have proven that.

    • slyCH says:

      When I see PJ on l’antichambre, which I love to watch after games, I switch it off. That night he tried to break down a play on the screen when what’s his face was not there was simply atrocious. Why he’s on that show simply baffles me.

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      Agree.

  28. otisfxu says:

    We talked two summers ago about how the Habs ownership/management had finally turned the corner, hiring all these ex players, ex Habs, original Quebecois, etc. in front office, scouting, asst coaching. I hve said it before here, that stuff doesn’t really amount to a hill of beans – the game is played on the ice on gamenight, not on the 5th floor of the Bell center. Are we really seeing anywhere the “expertise” of Patrice Brisbois anywhere as asst defensive coach, or defense scouting or whatever his title was???

    All great PR at the time, but team is still a hodge podge of players of average talent. Apart fom the 4-5 good young player we have, no great pieces have been added to help them.

    Then throw in MT as coach,,,,,was a bad move from day 1. Just not a likeable guy

  29. HabFab says:

    So Stubbs tweeted the Summary sheet for last nights game. PK had the most minutes but wait for it… Diaz had the best game stat wise. No wonder the world looks upside down. I thought it was agreed that he was SO BAD that a raw rookie or a MOAR pylon was a better option…. https://twitter.com/Dave_Stubbs/status/396984333233168386/photo/1

    Like I said earlier… idiots and fools!

  30. gmur says:

    If PK is injured, from what I saw of the game last night he is still a dominant force on the ice. Yes, he made a couple of bad plays, but as Ray Bourque said on RDS during the game while watching PK and commenting on his play, he thinks PK’s one of the top few defencemen in the game today and any manager in the NHL would be willing to part with a lot to get his hands on him.

    So, if his ‘slump’ these last few games is due to a conflict between him and Therrien, and not an injury… well, the Habs management should step in soon and send a message to Therrien by signing PK to a long, valuable contract.

    The future of the team is with Subban and Price on the back end, Gallagher, Eller and Galchenyuk on the front end… honorable mentions to Tinordi, Beaulieu, Emelin and Bournival.

  31. munch17 says:

    Listening to to MT’s interview on RDS and it’s seems pretty clear that he would like to use Chucky at center , possibly between Pacs and Gally.
    He certainly didn’t seem out of place there.
    He’s also reached his limit with DD – I hope we son’t see him at center wtih Eller and Bourque.
    I would love to see Louis get a shot with Eller and Bourque – I thought he handled himself well of late and won some battles deep.
    They must do something with DD – it is clear to everyone that he has no place on this team -I don’t say NHL because I hope that there is on GM out there somewhere that thinks he can help.

  32. Habfan10912 says:

    Good morning all. I kind of dreaded signing on here this morning then I see post from Burly, Habfab, Just ME, Ronn, DM, Matty, Sholi among many others.

    Thanks gentleman!

    • Mattyleg says:

      Good to see ya Jim!

      We lost to the best team in the NHL.
      It was, once again, essentially a one-goal game until the PK mistake (no blame, just a whiff – it happens).

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Morning Jim, we finally have sunshine back here in Southern Ontario, makes for a much easier way to deal with the day after.

      Hopefully all the players fathers still had a good trip, too bad they didn’t get to enjoy a victory.

  33. frontenac1 says:

    Pk had a bad game,it happens. How many freakin open nets did we miss? And Patches shot off the Crossbar? Habs snipers made Jiggy look All Star last night. Saludos!

  34. HabinBurlington says:

    Did anyone catch Cherry’s comments between periods 1 and 2 of the Montreal game? I shouldn’t be surprised but he managed to spew more of his bile and claimed that the reason Downie was traded was because he chirped at that Swedish Captain Landeskog. As usual his comment was meant to innuendo that somehow because Landeskog is Swedish he wasn’t a good captain.

    As usual Ron Mclean just rides along as though everything stated by Cherry is the gospel truth. I know I shouldn’t be surprised, but the Avs are playing great, and by all appearances the choice of Landeskog as Captain appears to have been a great choice.

    • wjc says:

      Its just show biz….not to be taken to heart. Creates a buzz, controversy. You can ignore, but you can’t can you…..mission accomplished. Advertisers are happy, so he is money in the bank. Everybody wins….fans have something to comment about and feel self righteous about…advertisers see sales go up.

      Never will I get used to how well this obvious stuff works so well for everyone. Mclean and Cherry chuckle as they cash their big pay chegues.

      wjc

  35. Maritime Ronn says:

    After last Tuesday’s game, it was mentioned that something just did not appear right with PK and the shitefest began.

    I would imagine that most posting here have played team and/or individual sports to some level.
    At the highest levels, it’s ALL about Confidence, and sometimes that confidence comes through the ‘Trust of Coaching’, and putting players in the toughest positions to excel…as long as the coach actually believes in the player.

    Confidence is huge.
    A buddy or mine scored a bunch or goals in pro and when he went into slumps, he always blamed his stick, his skates, his elbow or shoulder pads….when I asked him why he never blamed himself back then, he answered, ” If I did that, I would have been finished.”
    Confidence.

    Circling back, when a coach avoids putting a player in a position that the player believes he should be part of, perhaps confusion and a slight loss of confidence ‘could’ start surfacing.
    Not good.

    Take the example of Subban riding the pine on the PK and the last minutes in a game.

    Two years ago, the Habs had the 2nd best Penalty Kill Unit in the entire NHL.
    Subban was the #3 guy, and once Hal Gill was traded, he and Gorges were the top PK Unit.
    Now almost nothing…and he rarely gets on the ice in the last 2-3 minutes of a game if the score is tight.

    At the end of the day, none of us really knows what goes on behind the closed doors with all the personalities involved.
    And while Subban’s public persona is one of extreme confidence, no one also knows deep down if that is truly the case today.

    Here’s hoping the past 4-5 games are just a mini funk and nothing more serious.

    • BJ says:

      I was wondering if echoes of he’s “a defensive liability” and Sotchi is in doubt could have him unconsciously take him away from his game? Nothing worse than playing “mentally” he needs to go back to his instincts thats what made him the best last year.

      • Maritime Ronn says:

        Could very well be then add in a coach that does not want to put you out in tougher situations.
        Stuff like that gets around and with assistant coaches like Julien and Hitchcock pushing for the Pietrangelo Bowmeester duo…

    • Old Bald Bird says:

      The stick can be effective when used judiciously. And so can the carrot.

  36. scavanau says:

    I hope soon we can all find a subject to talk about that doesn’t include MT hating/hazing/punishing/ignoring PK.

    Seeing how our next game is against STL, I figure the obnoxious speculating will get worse.

  37. jrs10069 says:

    Listened to P1 cruising home to ottawa from mtl, watched P2 and 3.

    Avs got all the bounces, Habs got none. Easily could have won it.

    PK does look hurt to me, my bet groin, trying to push through it but it’s impacting his speed. Haven’t seen any of the 24CH that is implying that’s MT’s fault but..

    The whole team needs a shooting clinic. Fire the f’n puck at the corners for the love of god.

    Not time to panic, we still have Prust, Emelin and (gulp) Briere coming back. Anyone else?

    jrs10069

  38. mdp2011 says:

    Jacques Martin is going to ruin PK Subban…oh wait. Randy Cunneyworth and Randy Ladouceur are going to ruin PK Subban…oh wait. Michel Therrien is going to ruin…hmm I see a pattern here.

  39. Mattyleg says:

    Just came on here to say that anyone who thinks that PK is crying because his coach pointed out that he made two bad mistakes in a close game is foolish.

    And if you think that PK won’t sign here because of big mean Therrien… well then I feel sorry for you.

    In other words, I noticed that the sun rose today (a bit earlier than usual, perhaps) and that there are still 67 games to play.

    —Hope Springs Eternal—

  40. JUST ME says:

    I joined HIO a few years ago not that long ago. Found that the ambiance was good compared to what we found then on the french side with Gagnon who was then at la Presse and Rds who was…well RDS.

    But since then it has not stopped going in a downward spiral here quality wise and as much as some of you seem to hate everything french, you are acting exactly like them ! Congrats !
    All that crap about Therrien and the supposedly treatment of P.K. ,D.D.Briere,the french factor and what else makes it very unpleasant to come here when actually it was the basic idea to have a place to enjoy talking about my team the Habs. I am not blind and don`t always expect things to be as if in paradise but i really cannot associate with the negativity and sheer inventions people believe are true.

    I know personnaly a few good men (!) that left HIO. The same that got me to join HIO actually and i kept telling them that their presence is sorely missed and that they can make the difference positively wise but now, i think i understand what they went through…Sad but if you guys like it that way , so be it !

    • Mattyleg says:

      Ignore the imbeciles, stay for the good ones, bud.

      There are still a few people who aren’t complete headcases.

      —Hope Springs Eternal—

    • HabFab says:

      I have been coming here since the start but didn’t get involved for the first year and a half. There were idiots in 2006, 2007, 2008 and there will be idiots in 2014… guaranteed.
      As for the “french factor”, it exists and is part of what makes this team. The anglophone fans from outside of or who have never lived in Montreal have a harder time with that, especially when it’s results are less then positive.
      IMHO this site is what you make it… try to ignore the idiots and suffer the fools with the humor they unwittingly supply. A break now and then doesn’t hurt either ;)
      CHeers

    • wjc says:

      JUST ME: Amen, you expressed my sentiments perfectly.

      It all begins at the top, this place sucks the life out of everything.

      wjc

    • formerly known as the hc says:

      Similar experience for me too. I stopped hanging around TSN. Although it is refreshing to be away from the pro-Toronto bias, it is clear that fans are fans. Some are articulate, intelligent, informed, 0thoughtful, entertaining, etc. Others are, well, … I guess it’s time for me to find other ways to waste time.

  41. HabFab says:

    Dave Stubbs –

    On charter home, #Habs did NOT: fire Therrien; trade DD; bag-run players up/down plane’s aisles. Season’s a marathon, folks, not a sprint

  42. Old Bald Bird says:

    MT’s master plan to break PK seems to be working a treat. Eh? :evil:

    BTW, blame him on the MacKinnon goal if you wish, but he simply whiffed on the puck. It happens, especially when they chain you in the doghouse. :cry:

    • Chris says:

      I don’t mind that he whiffed. I mind that his feet were not moving with a dangerous player driving the net. Subban had no idea that an Avalanche player was coming, and that lack of awareness would get any other defender pilloried as well.

  43. HabsLifer says:

    Prediction: Gerald Gallant will replace MT before too long. He’s an Acadian who speaks french (probably chiac). He was an establised Stanley Cup winner as a player and a Memorial Cup champ as head coach. He’s tuff as a coach but has the personality to make players better. As for DD, he does not shoot enough! He has had many opportunities in the last few games and instead of shooting, he elects to pass to his wingers outside the shooting lane. This can be corrected with the proper coaching. Just saying…

    ———————————
    Claude Provost Rocked!

    • HabFab says:

      Gerald Gallant like Nathan Beaulieu and Rene Bourque does not speak French. I understand he is taking lessons since arriving in Montreal.

    • Ncognito says:

      Gerard does not speak French. He is a friend of mine and when he got the job in Montreal I asked him if he learned any French when he played in the “Q” with Sherbrooke, St. Jean and Verdun…and he said that he didn’t.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      If indeed we see a coaching change, I don’t see Gallant taking over. It is very difficult for an Asst. Coach to become the Head Coach on the same team. Often times the Asst. Coach is the go between for the players and head coach, he is often the cheerleader, the buddy of the players who is delivering the Head Coach’s message but doing so in a different manner from the Head coach.

      Add to the fact that indeed Gallant does not speak french fluently this would be eerily similar to the JM / Cunneyworth transition and we saw how that turned out. I like Turk a great deal, and believe he can and will become an NHL head coach, but I just don’t see this transition happening mid season with the Habs.

      • Ncognito says:

        Turk has already been an NHL headcoach with Columbus for 142 games from 03-04 to 06-07. He didn’t have a great team but at least he got some experience. He will never be the headcoach in Montreal, and in all likelihood will get a job with Tampa if he’s let go in Montreal. He and Yzerman are former teammates and very, very good friends.

        • HabinBurlington says:

          That’s right I forgot about the Columbus job, indeed he had little talent on that roster. I agree with your point about probably not getting the Montreal job.

          Thanks for the insight.

          CHeers!

    • theflower says:

      I predict if MT is fired, which i find highly doubtful as I think MB or GM would prefer not to rock the boat again, after just rocking the boat. However if they choose this path, I think a likely candidate….wait for it is Guy Boucher. There are varying opinions about him of course, but he is the only coach in the organisation the last long while that has won a cup of any kind. Many players on the team who played with him loved him. Seems to me this could be an option. I think Guy is a talented guy, and maybe the time away is good as he has a creative hockey mind. I am not suggesting he is the right guy, but he has a big upside and PK and Price flourished under his leadership.

  44. Cal says:

    So, the gist is that PK is playing so poorly because of MT? I guess those who gave no credit to MT for PK’s Norris season aren’t blaming MT now, are they? I mean that would be just a little hypocritical, right?
    By the way, MT benched DD last night, not PK.
    Habs are a bubble team. There are going to be lots of downs to go with those ups, making them a tough team to cheer for.
    Oh, and if you think last night’s game was a poor performance (I know I think it was a stinkeroo by all the players), wait until the Blues deliver a clinic Tuesday night.

    The bright side is that the kids are getting their chance and proving they are inconsistent, just like the Habs vets. They skate fast, though.

  45. HabFab says:

    @sholi – was watching a documentary on the Military Channel last weekend about the Bulge counter attack by the Allies. At one point the Americans attacked at 6 AM and defeated a superior German force due to the surprise effect. The surprise was that, up until then it was SOP for the Americans to attack at 9 AM. Of course, for the rest of the war they varied their times… unreal.

  46. Dunboyne Mike says:

    Scott Matla (EOTP) does a useful summary of the Emery assault. It includes this interesting point:

    “I counted at least ten punches delivered by Emery to the back of Holtby’s head…not one or two TEN. As an avid fan of MMA I have to draw a comparison here…Emery’s actions against Holtby would have gotten him disqualified in an MMA fight and most likely suspended by the sanctioning athletic body.”

    The article:
    http://tinyurl.com/q7l96he

    • HabinBurlington says:

      Deadspin has a link to that brawl from a fans camera with audio. It is the epitomy of how the Fans in Philly would rather watch their team lose 7-0 but have a brawl than win a game 7-0 without having a fight.

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        Thanks Burly.
        Is it too much to hope that fans like that all congregate in Philly? If so, Philly is where NHL headquarters should be. (But I don’t think so, even after what they did to Hickey’s car).

        • wjc says:

          The ‘they’ you speak of was probably one or two people. Philadelphia did not vandalize his car a ‘couple of thugs did’.

          All fans do not boo National athems…..a very, very few individuals do.

          To use the term ‘they’ is to generalize to much. The Emery attack was sickening but it was one person, not the whole team. The truth be known some of the players were appalled.

          wjc

          • Dunboyne Mike says:

            All good points, wjc. And you’re right, “they’ is always a minority.

            The “they” I’m really concerned about is the NHL, precisely because “they” don’t appear to be sickened by what Emery did.

      • scavanau says:

        That is very much a bruins fan mentality as well

  47. theflower says:

    There are two types of coaches in the NHL. Therrion is old school with the nobody is bigger than the team philosophy. This philosophy gets teams that are playing poorly, disciplined and back on track and for a while it can even be successful and then one day, they are just tired of hearing you speak and then the whole thing falls apart. I met a few NHL players who played for a team that changed coaches this past summer and during dinner they told me directly that they basically felt their coach can go f$%k himself as everybody stopped listening. Clearly that style lost the room, it only works so long. Therrion had a superstar already in Sidney Crosby and it ended badly as it took another coach to take them to the promised land. Fast forward to 2013, Roy who learned first hand what it was like to win a cup under Demers “a players coach” then get coached by an idiot Tremblay has learned. He has said to himself, I will be a players coach and fight for my team. His experience has taught him the Tremblay system fails, even more so in the modern generation. Colorado made a smart move hiring Roy and allowing him to coach his way, i don’t know if he could have done that in Montreal anyway as the higher ups may not go along with that. anyway after my long rambling, the point I am trying to make is, I think we are close to seeing Therrion losing the room and that is not going to make the future bright for the Habs. The impact on players like Subban that Therrion has at the moment could be devastating for the future. I am sorry to say if Subban was playing for Colorado, he would be playing endless minutes and growing tremendously. Now, i think at the time he is receiving so much negative influence from his coach that he has tuned him out. It did not worked for Crosby and it wont work for this team and Subban.

    • DadidolizedDougHarvey says:

      I agree. Of course 24CH is a very small slice of Mtl. Canadiens life, but Therrien seems to talk to his players like they are 7 year olds. I don’t watch it often but I remember the scene where Subban is asking Therrien what he wants him (Subban) to do, and Therrien gives his classic “blub-blub-blub-blub” message.
      It is also true that I don’t like Therrien at all, so there’s my bias.

      • theflower says:

        don’t get me wrong, I am not saying I don’t like Therrien, as his coaching style will provide success early on. Many coaches like him can do that. It’s the long run where it fails. Athletes all have personalities and to play at this level, they all have egos. The real challenge for a coach is creating a good system that suits his players and their egos and you will get the most out of them. Many players under this system overachieve, because they are treated as individuals and respected first. Just Ask Demers, Cherry etc. You don’t have to like Don Cherry, but his players loved him and gave everything for him. They lacked the talent of our Habs teams in those days, but still pushed us to the edge. Its all about Man management. Therrien could not get the most out of Sidney Crosby and he should have learned from that because he may not get the most out of PK now. PK has an ego, needs praise as do the rest of the players on the team. It is proven time and time again, praise is the best motivation for any person working under you. Sure criticise when you must, but always finish with praise. When will he learn this. I hope Geoff Molson has a memory to the last superstar we had that walked out on this organisation and if not, history is bound to repeat itself.

    • wjc says:

      Most Montreal players hated ‘Bowman’ and he didn’t care. Many ex players hate him to this day, but talent prevailed.

      You cannot have anyone bigger then the team, no matter who they are. The other players come to resent it, eventually.

      Coaching is a difficult position and as Casey Stangel used to say…you have to keep the 6 guys that love you away from the 6 guys that hate you.

      Try doing the job sometime at any level above 14 year olds and find out the tight rope you walk. Keeping everyone happy is not the goal, results are, and when you get the results, you can be hated by people that just don’t get it.

      Someone comes along and plays nice guy and gets walked on. By then you cannot be the tough guy, so you have to move on.

      You develop a style, you try to be fair, and hope for the best. There are no guarantees you have an excellent chance of failure if players refuse to buy in. Now put big money and big egos in the same room and see how hard it becomes.

      Of course they become skilled at playing the fans and coming off as nice guys, this is learned behavior and the player of course is the hero.

      wjc

      • HabFab says:

        Steve Shutt said “We all hate Scotty for 364 days of the year”
        Reporter “Christmas Day?”
        Shutt “Nope, the day after we win the Stanley Cup”

  48. Chris says:

    It is hard for me to get on Michel Therrien over his handling of P.K. Subban of late when Subban continues to play poorly.

    On all three third-period goals last night, Subban played a part. On MacKinnon’s goal, Subban was coasting back towards the net and pretty clearly had no idea that MacKinnon was steaming through. Budaj gave up a big rebound on a nice low pad shot by Landeskog, and all Subban could do was one-handedly wave his stick at MacKinnon as he scored.

    On the second goal, Subban fumbled the puck for a half-second along the boards, and then made the pass into the net. Everybody else was out of position on that play because Subban simply didn’t do his job.

    On the empty-netter by Parenteau, the puck missed the goal, and Markov was chasing Duchene. Subban had Parenteau all the way up the ice but allowed him to get inside position on the empty net. That one is less of an issue because he was probably dog-tired and only rushed back from pinching in the offensive zone when it became clear that Duchene’s original shot wasn’t going in.

    Throw onto that numerous bumbles in the first two period, and at least two plays on the PP where Subban tried to force a puck through when there was no opening. Markov was very frustrated with Subban a couple of times for not passing the puck when that was the smarter play.

    I don’t know if it is injury or bulking up too much, but Subban looks much slower this season and he’s been handling the puck like a hand grenade at times. If he’s not in the running for Sochi right now it is simply because he is not playing like a Norris Trophy winner. He had a nice first 5 games, but has been extremely ordinary since then.

    My suspicion is that he is simply in a funk. It happens to every player in the league. But can we tone back the rhetoric around Subban until he’s actually earning the increased ice time? Because right now, he isn’t.

    • HabinBurlington says:

      +76

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      The gasoline landing on the fire here is that MT is the cause of PK’s funk. Pure speculation, based on media coverage and interpretation of 24CH, and not without logic but with no foundation actually established so far.

      The league and Emery is a much more disturbing, mile-stone story in my opinion.

      • Chris says:

        I think the funk being due to Therrien is unadulterated BS.

        Subban is labouring out there. If anything, I would cut his ice time, not expand his duties. He’s getting caught all the time by forecheckers, something we didn’t see too much of last season.

        I’m no fan of Therrien’s, but I think this Subban angle is hand-wringing on the part of fans, and nothing else. There are tons of things to criticize Therrien for, but Subban is not one of them right now.

    • Maritime Ronn says:

      While PK has not played exceptionally well lately, to focus on him and say that he played a part in all 3 goals is off base.

      The empty netter that made it 4-1?
      Give the guy a break.

      The Budaj rebound right of MacKinnon’s stick?
      Please

      All Dmen make mistakes, yet when a goalie bails them out there is no highlight.
      Ex: Yesterday’s Hawks-Jets game.
      On one shift, Keith and Seabrook looked like an ECHL paring. Crawford makes some unbelievable saves to bail them out-Hawks come up the ice and score

      • HabinBurlington says:

        I will not speak for Chris, but the gist I think of what he was saying, was related to the constant talk here of how PK is being shortchanged on playing time etc…. Yes he won a Norris last year, and he may indeed be the most talented player on our team, and perhaps one of the most talented Dmen in the entire NHL. But at present he is not playing as great as many believe.

      • Chris says:

        Two things:

        Everybody does this with every other defender…why should Subban be immune? I’ve seen people tear Diaz or Markov or Bouillon apart for miscues on a single goal in a game. Subban made three last night, so I don’t see it as being THAT far off base to call him on it.

        But recall that I did not focus on just the goals. I also commented on his defensive game as a whole and his decision making, both of which were sub-standard last night as well. Subban is simply not playing well right now, something that has persisted for about 2 weeks.

        I’m more than happy to write it off as a funk. But I’m not willing to ignore the fact that his play has been sub-standard. If this were his level for the rest of the season, Subban would not earn a single Norris Trophy vote from anybody but the most out-of-touch sportswriters.

        Is Subban unique in this? Of course not. Erik Karlsson has been very mortal through the early going this season as well. Ryan Suter hasn’t been up to his form of last season either. Marc Staal has been struggling mightily.

    • wjc says:

      Factor in 2 back to back games and fatique becomes a factor, how much ice time is that for P.K. When you are tired the thinking part of the game is effected. Factor in going on the road with little practice time and you can understand perhaps, that things are not always cut and dry.

      The blame game is fine, but sometimes it is just the ebbs and flows of a season. Have you ever worked 12 hour shifts for a few days, how did you feel on the final day. Nothing is cut and dry.

      The players are ‘hero’s to some but they are still human beings playing a high pressure game in front of many critical fans.

      wjc

  49. HabFab says:

    Marc Antoine Godin –

    Therrien a blâmé Subban pour 2 buts: ne pas avoir récupéré le retour de tir sur le 2e but (sévère) et son revirement sur le 3e but (mérité).

    Therrien blamed Subban for two goals. The reporter thought MT was a little severe on the 2nd but PK deserved it on the 3rd goal.

  50. Dunboyne Mike says:

    Hurry up, HabFab. Stop teasing us and post the bit where MT says “We would have won except for PK.”

  51. HabFab says:

    Marc Antoine Godin –

    Therrien: I liked Galchenyuk at center. It was something we had been thinking of for awhile (…) Definitely an experience to repeat.

  52. HabFab says:

    Marc Antoine Godin –

    Therrien: What Desharnais gives us since the beginning of season is not enough. He puts us in a position where we have to make a decision.

  53. HabFab says:

    Election day in the Montreal area so GOOD LUCK to those running and you know who you are!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  54. rhino514 says:

    Why don´t you guys give the coach a break?
    JM would have waited maybe at least half a season before dimishing DD´s role. Therrien is pretty much on the ball.
    Last year everyone was clamouring for Eller to be the number two centre all year; and by the end of the year he was precisely that. Players have to PROVE they either have it or they don´t have it, and that takes time. You don´t ditch your centre after 10 bad games when he has been a consistent producer for 2 and half seasons.
    I´m the first to be happy if indeed Chucky is going to get his shot at centre, but the time on the wing so far has helped him ease into things, and what many don´t understand is that DD is one of the reasons the habs have had the luxury to ease both Eller and chucky into their roles.
    I sincerly hope Chucky is just about ready to take on the responsibilities at centre, but why such harsh criticism at Therrien?
    He brought the team from 15th place to 2nd overall; doesn´t he deserve a certain amount of respect?
    And about Subban; if Subban is a little off; this must be automatically Therrien´s fault?
    I find such comments spectacularly misinformed.

    • SPATS says:

      MT is a hard ass and we are getting to see what he’s really like on 24CH.

      I agree with everything you’ve said here. Young players need a regimented disciplined approach to succeed not a touchy feely kind approach.

      Meritocracy should be the law of the land but instead we have nepotism, cronyism, and their natural offspring – corruption.

      Take a poll of the critics of MT here and you’ll probably find most are entitled gen Y with no strong father figure.

      OOH AAH – ULTRAMAN’S ON THE WARPATH
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sc_kqPcRVIo!

  55. HabFab says:

    Okay, bad night all around for the Habs organization. Habs and Dogs lost, none of the prospects had a good night. Soooooo collectively a deep breath and ommmhhhhhhh! The sun is going to shine.
    CHeers!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  56. habs1992 says:

    2 BIG mistakes from MB, One in DD that is humongus big. And Briere another terrible signing.

    I support Carey Price
    “Habs Insider”

  57. BJ says:

    The next Montreal Canadiens playing his career over the next 10 games is Michel Therrien who may be Bergevin’s worst move along with giving Desharnais that 4 year contract. The way Therrien is handling PK is awful. Something is not right with PK and I think its the Therrien effect. I’m not sure what the solution is re. another coach considering the limitations of hiring a french speaking coach as a pre-requisite. Maybe Guy Boucher who I think had a good working relationship with him?

  58. Dunboyne Mike says:

    MT’s post-game comments don’t seem to be in an obvious place at the canadiens website. Am I looking in the wrong place?

    (Meanwhile, I must say how much I enjoy seeing the Avayam ad over and over in between each video clip. As a result, I am really warming to Avayam. That marketing ploy is really working well on vulnerable old me.)

    • Maritime Ronn says:

      Try rds.ca

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        Thanks MR.
        Nothing volatile there. Unhappy with D but mentioned no names. Seemed pretty direct about DD (although we might ask that if indeed it is the coach’s job to make such decisions, why has this one taken so long?).

    • BJ says:

      That add is making me want to boycott that company if a need ever arises for that service. They could kick in an add every 4 clips but no its after every one.

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        On RDS it’s Subway (which is actually well established here in Ireland). Before every clip?! Companies pay millions to marketing experts with PhDs in psychology in order to understand the human mind. Their conclusion, more often than not, is that we are all cretins.

  59. Huh says:

    Should have hired Pierre McGuire for GM instead…. Oh yeah, only half his name is french… stupid me.

  60. Peter Peter Peter :lol:

    The backup didn’t lose this game, but it’s definitely proof of why you mange the goaltending duties way better than that. Peter Budaj is a great backup, but you have to play him in that role. Pressure games, and high talented teams like the one Patrick Roy inherited is a game that goes to to your #1, and no one else.

    The Habs could have beat that team last night, but they were way too relax in their own end, and that was the story, and the only story. Three little mistakes, and the Avs capitalized. The Habs made Giggy look like a wall, and that wasn’t the story, I never saw one corner picked all night, and until the boys learn to do that well, you know how it is?

    Anyway, the boys will get back on track Tuesday against the Blues…..OK that’s just funny, I’m more afraid of the Blues than I was of the Avs….OK that’s not true either.

    Quote of the night

    Hobie Hansen November 3, 2013 at 1:56 am
    I liked Tony Marinaro for a while there but all of a sudden he’s annoying as some of the posters around here with his constant whining about fighting.

    Shane Oliver
    Twitter @Sholi2000
    http://www.Sholi2000.com
    Custom Sports Figures
    Summit Member 1.29.31.33

  61. Dunboyne Mike says:

    A lot of HIO posters watched the Leafs-Canucks game. Here’s a comment from a Leafs fan at nhl.com:

    “LakeshoreLEAFSFan1 hour ago
    I really hope the CBC loses it’s contract to show NHL games after this season. Their anti-Leafs biases is sickening and they don’t even attempt to hide it either. CBC likes to bite the hand that feeds them, as the Maple Leafs brings in big ratings for the network every week. That’s why Leafs games ALWAYS start at 7pm Eastern, no matter what time zone the Leafs are playing in. And as Hockey Night in Canada is a national broadcast, they are supposed to be impartial. But, as far back as I can remember, CBC always had an anti-Leafs bias.”

    • It’s no secret Mike, I remember years ago talking directly to CBC, and with the population of Leaf fans, it’s the right choice. They’re a business and ads sell the show and as long as those Leaf fans support their team we will see that kind of crap as outsiders every weekend. It’s the number one reason why I switched to Bell and Center Ice…to change the channel.

      Shane Oliver
      Twitter @Sholi2000
      http://www.Sholi2000.com
      Custom Sports Figures
      Summit Member 1.29.31.33

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        Cheers Sholi. (And get back to bed — still the middle of the night in the Peg!).

        Does market research really indicate that there are more Leafs viewers than Habs viewers?

        (To say nothing of arguments about a national broadcaster and its responsibility to all its different regions/nhl markets).

        • :lol:

          I get up every day at or around 4am. It’s what we retired soldiers do. haha

          EDIT- to add, in the infantry we trained for years to get up early so that when the surprise attack came we were already on the line. One thing that hasn’t changed over a few thousand years, is that the enemy still thinks they can win with that tactic. One thing that has changed? We don’t use starlights anymore haha OK that’s another joke that only field soldiers will get.

          Shane Oliver
          Twitter @Sholi2000
          http://www.Sholi2000.com
          Custom Sports Figures
          Summit Member 1.29.31.33

          • Dunboyne Mike says:

            Sholi, my son (18) is 4 weeks into basic as an Air Corps cadet with the Irish Defense Forces. Hearing all about it.

    • Alvin says:

      You guys missed what was being said by the Leafs fan. He was saying that CBC is anti Leafs.Now I’m sure all of us here know that the CBC is so pro Leafs that it sickens us.

      • Dunboyne Mike says:

        Hi Alvin. Well I didn’t miss it, because that’s why I posted it. And I think the post expresses such an outlandish distortion of reality that Sholi went straight past it to comment on why the very opposite of what the poster said is in fact the truth.

        I remain interested in the statistical basis on which the CBC plans its bias….

  62. habs1992 says:

    CUT D.D BEEN SAYING IT FOR YEARS,

    I support Carey Price
    “Habs Insider”

  63. Maritime Ronn says:

    Good morning

    Well the good news in all of this is that Coach Therrien has finally come to his senses and will continue to use 3 NHL centres for the Top 9 in Eller, Plex, and Galchenyuk.
    He stated as much in his post game presser

    Where he decides to use Davy makes no difference.
    Press box, Dallas, or Phoenix would be just fine.
    2 goals in his last 41 games won’t be missed for one of the most tools limited players ever to wear a Habs sweater.

    Perhaps a few years ago Davy filled a need on a 28th place Habs where useless goals and points were accumulated with 2 excellent power forwards.
    That time has now passed and it is time to get out of the way…and to stop handcuffing the coach as to line combos and the linemate needs of 1 specific player.

    • Dunboyne Mike says:

      Welcome back, MR. More shoes in your house?

      • Maritime Ronn says:

        Shoes?

        • Dunboyne Mike says:

          I seem to recall that last time you were gone for a few days, it involved Mrs Maritime, shopping south of the border, a comparison with the wife of a former Philippines president.

          Anyway. Nearly agree about DD. If we’re truly stuck with him, then the last-resort experiment with Patches and Bourque may need another chance or two, although that wasn’t looking good as per line-shuffling last night. The writing is really on the wall. But what, really, to do?

          • Maritime Ronn says:

            Ireland
            this time it was following some buddies in the woods and trying to understand the their thrill of the hunt.I still don’t get it as I have an allergy to guns but the autumn nature was great.With no gadgets during the day the feeling of being cut off took a few days to get used to

          • Dunboyne Mike says:

            Sounds like a conflicted experience (although similar in its predatory nature to the previous expedition…).

            What you missed here was continued speculation and comment on PK and MT.

            It has the potential to be something serious. However, the thing I can’t stop thinking about is Emery and the NHL.

            As I said, welcome back.

  64. Hobie Hansen says:

    If PK Subban actually demanded a trade, which I think is a huge long shot at this point, and the Canadiens didn’t get a king’s ransom back, I would take a break from the Canadiens.

    After the loss to the Sens and the Canadiens going out and signing Danielle Briere, I was close to taking the year off.

    If Subban goes, I would simmer for a few weeks before making a decision but would probably take a few years away from the NHL. I would never cheer for another team.

    I’m already starting to get the impression we’re becoming the Chicago Cubs of the NHL and I might not see a cup again in my lifetime. Subban leaving would almost certainly guarantee it for at least for another 5 years.

    I was just thinking if the season ends badly by the Canadiens missing or getting knocked out of the playoffs in the 1st round that maybe they’ll hire another coach.

    Then I remembered we only hire French coaches for f*&k sakes! Might as well leave Therrien in there because we only have 5% or less of the available coaches out there to choose from. Such BS!

    • JUST ME says:

      I would take a break from the fans. Just read your posts back and notice how friendly and creative you are towards P.K. , towards the frenchies (thanks by the way) towards the coach, and basically towards the whole organizaton.
      And of course you are not going overboard a bit ,not inventing phobias either and not panicking at all.
      Hang on. They will eventually hire more goons and remove those darn goalers masks and players helmet. Real hockey will be back…sigh…

      I f you do not get to see another cup in your lifetime didn`t you just stop and think that this may just be a normal thing since there are 30 teams in the league ? I know you would like to be in the past still but hockey has changed and the 6 teams era is long gone.

  65. VancouverHab says:

    I said when Therrien was hired, and have had cause to repeat it periodically since: “this will end badly.”

    I am now amending that to the following: “this is ending badly.”

    And by “badly” I mean, we are going to lose Subban as we lost Roy.

    (It is at least a cosmic irony that MT finally crosses a public line with his lunatic antagonism for Subban while first coaching–and losing–against the very same Patrick Roy.)

    And as I said also at the hiring, and say again now: “you heard it here first.”

    • Da Hema says:

      Once a fool, always a fool. It’s been said that anyone could coach a team with Sidney Crosby and win the Stanley Cup. Not Therrien. In a way, I feel sorry for the Canadiens’ players who deserve to have a decent coach. I agree with you, my friend.

      If the organization ultimately supports Therrien, I will delete this account on HIO and cheer for every team that plays against the Montreal Canadiens.

      The following is from TSN, dated 5/08/2008:

      “I honestly think their goal is to be the worst defensive team in the league.”

      That quote was taken from Pittsburgh Penguins head coach Michel Therrien on January 10, 2006 after their third straight loss – a 3-1 decision to the Edmonton Oilers. Taking over behind the bench for Ed Olczyk just one month earlier, he wasted no time calling out his players. It was something that is rarely seen in pro sports, and many questioned the tactics at the time.

      “We didn’t like being called out,” Penguins defenceman Rob Scuderi told reporters on the eve of the Eastern Conference Final against the Philadelphia Flyers. “Nobody does. But sometimes, what are you going to do? That’s a decision he made to talk to the media. That’s fine. You can’t ask guys to like it, but at the same time all you can do is play.”

      That scathing remark didn’t do much for the Penguins moving forward, as the team went on to lose another seven games in a row.

      The key difference between then and now is then Therrien challenged the Pittsburgh Penguins’ players without naming any specific player, but now he is calling out specific players. His evolution as a coach is less than inspiring.

      • Maritime Ronn says:

        That outburst by Therrien back then, whether right or wrong, was confirmed as both calculated and a Pens management decision that included the blessing of former GM Patrick and Mario.

    • Hobie Hansen says:

      I don’t think Marc Bergevin is as stupid as Reggie Houle. And I think Subban’s agent knows that the organization would send Michel Therrien packing before Subban.

      If Subban and his agent demanded a trade, I think Bergevin would ask them to hold that thought for a minute, pick up the phone and fire Therrien.

      Next question to Subban and his agent would be who do they like best among the available coaches?

      **edit** I forgot we only hire French coaches, forget it, Subban would probably go in that scenario because of the club’s stupidity.

  66. Hobie Hansen says:

    I hope someone reminds Therrien of the “Roy Vs Tremblay” situation when he deals with Subban, and just how well that worked out for the Canadiens organization.

    Oh, and that’s a tough goal when Landeskog jumps off the bench and gets behind the defence. Can’t blame Murray on that one!

  67. savethepuck says:

    I do not believe I am doing this, explain to me please why Patrick beat us tonight.
    You may also want to check out who my favorite player of all time is , It is Patrick Roy ffs

    “They don’t hang Conference Championship Banners from the rafters here”
    Carey Price

  68. Bob_Sacamano says:

    Therrien blaming Subban is like E. L. James criticising Shakespeare.

  69. Frank2468 says:

    Well the Habs should be 500 by the end of Tuesday night and can’t wait to hear the babbling idiot MT’s post game comments, should make for some comedy relief. Keep going MT your giving Tony Marinaro more ammo on the Montreal Forum weekdays between 10 and noon. I’m waiting for the new montage like the piece from the movie “A Few Good Men” he did with JM lol

    • Hobie Hansen says:

      I liked Tony Marinaro for a while there but all of a sudden he’s annoying as some of the posters around here with his constant whining about fighting. He and Conor McKenna have turned their shows into a little bitch fest about fighting. I guess they don’t listen to the crowd in the building or the player poll where 98% voted to keep fighting in? It would be nice if they were both replaced with real hockey people.

      So when he starts rambling on about how he hates fighting and loves soccer, I usually turn him or McKenna off. If you don’t like fighting, great, but just stop whining about it and ruining the game for everyone.

    • J.Ambrose.OBrien says:

      Tony doesn’t need any more reason to get worked up. The sky is always falling, in his eyes; and the only solution is to listen to him and act rashly. Can only listen to him in small doses.

      I remember Dec. 31, 1975

  70. J.Ambrose.OBrien says:

    Not a comment on Therrien’s PK criticism?

    I remember Dec. 31, 1975

  71. Propwash says:

    Shut the team down and move it to Las Vegas…DO IT BG!!!1

    ____________________
    DOOOOOOOOOOOOMED!

  72. Samovich says:

    MT does not like P.K Subban

  73. The Jackal says:

    First.

    I dedicate this to Timo and will take the opportunity to say that you should all stop drinking the MT hates PK koolaid until further notice.

    ______________________
    Hockey sine stercore tauri.

  74. The Dude says:

    Well that Roy guy who can’t hear cause of all those Stanley Cup rings in his ears sure can Coach,eh…


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